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              <text>TITLE: KAY LAMB&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEW DATE: FEBRUARY 11, 2002&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEW LOCATION: CREHST MUSEUM, RICHLAND, WA&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: UNKNOWN&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWED: KAY LAMB&#13;
&#13;
TRANSCRIBER: JUDY SIMPSON&#13;
&#13;
LENGTH: 20 MINUTES&#13;
&#13;
&#13;
&#13;
KAY:  I arrived in Richland in 1948.  My husband opened the John Ball School in North Richland. I guess &#13;
&#13;
it was at the time General Electric took over and there was more construction going on.  A large trailer park &#13;
&#13;
was built where the business are now in North Richland.  The school opened on February of 1948 and was &#13;
&#13;
open until 1955.&#13;
&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER:   Okay, Kay tell us a little about the difficulties in construction of the John Ball School or &#13;
&#13;
any other funny stories.  Different type of stories about this unique school.&#13;
&#13;
&#13;
KAY: When we arrived, the first phase of the school was there.   There were twelve hutments. Six  &#13;
&#13;
facing on each side facing a wide hall.  There was no planting around there at all.  Nothing but gravel and &#13;
&#13;
sand. The wind would blow.  Some teachers blew right out of town when they encountered their first dust &#13;
&#13;
storm.  The first day of school, I think there were 60 children registered.  On the second day, there were 60 &#13;
&#13;
children. On the third day there were 153 children enrolled.  There were 160 some trailers in the camp. At &#13;
&#13;
the end of that school year they had over 400 children. There was double shifting in order to take of the &#13;
&#13;
children. This, of course, demanded more trailers so they added more Quant-sets, and also a huge Quant-set &#13;
&#13;
which was the cafeteria and auditorium.  They were able to take care of the children in that way. The halls &#13;
&#13;
were nice and wide. Some of the P.E. classes had to be held in the hall.  Some of the Art classes, also were &#13;
&#13;
held in the hall. Art Classes in nice weather were outside on the side of the river.  When the alarms came &#13;
&#13;
for practice drills, the children scampered outside. The children then lay down in a ditch.  This was between&#13;
&#13;
 the schoolhouse and the river. There were many, many funny things that happened there.  All of the&#13;
&#13;
 teachers that were out there said, “That it was a wonderful experience just to have been there under those&#13;
&#13;
 conditions”.&#13;
&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER:  Can you tell us some of the funny things that happened?&#13;
&#13;
&#13;
KAY:  Well, I cannot think of anything right now, but there were lots of funny things that happened. &#13;
&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER:  You will probably remember some as we go along.   &#13;
&#13;
&#13;
KAY: Yes&#13;
&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: Okay, How long was your husband principal at John Ball School?&#13;
&#13;
&#13;
KAY:  My husband was principal for that year, 1948-1949.  From there he went to Spalding’s and was&#13;
&#13;
principal for Spalding’s School. James LaCair followed him as principal, and then he moved to the &#13;
&#13;
Sacajawea School; Winfield Fountain was a popular principal out there.  Eric Sodaburg was the last &#13;
&#13;
principal and the school closed in 1955.  The construction camp was gone, and the buildings there now  &#13;
&#13;
are Battelle‘s.&#13;
&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER:  Some of these Quant-sets were taken out to…..Were they demolished. &#13;
&#13;
&#13;
KAY:  The school is all gone now.&#13;
&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER:  They got rid of all the Quant-sets all together.&#13;
&#13;
&#13;
KAY: Yes, but the trailers were each on 40 feet (foot) lots.  In every square block, there was a washhouse, &#13;
&#13;
shower and bathroom facilities. &#13;
&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER:  Where were the trailers in location to the school?&#13;
&#13;
&#13;
KAY: The school was along the river.  Trailers were all around it.&#13;
&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: All around the school.&#13;
&#13;
&#13;
KAY:  All around the school, yes.  As one of the women I was talking to the other day, she said “They &#13;
&#13;
asked them where they would like to put their trailer, and they said close to the school”. The answer was&#13;
&#13;
“Yes, you and everyone else.”  She said, “The school was on “A” Street and we were on “U” Street.”  &#13;
&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: Okay, you taught at Lewis &amp; Clark.  What year did you start?&#13;
&#13;
&#13;
KAY: Yes, I started teaching in the fall of 1948 at Lewis &amp; Clark.  Lewis &amp; Clark School was close to our &#13;
&#13;
home.  Our children went to school there.  &#13;
&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER:  How big was Lewis &amp; Clark School?&#13;
&#13;
&#13;
KAY:  Lewis &amp; Clark School, I do not remember exactly how large it was.  We had three teachers at each&#13;
&#13;
grade level.  &#13;
&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER:  What was the average number of children you had in a classroom?  What grade level did&#13;
&#13;
you teach.&#13;
&#13;
&#13;
KAY:  I taught the fourth grade.  We had  30 to 35 students in the rooms. The first year I taught, we had a &#13;
&#13;
fire at Lewis &amp; Clark School.  We then had to go into smaller quarters.  I remember, we just had to &#13;
&#13;
crawl over the desks to get around, because I had 35 students.  That was quite a year too.&#13;
&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER:  Now, you taught all subjects then as a fourth grade teacher.  There were no specialists &#13;
&#13;
really at that time.  Did you give a  P.E.?&#13;
&#13;
&#13;
KAY:  Yes, we had boys and girls P.E. classes.  There were two P.E. teachers, one Art, and Music&#13;
 &#13;
teacher. We had all of those plus… a Librarian and a Reading Specialist who helped us with children who &#13;
&#13;
were having problems. That is when I first started, we continued to have that, and improved on it.&#13;
&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER:  Kay has a scrapbook here from the John Ball School.  Kay is going to explain a few &#13;
&#13;
things here in it.  There is a picture, that picture was taken in what year, approximately.&#13;
&#13;
&#13;
KAY:  Oh, it must have been 1948.  This is the faculty.  My husband and the secretary.  And this, of &#13;
&#13;
course, is a picture of the whole area here. Here is the school and these are the trailers. &#13;
&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER:  The trailers went all the way around the school.  Well not all the way around. &#13;
&#13;
&#13;
KAY:  All of these areas, and here is the school.  I guess this is the school right here. &#13;
&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER:  Now this is a shot of when it first opened.&#13;
&#13;
&#13;
KAY: Yes. &#13;
&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER:  How far up North Richland, was the Ball School?  It was beside the river and what &#13;
&#13;
street presently now would it be close to?&#13;
&#13;
&#13;
KAY: I am not familiar enough with that.  It would have been closer to the river than Battelle.  Right across &#13;
&#13;
from Goose Island.   We were there at the time of the flood. That was the Spring of 1948.  &#13;
&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER:  Okay, now this page is special. Okay, go ahead.&#13;
&#13;
&#13;
KAY:  The Art teacher, Janet Baconstine, made these for some occasion we had.  They were on newsprint &#13;
&#13;
and charcoal.  Anyway, this represents the Lambs arriving in Richland in 1948.  Here it shows us getting &#13;
&#13;
settled.  This picture is of the janitor taking the lady teachers to an outhouse, because there was no &#13;
&#13;
plumbing the first few days.       &#13;
&#13;
          &#13;
INTERVIEWER:  John Ball School had no plumbing. &#13;
&#13;
&#13;
KAY:  That is right. When they first opened.  So, the janitor took them out to this abandon outhouse.  Here &#13;
&#13;
the woman is guarding the door, so no workman would come use it while it was occupied.  Then here’s a &#13;
&#13;
picture of us: the wind blowing and the sun shinning on John Ball School.  The teachers often brought their&#13;
&#13;
lunches, so they would get together at noon.  This picture is where one of the teachers is peering in the &#13;
&#13;
closet to get out the food.  This is a picture of the janitor setting in the hall on his cart eating his lunch.&#13;
&#13;
In this picture, the teacher is scurrying to put their food away from lunch as the bell rings for school to take-&#13;
&#13;
up again. At the end of the school year, the teachers gave a party and they gave my husband, presented my &#13;
&#13;
husband with a chair.  I think it was Loretta Roadie, carrying this chair past the office trying to be sure he &#13;
&#13;
did not see it.  &#13;
&#13;
She took it to where they were having the party.  This is the picture of a child during a &#13;
&#13;
dust storm.  Here, they finally got, the heat was coming on, but it was hot and we did not need the heat&#13;
&#13;
anymore.  This is my husband and Ernie Curtis having a coffee break. This is a picture of my husband&#13;
&#13;
at the desk dreaming about the gymnasium and cafeteria they would have. This is Vera Edwards on the &#13;
&#13;
playground, and the dust has come-up and she has lost her P.E. class. Here they are, she and Bill Bressler,&#13;
&#13;
playing ping-pong in the hall.  This is the one I told you about that left during the dust storm.  This is a &#13;
&#13;
picture of the nurse, Ruth Heingardner, when she was ill.  Here is a sign when the cafeteria will open. &#13;
&#13;
Finally, in May.  The drinking fountains, you see, she made a joke of them. This one was a&#13;
&#13;
funny little incident. Here is the janitor wearing a gas mask cleaning-up during a dust storm.  The dust is &#13;
&#13;
coming in the windows.  &#13;
&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER:   Now, did you experience the same problems with dust in Lewis &amp; Clark School? &#13;
&#13;
&#13;
KAY:  Oh no. Not nearly as bad, but we had to put a rag over his face and send him to the basement. You&#13;
&#13;
see there were lots and lots of kids. At that time, there were a thousand kids in that school. &#13;
&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER:  In the John Ball School, a thousand kids.  Now what grades.&#13;
&#13;
&#13;
KAY:  Well, that went through the 8th grade.  Elementary school.  Kindergarten thru 8th grade, until&#13;
&#13;
Carmikel was finished.  Then the 8th grade went….the seventh and eighth graders went.  In 1971 they &#13;
&#13;
moved into the new building.&#13;
&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER:  So, you were there.&#13;
&#13;
&#13;
KAY:  I was there just a half of a semester. We moved in January, and I retired in the Spring.&#13;
&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER:  So you did not get to spend much time in the school.&#13;
&#13;
&#13;
KAY: No, but it was alright with me.  It was a new concept of schools.  They had what they called “Pods”.  &#13;
&#13;
It was all an open area.  &#13;
&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER:  Yea right, things changed in the 1970’s quite a bit in education.  That was the California &#13;
&#13;
attitude that started coming in.&#13;
&#13;
           &#13;
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              <text>Weisskopf: This is the BRMA interview with Mac MacCready at his home in Kennewick, Washington, November 19, 1999.&#13;
MacCready: ...As a consequence, my recovery period, I still was bedridden for quite a while, and so books were something that my mother could give me. Little books in those days, of course. But that got me interested in it. And we had a library that had a children’s area for kids up to 12, and when I was up and around again I went down there and so on, and I continued to do that when I got beyond that in the library. And I got a book, interestingly enough, because it is significant, I don’t remember its name or the author’s name now. But I got a book which talked about the field of chemistry, and a major degree of its presentation of the thing short biographies of some significant people in chemistry, and particularly those in the 1800s, and it was quite fascinating.&#13;
Weisskopf: Was it written for kids?&#13;
MacCready: Hmm?&#13;
Weisskopf: It was sort of written for kids?&#13;
MacCready: No, it wasn’t. This was --- I was about 13 when I came across this, 13 or 14, so it was an upstairs book. But at any rate, it stimulated my interest. So I read some more stuff, and of course it was only a couple years later that I was able to take chemistry in high school. And it happened so that the teacher we had was a guy who had been a professional out working for some of the processors of lead and zinc. There were a lot of mines of that sort in southwest Missouri then. And this, see, was --- well, the mining and milling was moving away from Joplin as they started getting stuff farther away. So this guy had lost his job, and he had hooked on to the high school as a teacher. So, to my mind at least, as I look back on it, he was probably better fitted to teach me well and to keep my interest at a high level.&#13;
Weisskopf: Because he had real-world experience?&#13;
MacCready: Yeah. Yeah. So at any rate, I took the course, and had fun with it, and enjoyed it, and obviously talked with him about it beyond the class. And so as a consequence, then, in my senior year of high school, he let me use the high school laboratory when it was not actually being used for his classes. What I really did, he gave his books, and I did what was the normal lab work for beginning chemistry in college. I got that all done in high school. So it was that --- I had the interest, then I got an opportunity to do some of the things and to learn more and found it still very interesting. So that was it. When I went to the university, at the time, as far as I know, there were two universities in the United States that had specifically set aside chemistry departments with their own names and such like. One of them was Penn State and the other was the University of Alabama. And it happened so that in the normal events of my personal life that I wound up in Alabama’s area, went over and looked at the university in the summer and liked the looks, so that was where I entered school. I didn’t know this, but it was about the infrequency of having separate university entities that were significantly dedicated to chemistry, but I learned that later. So I had a good university and I had a good faculty. And it was, as you might imagine, it was not --- the university had a total population of about 5,000, 5500 then, and as you might imagine, our chemistry department was relatively small. Of course, it didn’t do chemistry work for a whole lot of other than its own people in the general chemistry field, but we had about 120 people that were in there.&#13;
Weisskopf: As chem majors?&#13;
MacCready: Well, yeah, we were enrolled in the School of Chemistry, Metallurgy and Ceramics.&#13;
Weisskopf: That was the formal name of it?&#13;
MacCready: Yes.&#13;
Weisskopf: School of Chemistry, Metallurgy...&#13;
MacCready: And Ceramics. And after the first two years, your focus split. One way, you went to more advanced chemistry the last two years, and if you went the other way, you went into more in-depth education in metallurgy and ceramics. Of course, I went the one way. But with those kinds of associations, see, we had our building, so we saw our professors at times other than just in class, around the halls and such like. In the libraries and so on. So we had a whole lot more attention than you would normally have and that people do now, and it was an excellent education. And it also happened so that it kind of was the avenue which gave me my job, my opportunity to have a job with DuPont.&#13;
Weisskopf: What year did you --- you graduated with a degree in chemistry, then?&#13;
MacCready: I graduated in 1934 with a BS. I stayed on another year and got a master’s degree. I was not feeling the essentiality of having another year at the university, but in the middle part of my senior year I came upon a lady. And since that was, what, four months perhaps until the semester was over and I was graduating, if I was going to eat I had to do something, but I would like to do something that would make it possible to continue to see her. So I talked with the dean about the fact that I would like to stay on and get a master’s degree, but money problems would be noticeable, was there anything he could do about it. And he came up with something. He put together a job for me that would give me about half of the necessary money to go through, and I had to fund. Then in the summertime before I really started on that job. I was there, and I started my master’s work immediately after the spring term was over. And so during that period I did all the business of cleaning up the labs, stocking up and --- &#13;
Weisskopf: That was the job they were paying you for?&#13;
MacCready: That was the job that I wound up doing, was being the guy in charge of all the equipment storage and the material storage and getting it around to the laboratories, and such like. The summer, the last three or four weeks, I did nothing for a 12- or 14-hour day except wash laboratory equipment. I cleaned everything up and got it stacked back where it had to be for the start of the season. I got the --- I think I got 35 cents an hour then, and I made quite a lot of money even at that. So, at any rate, that was what happened. And then because of that, in all honesty, I got the master’s degree.&#13;
Weisskopf: What was the thesis or the theme of your master’s?&#13;
MacCready: We had a professor who had developed an electrolytic method of analysis for iron, steel, and that sort. All of the businesses were trying to get quantitative analyses of things involving iron or steel. None of them --- there were three or four different ones. There were two others particularly that were the most commonly in use, and they depended upon the business of a color change when you got to the end point. And it was, both of them, it was a pretty delicate change, and if the light was just about so, that --- so, at any rate, he felt that there was significant use for this. But in order to have an opportunity to present it in what he felt would be a controlling fashion, he needed to have a lot of work done in terms of doing the kinds of tests to determine quantities and such like that would normally be used using his system and develop a whole cadre of information as to how efficient it was versus these others, time and all that sort of stuff and so on. So that’s what I did, I ran that and the other thing and fiddled around with it. And it turned out to be very effective in terms of the ultimate, when I did my last test and such like, I of course demonstrated to them. And when you can see what you’ve got in the way of results in terms of the color changes versus this thing, which when it hit the thing a needle went off scale. So it was not a tremendous thing in terms of basic chemistry, it was really fundamentally largely a matter of development of instrumentation that was more useful (inaudible), and I was happy to do it.&#13;
Weisskopf: Okay. And that took a year, then, at the college?&#13;
MacCready: Yeah. It meant that I went through and graduated at the normal time in spring or early summer in 1935. And at the time that I graduated, I and a boy that was graduating as a senior, we were the only two from the graduating classes that immediately got a job. The dean had an outfit over in Mississippi that would take us on. Of course, now, this was 1935. Jobs weren’t easy to come by. So I went over and worked there for about two months. Then I learned --- well, my job was pretty straightforward, it was just ordinary chemical testing, really, (inaudible) to process. It was a place that made various kinds of wallboard, and I got to know about the processes, and I got to know about the people and so on. And they had about four or five different segments, each one of which had a supervisor who was in charge of (inaudible) set of equipment, and operators, and so on. And then besides that, then he got the top stairs where you had the manager and assistant manager. So I’d been there about two months. I’d gathered enough information to know something that I thought was significant. They had one guy who was the supervisor of the most difficult of processes, and he was the guy that everybody talked about. He was the guy that just had a phenomenol career, and he was only 27 or 28 years old, and he was making $120 a month. And nobody in history has ever moved so fast or got so much money. So I said huh-uh, there’s no future here. So I did the unspeakable for 1935: I quit. And in the meanwhile, of course, early in the time when I’d got over there, I’d gotten the stupendous application form from DuPont, which had been arranged by the dean, and I filled that out and sent it in, and so on. I proceeded to drive back over to my fiancee’s home to inform her and her parents that I’d quit. And my father-in-law to be understood, because he had done similar things himself. Actually, he had a pretty good in with a local chemistry company there in Anniston, Alabama. And I went down there and got an interview and did get assurance that I could have a job there. I think it was a day or two later that I got this thing in the mail from DuPont to come up for an interview on thus and so day, two or three days later.&#13;
Weisskopf: How far? Were you going back to Wilmington?&#13;
MacCready: The letter came from I think Wilmington, perhaps, or maybe it came from New Jersey, because what I was told was to come up and have --- they gave me all the physical explanations of how to get there, that I was going to be going into Wilmington, and from Wilmington I would cross the river to the dye works plant where I would have my interview. So I did that. As a consequence of that, before I left, I had the job. And also two very positive elements of appreciation for the company. One was that at the close of the thing, when I was to go on, leave, the guy I was interviewing with said “Just a few minutes. I’m having a check made out for you to cover your expenses coming up here and going back home.” I hadn’t thought of that. It helped. The other thing was that, remembering now my experience over in Mississippi, he informed me that I would start at $135 a month.&#13;
Weisskopf: And what had you been making, do you think?&#13;
MacCready: The job that I had over in Mississippi I was making $75 a month. And that guy that was the genius was making $120 a month. Here I was going to start my job at $15 better than him.&#13;
Weisskopf: That’s great.&#13;
MacCready: So that was fine. That set the stage for some very considerable activity. I got home, I got to the soon-to-be parents home, a week later, on a Sunday, my fiancée and I stood in front of her parents’ fireplace, and a minister, and we got married. Thirty minutes later we were on the train to Wilmington.&#13;
Weisskopf: So you had a job and a wife and a new town?&#13;
MacCready: Yeah.&#13;
Weisskopf: Both of you were new to Wilmington?&#13;
MacCready: Oh, yeah. Of course, Wilmington was simply where you got to on the train. Then we had to get over into New Jersey and find a place to live.&#13;
Weisskopf: Why New Jersey?&#13;
MacCready: Because we were going to work at this dye works where I had been interviewed, and they were in New Jersey.&#13;
Weisskopf: And how soon after did you start work? You got married on a Sunday, left on the train the next day?&#13;
MacCready: Yeah. The combination of circumstances, got there, and me and (inaudible) went to work in about two weeks. We had two weeks to find a place to live and get some furniture to put in it, a few other odds and ends. So that was part of the deal. They didn’t give us any extra money for that, but they said that you can have a couple of weeks to kind of get yourself settled in somewhere before you report to work.&#13;
Weisskopf: And that was then in 1935?&#13;
MacCready: Yes.&#13;
Weisskopf: About what time of year, do you think?&#13;
MacCready: That was in, well, October, the fall.&#13;
Weisskopf: Okay. Well, maybe we should fast forward a bit. How about this: At DuPont, did you spend more time in the lab or an office?&#13;
MacCready: No. DuPont, the system that they had, I went in and I went to work in the laboratory that served --- they had Jackson Laboratory there where they did research. And for the people in Jackson Lab, the normal just basic information in the way of running tests and all such in their research, the run-of-the-mill analyses were done in this laboratory that I went to work in. There were about --- there was room for, and it was always one way or another filled up, there were about 30 of us that worked in that laboratory. And one, by the time a year had gone by, one knew that fundamentally they were getting something done that they needed. But this was really a test area. You learned things about the people and determined what they might want to direct them towards, anywhere from going over to the laboratory, their research laboratory, or whatever, whatever, or out the door. And pretty much, at the time I was there, at least, usually you would make a move in not more than a year. I had my interview after I had been there about eight months. And the fellow who ran the lab was more this kind of a person, an analytical person with respect to people than he was a full-time runner of the lab, which was pretty automatic anyway. He says “Well, what do you want to do?” And I said “Well, I always kind of have ideas for research work.” And he said “Well, there’s not anything of that nature that you can get into too logically and too significantly. And,” he said, “there’s some other things that we think you would fit into in our pattern of activities better. So would you accept our belief on that, at least to the extent of trying the job that we propose to give you?” “Sure.” So that resulted in my being given the supervision of a field laboratory. Most all of the individual major elements at the dye works, made this, that and the other, most of them had a field labs to get, you know, routine laboratory work done right on the spot. So I had four guys so that we could --- because since the plant ran 24 hours a day, we needed to cover them 24 hours a day. Four people. I accomplished that with one guy on ....&#13;
(Tape ran out)&#13;
MacCready: So I became a supervisor there. And after six months or so they had an idea, probably came out of the laboratory, that there was a way that they could maybe cut one stop out of the process by which they were making camphor. They needed to get some information about the possibilities of something that in effect was really using --- well, they didn’t know exactly what they would --- they thought that if they could get intimate association of a solvent and this stuff that was coming out of, let’s say, item B in their list of things, that it would permit them to go from B to D and X out C. So I had had a little experience in the university, and at their suggestion that I did know something about that, they got me the stuff that I put together one of these laboratory columns with little glass rings in it which gave you the opportunity to have the effect in a big plant, maybe a column 20 feet long, and I had a column this big around that was three feet along. At any rate, I ran through enough stuff there to get the indication that yes, there was a combination of times and exposures that ought to do the trick. I remember this particularly well, because as a consequence of that, they cobbled together the necessary equipment to, as best they knew how, translate my results into the plant results. And because I had done that, I had the information, you know, about some of the times and some of the indications that you can check on, and so on. So they were going to start a test run one afternoon at four o’clock, and they were going to run the thing 24 hours, and I was to be there all the 24 hours to check at critical points to see if what I thought should have happened in my lifetime was indeed happening, and so on and so on and so on. So we did it that way, and so we went through our 24 hours, and we came out with the fact that yes, it actually worked, did the trick. So that was kind of a nice thing. There was only one minor hitch about it. The four o’clock we started was four o’clock the day before Thanksgiving, so I got home Thanksgiving between four and five o’clock Thanksgiving evening.&#13;
Weisskopf: A memorable one, then, right?&#13;
MacCready: Yeah. But it worked beautifully. That was the only thing, other than the norm of running the system, thing that came along for me. After about a year, year and a half, they were getting on to --- they had started construction on another ethyl chloride plant. They had one. It happened so it was right next door to where my lab was, but I hadn’t spent any time over there. At any rate, I got transferred, along with an old veteran operator who was going to be the general foreman for the plant. And they sent us down there and said “Now, we want you to look after what’s going on in the construction, thinking always in terms of what you all will need best to serve you well in operating the thing.” So we of course learned our chemistry for this thing, and we learned what their plans were, and then we tried to visualize and help in this respect. And I don’t know how good a job we did, but it was the first time I was involved in that, and I certainly learned a lot out of it. A good bit of it, maybe, I learned that you don’t do it the way I had done it, you do it a different way next time. But it happened so that we had a little byproduct outfit we were going to build and run, and so we did the same thing for that. And then we had a --- we thought up and cobbled up a little affair so you can do some more recovery of what was otherwise waste. And then about then we put in a plant to process the sodium sulfate that we got as a byproduct. And if you fixed that up, got it down to sodium sulfate, you could sell that to the paper mill people. So we built that, and we followed that. And by that time, I’d been exposed pretty well to this business of looking at plants with the idea in mind that you’re going to have to operate them.&#13;
Weisskopf: It sounds familiar to me for what comes later, the idea of taking laboratory experience and blowing it up into a large factory.&#13;
MacCready: Right.&#13;
Weisskopf: Interesting.&#13;
MacCready: So, after that --- well, get a little quicker about it. The war period came along, and I got transferred up to the semiworks that they had put in place to learn some of the hows and whys of the processes to make the explosive that wound up ultimately, when it was made and put to use, being the one that they used so effectively in Europe to do --- well, literally, it was this stuff you could wrap a string of it around a railroad --- &#13;
Weisskopf: Oh. Sometimes called plastique, or something like that?&#13;
MacCready: Yeah, uh-huh.&#13;
Weisskopf: Was there a technical term for it?&#13;
MacCready: Oh, it had a technical name.&#13;
Weisskopf: What did you call it at work, other than “the stuff”?&#13;
MacCready: I don’t remember.&#13;
Weisskopf: Was it primarily an explosive, but also the way it could be handled?&#13;
MacCready: Yeah, that was it. It came out in about the consistency of dough. And one of the beautiful things was that literally you could cut a railroad piece in two now, just to cut the grill out a quarter of an inch wide. Well, that was one of the things that the French Underground folks used wonderfully well, tearing up railroads.&#13;
Weisskopf: Okay.&#13;
MacCready: They didn’t tear them up, they just fixed them up so that when the trains went over them, the track tore off.&#13;
Weisskopf: So it did double duty, then, yeah.&#13;
MacCready: Yeah. So I stayed there learning about that. And the way we learned, of course, we were running this little semiworks thing, and they were also starting work on the main plant. So the people were being transferred out, and I wound up being the guy who stayed there and finished shutting up the semiworks.&#13;
Weisskopf: Can you describe, then, the difference between what semiworks was compared to the lab and compared to the ultimate plant that was built?&#13;
MacCready: Okay.&#13;
Weisskopf: It was producing a usable product, or was it not --- &#13;
MacCready: Yes. Yes.&#13;
Weisskopf: It was just shipping out a product?&#13;
MacCready: Yeah. It was making the product, and it was, oh, it was putting out what I would say would be --- well, let’s say that if it operated a shift, it would put out about a tenth as much product as one line in the major plant.&#13;
Weisskopf: One line?&#13;
MacCready: One line, and in that plant I think we had six lines.&#13;
Weisskopf: But it was nonetheless --- &#13;
MacCready: Compared to what, you know, like what I was doing in the laboratory, that would have been maybe 1% of what it would have.&#13;
Weisskopf: How long do you think that semiworks operated?&#13;
MacCready: I think it operated just about a year. I was there about six or seven months.&#13;
Weisskopf: So they must have been building the factory --- &#13;
MacCready: They started, yeah.&#13;
Weisskopf: --- during that year.&#13;
MacCready: That’s right. When I got there, I was there in time to have some association with, say, the last quarter of the construction of the place. And I did some of the same kind of thing with them. And I stayed there for, well, let’s see...in total, I guess I stayed there about eight or ten months.&#13;
Weisskopf: At the semiworks?&#13;
MacCready: No. No, after I left the semiworks. I was at semiworks I think six or seven months, something like that. And then I was about eight months or so at the Wabash (inaudible) which was where this plant was, how this plant was named. And then I came what at the time was a major tragedy. It seems that there was a real significant shortage of supervisory help back at the dye works, and the guy who had that and had the ethyl chloride plant as part of his responsibility had sent out word that he wanted me back. So I came back, and I wasn’t happy.&#13;
Weisskopf: Did that involve a move, living in your house, or were you still living in New Jersey?&#13;
MacCready: No, no, we had left and were living in a house in --- well, actually in Illinois, right across the border. This plant was in Indiana. So, yeah, we --- we had not moved all of our stuff in, because it was that sort a time. At any rate, I came back, and I wasn’t happy. And that was about the first thing I told the man when I got back, that I was not happy, that I didn’t want to --- because what he wanted me to do was to supervise the old ethyl chloride plant, and that I was no longer in the position of feeling my particular interest in or benefit from another turn of supervising the ethyl chloride plant. He said well, we were really at a critical stage, we needed somebody that we know was familiar with that kind of process. But he said “I promise in a year we’ll get you someplace else.” And so far as I know, he was as good as his word, because a year later was when I was transferred to the Manhattan District. And from then, of course, you know, went through the business of going to Oak Ridge, and --- &#13;
Weisskopf: Well, let me ask you this: First of all, what year was it that DuPont asked you to do that? That was in ‘43 still?&#13;
MacCready: To go where?&#13;
Weisskopf: To join that project.&#13;
MacCready: Which one?&#13;
Weisskopf: The Manhattan Project.&#13;
MacCready: That would have been January the 2nd of 1944.&#13;
Weisskopf: Yes, okay. Because you didn’t come out until April of ‘44.&#13;
MacCready: That’s right.&#13;
Weisskopf: Okay. Do you remember how they presented it to you, since it was still kind of top secret and you might have said no?&#13;
MacCready: Yeah, I think there were several of us that reported in at that time, and as I recall we got sat down and got about an hour’s worth of lecture to get the big picture, and then were given documents to get more detail. And I spent a month there reading and attending some meetings when we would get together and talk about things in general.&#13;
Weisskopf: Was this in Wilmington?&#13;
MacCready: Yeah.&#13;
Weisskopf: Okay. So I guess this was when things were rolling right along at Hanford, and you were sort of jumping in in the middle of the process as opposed to the very beginning stages of it.&#13;
MacCready: Well, it’s hard to say, because everything really, in terms of everything except the preparatory work and the whole digging underground, underneath concrete work, only those things had actually occurred by the time I got out here in April.&#13;
Weisskopf: The walls weren’t up?&#13;
MacCready: No. They were just getting above ground level on T when I got out here. So in terms of the business of building of the thing, association with building of the thing, the only thing that had occurred was this basic business of the concrete footings for T. And, of course, similarly for other (inaudible). So what we did in the way of the construction checking, starting then that it really came into detail work about late May. We were getting the place then where we really had to pay attention to what was going on.&#13;
Weisskopf: In your history, you mentioned that there were really only two people sent out from Wilmington to act as construction checkers?&#13;
MacCready: Insofar as the 200 area was concerned, yeah. Ken Millan (phonetic) was sent out in January, I think it was, and then I came in April. This was about the time that things were really getting to the serious part. Ken moved in town to do some things there, and I was --- I was the only one ever beyond that. Ken and me, we were the only ones ever that had the actual situation where we were officially denominated as such and presented to the construction supervision and management as the official consultant.&#13;
Weisskopf: I guess there were similar people in the 100 area?&#13;
MacCready: I assume so, but I do not know.&#13;
Weisskopf: You weren’t supposed to know, right?&#13;
MacCready: Well, there was no reason why I should know, and I had no reason to go there. I didn’t go over there during any of their construction. One of the things that, as I look back, that made what I did easier was because it did officially get presented and accepted by the construction management before they or we were getting to any of this more complicated stuff, so by the time we did, I had been around, and I had been talking with, and we had gotten well acquainted, and I had done enough things that were helpful that I had a platform to work from when I had to get more and more of my nose into things that would otherwise have been the case. And we never had trouble of that sort. I don’t know, another thing maybe that had something to do with it, just as was true of myself and the guys who were ultimately coming out to go through with me and on, become supervisors, we were all young, and so were the supervisors and managers for construction. Let’s see, at the time that I came out, I was 31, and I recall a guy who was in charge for construction of T Plant was 27.&#13;
Weisskopf: And how did that affect your relationship?&#13;
MacCready: Well, I think it was easier for us. We had not, either one, got into any different patterns, so that what we were proposing to have as a pattern here was being asked to do something strange compared to what we had done before. This, I’m sure, was the first job of anything approaching this magnitude that this guy had had. The same thing was true for me.&#13;
Weisskopf: Because you mention in your history that it was an important relationship between the designers and the people who were supervising construction and the crafts people who were actually doing it.&#13;
MacCready: Right.&#13;
Weisskopf: And it was a delicate balance --- &#13;
MacCready: That’s right.&#13;
Weisskopf: --- that you had to interact with.&#13;
MacCready: Yeah.&#13;
Weisskopf: And would you talk to all of them, or would you have a chain of command that you would try to work with?&#13;
MacCready: With respect to the supervision of construction --- well, it sounds a little silly now, in a sense, but it was true, and it’s the way it worked. There were interchanges of information in between my field guys, as we were, you know, things like finishing off all the piping, and so on, in T, and so on. But as they were working on the jobs, they would talk of course with the construction people that were working there at the same time, but there was never any exchange of official knowledge, or orders, or requests or anything that went from us to construction or design or anybody else except through me. That was one thing that I knew when I started.&#13;
Weisskopf: So people who were working for you and with you, they filtered their information or requests through you.&#13;
MacCready: That’s right, yeah. If they thought they saw something that was wrong, they said it to me, and I said it out there. I was sure in my own mind, as things were developing, that that was something that I must set up, that we could have nothing except chaos if I left all of my guys --- &#13;
Weisskopf: Saying it in their own way, their own emphasis, style.&#13;
MacCready: Just God knows who, yeah. So that was a hard and fast rule.&#13;
Weisskopf: And this allowed you to keep track of everything in one place and present it in the same way you presented it the previous time.&#13;
MacCready: Yeah. And it worked fine.&#13;
Weisskopf: And it took the responsibility off the guys working under you --- &#13;
MacCready: Sure.&#13;
Weisskopf: --- not to have to be the bad guy.&#13;
MacCready: That’s right, yeah. They simply could do their looking, and there were some --- as we got into some of the fine stuff, you know, like I think I mentioned all of those multiple lines coming into the cells, actually my counterpart in T early on --- well, not early on, when we got to that, said that we I think better decide to have you send your people in to work with mine on every damn one of these, because they know more about where it has to be, and so on and so on, than our people do, and why they have to be there, because we don’t know that. And I said yes. So we did. In those kind of jobs, the people would work together, and it didn’t matter which they were, they were working together doing it, but there was nothing under --- nothing like any “No, that’s wrong,” or that sort. They were doing it. In that respect, we all depended on our guys and their guys on each one of those jobs doing it right, in other words.&#13;
Weisskopf: Interesting. The tape is almost finished. Should we take a short break, maybe?&#13;
(Short break)&#13;
MacCready: Something that I think is significant in what I did and how I did it. As you know by now, the things, particularly with respect to the Hanford situation in those early days that I was involved with, had great emphasis, or attention to, awareness of, an understanding of, not the processes but the equipment. And very early on, when I got out into the plant at the dye works, more of the things you had to pay attention to, work with to see that they behaved properly, were equipment problems rather than process problems. In other words, let us say this was more chemical engineering than chemistry. I was educated as a chemist. I was not educated as an engineer. But I had a rare opportunity there. The dye works had been in existence for about 20 years, and they had large central shops, and they also had small groups of maintenance, mechanics, in most all of the individual plants. So I had the opportunity, necessarily, to work on those kinds of things in association with these veteran craftsmen who had been through, by then, most of them, 15, 20 years or more of handling the equipment. So I learned my engineering from the craftsmen. And I think it was doubly important. It was important because I learned it at a fundamental level, but it was also important then, and really I think became more important in later years, because as a consequence of that, I think I always had a greater understanding of the interests and attitudes and approaches of the working stiffs.&#13;
Weisskopf: Who actually had to use the equipment, and monitor it, and maintain it.&#13;
MacCready: Right, yeah.&#13;
Weisskopf: Would you say that the chemistry side of things, that you were trained in, was always done in the purely mathematical sense ahead of time, on paper, and then you would try and make it happen in the lab, right?&#13;
MacCready: Yeah.&#13;
Weisskopf: And the closer you got to your mathematical calculations, the more accurate you assumed was your equipment and process.&#13;
MacCready: Yeah. Yeah. And the other thing, too, that certainly was true and certainly grew in my mind, was that in the long run, and all of it, the most important thing was getting it done, and the full cooperation of the people was the only way that could happen.&#13;
Weisskopf: You couldn’t be a snooty chemist back in the lab telling them how to get things done, right?&#13;
MacCready: Yeah. It was easy for me to --- I think that old boy back in Jacksonville lab had taken --- he’d taken his readings, and basically what he was saying and the way he sent me out and told the people out there about me was that he can get things done with people. And as I look back on it, that’s been about it.&#13;
Weisskopf: Just cooperating with the rest of the people involved in the project, and making it happen?&#13;
MacCready: Well, and more particularly the fact that the people in the work force could understand me better than they could an awful lot of their supervisors and managers, and I could watch some of the guys working as supervisors and managers and understand that. They didn’t know how to get along with people. They didn’t know how to make an opportunity for those people to be happy and satisfied.&#13;
Weisskopf: Isn’t it the nature of a chemist, though, to do the elegant work in the lab, have papers that show how it’s all going to work --- &#13;
MacCready: Sure.&#13;
Weisskopf: --- and then get frustrated when they can’t build a factory that actually makes it happen?&#13;
MacCready: I don’t know about that, how they feel about that. They do, though, you know, they have a hard time, getting away from the --- if they are working with other people, highly trained chemists, they probably can get along much better. But the bulk of the people who are doing the job in any field of activity are not --- it’s not at that level. Once you get out of being in a research atmosphere, it’s one of the classic things. Security, of course, was always tight. And after the bomb was --- even before that. And one of the great stories was one evening --- you know, you couldn’t take anything out that wasn’t examined by the guy when you’re leaving the area. And if you had your lunch bucket, or something, you had to show him. And if you had any kind of package, you had to show him. And one of the guys who was in essence in research, working process-wise, was out there, and he had, in addition to his lunch bucket, he had a sack. One of the guys stopped him. He opened up his lunch bucket and showed him, and that was fine, and then started to go, and “No, what’s in the sack?” And I guess that was just enough to irritate him. “Well, look for yourself.” The only trouble was, the window wasn’t open.&#13;
Weisskopf: He threw it through the window?&#13;
MacCready: No. I don’t know, I think he had a jar or something in there, and he broke it and probably spilled some juice or something.&#13;
Weisskopf: And how did security affect your construction checking, when theoretically you were checking all sorts of different processes that maybe some people only knew parts of?&#13;
MacCready: Security didn’t have any --- theirs was strictly a matter of physical situation. Security people didn’t run around anywhere in the --- &#13;
Weisskopf: No. But you still had to follow certain rules and ways of doing things as far as what you could talk about with other workers?&#13;
MacCready: Well, that was something that came from the top early on, when you reported in. Long since, you just didn’t do that.&#13;
Weisskopf: You had to look at plans, right, during this checking process? Blueprints?&#13;
MacCready: Oh, sure.&#13;
Weisskopf: And yet a lot of the people you worked with might not have seen those blueprints, might not know the entire process of the building?&#13;
MacCready: Yeah.&#13;
Weisskopf: But you could just work with them on their one area of concern?&#13;
MacCready: You mean the checkers?&#13;
Weisskopf: Yeah.&#13;
MacCready: The people working for me on the --- &#13;
Weisskopf: Sure.&#13;
MacCready: --- checks? Yeah. Well, see, once we got sizeable activities and really were getting into all of the multitudinous details, that was when I had always the Monday morning get-together, and people were assigned their particular area to look after for that week or until it was finished, and they could report that in. And things were moving so fast that I had those meetings weekly, and people would finish up on one thing and they’d be doing another, and so on. So on that basis, see, they took with them, or they looked at the prints that had to do with that particular area that they were involved with to be --- that was just the way it worked. Of course, all along we had, in the earlier stages, we had lots of time for the people reporting in then to keep burying their nose in the prints. Well, by the same token, the people who were coming in from Oak Ridge had probably spent the last month that they were there with their nose in the prints. So they had a pretty general understanding of things, and you could assign segments to them and they knew how to find the right stuff to look at.&#13;
Weisskopf: Okay. Did the people who worked under you, how much understanding did they have of what, say, one of the canyon buildings was supposed to do?&#13;
MacCready: You mean my --- &#13;
Weisskopf: The actual checkers.&#13;
MacCready: My construction? &#13;
Weisskopf: Yeah.&#13;
MacCready: My construction checkers were people who were going to be supervisors, and they knew the project. They knew the whole process. They did not work in the dark, no.&#13;
Weisskopf: Okay. And one of the critical checking jobs, as I understood it, was checking the piping that would go to all the cells before it got filled up with concrete.&#13;
MacCready: (inaudible).&#13;
Weisskopf: Number one, they couldn’t have blueprints out on the job, could they? How did they check the actual piping against the plan that was needed?&#13;
MacCready: There would be one out there that the construction people were using.&#13;
Weisskopf: Well, the stories I keep hearing is all the plans were locked up and a foreman would have to go in, look at it, take notes, and come back out again. Maybe that was in general.&#13;
MacCready: That was in general, yeah. But for something specific, highly detailed thing like that in a small area, yeah, they would only need one blueprint to do it.&#13;
Weisskopf: Right. Okay. What sort of things would they check? When they’re getting ready to pour concrete, what would be the things they would want to check? Specifically concerning the in-wall piping that went to the cells.&#13;
MacCready: They would want to check each one of those multitudinous lines from where it started to where it went, because they had had to start in the right place and go to the right place.&#13;
Weisskopf: How would they do that, by the way? How do you check and see if the end of the pipe that’s 60 feet over there matches this pipe here? Do you blow through it, or run something through it?&#13;
MacCready: There’s ways of that nature, yeah. I think you would say it would vary. Some of the things would be where you could literally follow them. It may be 60 feet, but it’s 60 feet where you can keep your eyeball on it without too much trouble. And then there would be others, particularly some of the (inaudible) rascals where you would have a hell of a time, but you would pretty much have to follow it physically to be sure. There’s nothing on the print that would assure you about that, it will simply assure you that it’s going from there to there, but they are not going to show, of course, the thing, as you say, if it’s many feet long. So you literally did have to follow them. I suspect, I don’t know all that the kids used, I suspect some of them, they may have run things through, but mostly I think they just physically followed them.&#13;
Weisskopf: And were there fittings and joints that would be imbedded in concrete? Did you pressure check the lines before you poured concrete? Was that part of it?&#13;
MacCready: Yeah. Yeah. They would --- I think they would probably have used a final stage, when they had followed all of them, of having a water run and see to it. Then they could tell when they started there, they were supposed to come out there, and they could see. If it did, then that was --- &#13;
Weisskopf: That would be visual proof.&#13;
MacCready: That was the final check. And, as you say, I think they probably used some pressure testing, shutting them up and loading in 20, 30 pounds of air to get a check.&#13;
Weisskopf: Let me ask you this: You also ran tests just before startup. Do you remember anybody having to tear in the concrete to fix a pipe?&#13;
MacCready: No.&#13;
Weisskopf: Really?&#13;
MacCready: No.&#13;
Weisskopf: Out of all those hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of --- &#13;
MacCready: No. See, they had been checked so many times before then, that no. No, there was never any of that.&#13;
Weisskopf: That surprises me, because, what, each cell had, what, 40-some-odd pipes coming into it?&#13;
MacCready: Yeah, 42 I think it was.&#13;
Weisskopf: And there were 40 cells.&#13;
MacCready: Yeah.&#13;
Weisskopf: And there was pipe also doing the same thing in the pipe trench, there were all the connectors coming into there?&#13;
MacCready: Oh, yeah. Yeah.&#13;
Weisskopf: Boy. Did you find out when the building was done that there were two pipes that had been switched by accident? Did that occur?&#13;
MacCready: Not that late, no. There were some occasions of that sort --- &#13;
Weisskopf: Which construction check --- &#13;
MacCready: --- during the earlier stages of the thing, when construction check found them. Probably the most embarrassing one to the draftsman was one that occurred in T Plant towards the head end. I remember the geography all that closely. But at any rate, there was a pipe up there that was supposed to carry acid from one of the tanks out there operating for --- into something in the head end, and it was an acid of some kind, probably sulfuric acid, at a guess. At any rate, acid of some sort. And the check that was done with respect to that came upon the fact that this line had somehow got itself hooked in so that it was in the line that fed the tank on the stool in the bathroom that was on the front end of the plant. That kind of tore the thing.&#13;
Weisskopf: What would the result have been had it been left? Would the toilet have come out of the pipe or would the acid have headed towards the toilet?&#13;
MacCready: The acid would have headed towards the toilet.&#13;
Weisskopf: That would have been embarrassing.&#13;
MacCready: Yeah.&#13;
Weisskopf: Okay. But the construction checkers discovered that and it was then fixed.&#13;
MacCready: Oh, yes.&#13;
Weisskopf: Which was the whole point of doing the construction checks.&#13;
MacCready: Yeah.&#13;
Weisskopf: So it sounds like the construction checking did its job, found a few problems, ensured that everything was where it was supposed to be. When the plant was ready to start up, you went through a series of testing not just the joints, but flushing and --- &#13;
MacCready: The first thing you did was you had what’s called a water run. In other words, you went through all of the steps that you would go through in processing, but just using water so that you could check for whether it was going where it was supposed to go and when it was supposed to.&#13;
Weisskopf: And was that done under pressure and heat and all the normal things?&#13;
MacCready: No, it was just done --- the only thing was to see that it --- that there were no leaks, and that it was starting from the right place and going to the right place according to what your instrumentation said should be happening.&#13;
Weisskopf: Any idea, off the top of your head, how many individual pipes there might have been in that entire building that would have done individual jobs during the process?&#13;
MacCready: Gee.&#13;
Weisskopf: It would be an astronomical number, I presume.&#13;
MacCready: Yes.&#13;
Weisskopf: Whether it was feeding acid, or moving material, or bringing in steam, electricity.&#13;
MacCready: Or being hitched up to instruments.&#13;
Weisskopf: It might be an impossible question, without really sitting down and counting.&#13;
MacCready: Well, about the only thing I --- I don’t know --- nominally, there of course was as many connections to something or other as there were outputs in the cell. And I don’t know, I’m sure we had some spares in there.&#13;
Weisskopf: Right.&#13;
MacCready: But probably at least half, and I expect maybe closer to three-quarters of them were in service each time that there was a batch going through that particular place.&#13;
Weisskopf: Let me jump ahead to the idea of --- the T Plant worked on the batch process.&#13;
MacCready: Yep.&#13;
Weisskopf: Where you’d start a batch at one end and move it through the process and it came out at the other end, and it would take a day or so to complete.&#13;
MacCready: Yeah.&#13;
Weisskopf: Would you also, I understood, have multiple batches moving down the line at the same time?&#13;
MacCready: Yeah. Yeah.&#13;
Weisskopf: About how many batches might be pushed through in any one day, or might be in the plant at any given moment?&#13;
MacCready: Oh, let’s see.&#13;
Weisskopf: Rough idea?&#13;
MacCready: Yeah. I guess there probably could be half a dozen maybe moving through.&#13;
Weisskopf: Okay. Now, my next question is, what’s the big deal, then, about moving from batch processing to a steady flow process like they use, what, in REDOX?&#13;
MacCready: In REDOX?&#13;
Weisskopf: Yeah. If you’re moving six batches along at a time in T Plant, that sounds pretty efficient to me.&#13;
MacCready: In that respect, yeah. The truth of the matter is that if you get away from the business of the degree of snazzy complexity of chemistry, that you have available the later ones. There wasn’t any real advantage. And, looking back on it and thinking of some of the things that you can do and can’t do in each one of them, it probably would have been smarter all the way around to never have gone away from just running T and B and U if you needed to, actually. But everybody --- those towers and all, and the exchange opportunities to get stuff for going from the one zone into the other, and suchlike, was very heady chemistry indeed, and very snazzy equipment. Like I think I said before, that was pretty much old-fashioned nuts and bolts kind of work that was going on in T, but it worked. And there is a great advantage always in processing when you expect, you know, you want to keep putting out product all the time, there’s an awful lot of solace if you’ve got steps so that you can do some switching around. For instance, you could run, say, in T Plant, and you got to the process in some cell halfway down the line, and there’s a leak or there’s something or other, and you’re stuck there. But, see, T was built, all of them were, so that you had --- each kind of processing you had three or four duplicate cells. You know, they didn’t --- it only went through about a quarter of those cells. So if you had something of that sort, you could certainly, and we did a few times, you could stop at that stage and haul the stuff out of there and transfer it over to a similar cell someplace else where whatever was troubling you there wouldn’t trouble you again. If you have that kind of equipment problem comes up with the columns, when that happens, she’s all down.&#13;
Weisskopf: That’s it?&#13;
MacCready: Yeah.&#13;
Weisskopf: Everything at the front of the process has to wait until the part at the end of the process gets out.&#13;
MacCready: That’s right, yeah. Because it’s all going through the same.....&#13;
[tape ran out]&#13;
MacCready: That’s not to say that you couldn’t build a plant of that nature and do that and have that duplication.&#13;
Weisskopf: Right.&#13;
MacCready: But the doing of it would mean that the duplication would be something that would cost you many times as much as it would have in the relatively simple T Plant approach.&#13;
Weisskopf: Yeah. What’s the opposite of batch processing? What was it called, that REDOX and PUREX, their word for it? I can’t remember what it is. But it’s continuous.&#13;
MacCready: Continuous processing, yes. And there’s things you can do on continuous processing that of course are not possible with the kind of plants that they have. When I was running the ethyl chloride plant, that, the one that I started with, the new one, it was a continuous process plant. And there are lots of things that you can do in a continuous process plant to coggle (phonetic) up problems without shutting down.&#13;
Weisskopf: Right. You learn real fast probably.&#13;
MacCready: Yeah. See, your hands on, you can do things to the equipment. You can’t do that with the radioactive stuff.&#13;
Weisskopf: Okay.&#13;
MacCready: Now, I can remember, we had two-story-long glass separation systems in the ethyl chloride plant, and once in a while there would be a problem with something. One of the things that most happened would be one of the damn rubber washers would start leaking. We ran the thing in a fashion where the ethyl chloride went through, after it was made, it went through as a gas. We had a pump system, a big pump system that pulled it out and compressed enough then to make it a liquid, and we would keep that liquid in the storage tanks. But because of that, because we had that system, we could kick the compressor up a little bit and we could actually jack one of those segments up an inch or so and snatch out that messed up gasket, put a new one in, and set the thing back down, or put it up. Now, that didn’t work perfectly, because some of the ethyl chloride would come out in the process while we were there, but it was not a problem. You tended to be a little bit drunk when it was over, but that was all. Well, things of that sort we could do. One time we had multiple generators of gas, two of them, and we had pumps there that were moving the stuff. And since what we were moving was hydrochloric acid gas, which is very corrosive, it was always held with pumps that picked it up and pumped it over to go through the rest of the process. So we were forever having this kind of leak here, there and yonder. And to make it doubly troublesome, because of the kind of thing that it was, we used a type of pump that used sulfuric acid as the thing that moved the stuff. So we had to feed it with sulfuric acid. And that was one of the things that was always bitched about, is that you maybe get a leak in that damn sulfuric acid line. Everything else would be running nice, and there this thing would mess you up. Well, we had an acid resistant putty, and you could usually wrap up the piece of pipe, it almost always happened in a joint, you know, pipe was going into a fixture, and you could usually put some of that stuff around there and some tape over it, and then go on, and you wouldn’t have to shut down. I remember one time we got to a place where we had some basic problem and we had to shut down, and we had had a leak on one of those sulfuric acid lines, had puttied it up to see to it that it didn’t leak. While we were down, we were going to take that stuff off and put in their pipe. And when we took it over, we had a wound up place where we had a putty thing, it was about this big all the way around. When we opened it up, there was two inches in there, but there wasn’t anything but putty that was running through. All the metal was gone.&#13;
Weisskopf: Wow. And this was the kind of thing you couldn’t do in one of the cells.&#13;
MacCready: No. You can’t do anything in that.&#13;
Weisskopf: Instead of a 10-minute job, it would be a day and a half to take equipment out, and get new equipment and put it in.&#13;
MacCready: That’s right. So the business, really, of getting through and getting plutonium out, at any time, certainly the business of getting the simplest and the most simplest approach and one that you could put in lots of duplication to go from a piece of equipment that’s not working and so on, that is by all --- and using as simple chemistry that you possibly could, all of those things were in mine, all of those things were superbly met by what they did. So I think that it was not only good in that respect, I think that after the experience that we had had with the later plants, in all honesty, if I were having to make the damn stuff to make a living, I’d use the T Plant.&#13;
Weisskopf: Simple, basic batch process.&#13;
MacCready: Yeah.&#13;
Weisskopf: Duplicatible. Flexible.&#13;
MacCready: So that you could be very damn sure, really, that you were going to get at the end of the month what you needed to get, because if one didn’t work, you could use a duplicate, and so on and so on. And you can’t beat that kind of backup.&#13;
Weisskopf: Right. Right. It worked well. So in other words, if one batch took a day to get through, but you could have six batches going at the same time at different phases of the process --- &#13;
MacCready: Yeah.&#13;
Weisskopf: --- so in any given day you might have processed six tons, or whatever a batch was, of uranium.&#13;
MacCready: Now, let’s see...&#13;
Weisskopf: Was it that simple?&#13;
MacCready: No, it can’t quite be. Because you have to start off with a batch, see, by dissolving the slugs. And dissolving a batch of those things, it took at least nine hours, maybe more than that.&#13;
Weisskopf: So that was one limiting factor to how many batches you could run.&#13;
MacCready: Yes.&#13;
Weisskopf: The other processes might go quickly, but --- &#13;
MacCready: Yeah, many of those others would go rather quickly.&#13;
Weisskopf: So in any 24-hour period, you might be able to dissolve three batches at the most.&#13;
MacCready: At the most, I would say, yeah.&#13;
Weisskopf: Okay.&#13;
MacCready: And I don’t think that we routinely ever tried to do that. I think we probably did do it on occasion, but generally speaking our capacity in T was such that at the time, just the first three reactors, that whatever we wanted to do, we could do it faster than they could. We would have time when there wasn’t any uranium there to --- &#13;
Weisskopf: That was using two of the plants, though, U and B Plant, T and B.&#13;
MacCready: That certainly is true. No question about it, yeah. I’m not sure whether we could have get ahead of them with one.&#13;
Weisskopf: But with two, it was no problem.&#13;
MacCready: Two, it was no problem. We were, as you say, frequently without materials to dissolve.&#13;
Weisskopf: In the early phases, or even later on, as you got more efficient?&#13;
MacCready: Let’s see, I’m trying to...&#13;
Weisskopf: But you guys weren’t the bottleneck.&#13;
MacCready: No. No, because, see, we never used more than T and B for this, and that went through handling everything except maybe the last reactor that they had.&#13;
Weisskopf: Oh, that included DR Reactor, and then H? That was in the late forties, wasn’t it?&#13;
MacCready: Yeah. Everything --- &#13;
Weisskopf: And then C Reactor came in the early fifties.&#13;
MacCready: Yeah.&#13;
Weisskopf: And that’s about when REDOX started, was early ‘51 or ‘2?&#13;
MacCready: Yeah. Yeah.&#13;
Weisskopf: So two plants were handling not just three reactors, but four, and then five, and then possibly six reactors.&#13;
MacCready: Yeah.&#13;
Weisskopf: Because you were getting more efficient and better at it, too.&#13;
MacCready: Well, or maybe we just had that much basic capacity. It wasn’t, you know, when you stop and think about it, not too much as long as you could --- as long as you could handle the stuff dissolving, there was very little likelihood you would get hung up for any significant time, because if you got a hang-up, you’d just switch to a sister cell of the same type. Maybe lose an hour or two, but that’s about all. It was an awfully flexible system, really.&#13;
Weisskopf: And you said for one given process you only used maybe 25% of the cells?&#13;
MacCready: I would say so, yes.&#13;
Weisskopf: Less than half.&#13;
MacCready: Yeah.&#13;
Weisskopf: Let me ask you this, just to kind of change gears. If this had not been radioactive --- that had been my earlier question. It was basic chemistry. If the material hadn’t been radioactive, it would have been just another ethyl chloride factory, in a sense --- &#13;
MacCready: Yeah.&#13;
Weisskopf: --- as far as the equipment and --- &#13;
MacCready: As a matter of fact, it would have been a simpler plant.&#13;
Weisskopf: Okay. You were only using a quarter of the cells, which means if the equipment had not been in cells, it would have taken up maybe a hundred feet of factory floor, something like that?&#13;
MacCready: Oh, be generous, give them two hundred feet.&#13;
Weisskopf: Okay. A quarter of the length of the building.&#13;
MacCready: Yeah.&#13;
Weisskopf: And that’s with plenty of room for getting in and working on it and everything else.&#13;
MacCready: Yeah, if you could get in --- in the first place, if you could get in and work on it, it wasn’t that kind of thing, you wouldn’t have all these walls in between.&#13;
Weisskopf: Right. Right. It would just be on one long factory floor.&#13;
MacCready: That’s right.&#13;
Weisskopf: And with workmen going around with oil cans, and turning valves, and everything else.&#13;
MacCready: Yeah. It would have been an awful lot like that old ethyl chloride plant, which was basically a batch process. It had a whole bunch of tanks that it used.&#13;
Weisskopf: And if you had been designing this factory, or working with DuPont to design it not radioactive, that would have been one line.&#13;
MacCready: Yeah.&#13;
Weisskopf: You would have had --- one line was equivalent to the entire T Plant, how many lines might you have built? You could have built as many as you wanted, right?&#13;
MacCready: Yeah, you could have. But if you had an ordinary plant of the kind that I’m familiar with, like the ethyl chloride plants, or the camphor plants, or the TL Plants, or we had a plant that made sulfuric acid. Generally speaking, if you built a plant that had the capacity to take care of the indicated market that they foresaw, you would just build the one plant.&#13;
Weisskopf: And maybe make the building a little bit bigger so in the future you could throw in another line.&#13;
MacCready: That’s right.&#13;
Weisskopf: Okay. And, as you were saying, two lines would have been kind of enough. U and B Plant with like two lines would have been enough to handle the reactors --- &#13;
MacCready: Would have handled it.&#13;
Weisskopf: --- for the first five, six, eight years.&#13;
MacCready: Yeah, it would have.&#13;
Weisskopf: And you could have done away with all the duplication and flexibility.&#13;
MacCready: That’s right.&#13;
Weisskopf: It would have been a lot simpler.&#13;
MacCready: It would have been, yeah. Because you can be --- there were more things to hold you up timewise in that first ethyl chloride plant that I ran than you would have in this kind of a process if it weren’t for the radioactivity. And after the first year, when we got all of the bugs out, and such like, that one plant ran 94.6% of the time for the year.&#13;
Weisskopf: Which plant was this you’re referring to?&#13;
MacCready: This ethyl chloride plant.&#13;
Weisskopf: The first one? The batch one?&#13;
MacCready: No.&#13;
Weisskopf: The newer one.&#13;
MacCready: The newer one. Which had many more ways to have trouble, the major thing being that it was handling very corrosive materials all the time, which always gives you problems.&#13;
Weisskopf: How did that compare with T Plant and B Plant as far as their operation time the first year?&#13;
MacCready: Well, fundamentally they ran 100% of the time, because they had the wherewithal. And when you got these spreaders around, you don’t have to stop.&#13;
Weisskopf: The process could keep going while you would go about fixing the problem earlier on.&#13;
MacCready: Yeah.&#13;
Weisskopf: Okay. Maybe you could help me with one --- I’d like to ask you about the equipment that was used. But maybe before we finish, because you’re probably getting tired, too --- &#13;
MacCready: Yeah.&#13;
Weisskopf: The precipitator, the big tank, had a column on top, that was part of the process. Not the dissolver, but when you would put in the bismuth phosphate, and you’d agitate it in a big tank, and it a column, 2-foot by 12-foot column on top.&#13;
MacCready: I don’t remember, really.&#13;
Weisskopf: I can bring you a picture next time, maybe it will ring a bell.&#13;
MacCready: Yeah.&#13;
Weisskopf: I’m not enough of a chemist by any means to understand when you precipitate out something, physically what kind of equipment --- I’ve seen it done in a lab, just by stirring up a beaker, right?&#13;
MacCready: Yeah. Well, I don’t remember what it might be. The basic means of separating the solid from the liquid --- &#13;
Weisskopf: I think I was wrong, too. What I was talking about was the dissolver. It had a column?&#13;
MacCready: Oh, yeah.&#13;
Weisskopf: It did.&#13;
MacCready:  Yes.&#13;
Weisskopf: For some reason or other, it’s still not in my mind why --- who cares if the dissolver has a column in it, if all you’re doing is dissolving stuff in acid. So it had a 12-foot tall column.&#13;
MacCready: Yeah.&#13;
Weisskopf: Okay. Please explain that to me.&#13;
MacCready: Well, that, of course, is the dissolution business leads to a certain amount of gas, acid, acidic gas being emitted, and that had to be caught and controlled, and that was what the column was for.&#13;
Weisskopf: Was it like a still, where it would liquefy and drip back down again?&#13;
MacCready: Well, it would --- I’ve forgotten the details. But I would guess, yeah, we probably had the means of, as the stuff’s coming up there, showering it a little bit and hitting it back down.&#13;
Weisskopf: Why didn’t you just pressure cook it? Why didn’t you just crank the valves shut and let the acid dissolve it under pressure? Where would the gas have gone then?&#13;
MacCready: Well, it would have gone down, along with the material.&#13;
Weisskopf: Oh. Yeah. Okay.&#13;
MacCready: And that you would prefer not to have happen. See, it takes pretty strong acid to dissolve that stuff up. I’m sure that this was simply a matter of seeing to it that they did not let that get away.&#13;
Weisskopf: Okay. I didn’t understand that. Are you about out of words at this point?&#13;
MacCready: I think about.&#13;
- END -&#13;
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              <text>Richland Public Library, Richland, WA</text>
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        <element elementId="5">
          <name>Transcription</name>
          <description>Any written text transcribed from a sound</description>
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            <elementText elementTextId="41258">
              <text>Interview of G.C. Blackburn&#13;
on audio tape (not video)&#13;
at the Richland, WA, Public Library&#13;
November 17, 1999&#13;
by Gene Weisskopf, BRMA&#13;
&#13;
&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Today is November 17, 1999, and we're with G.C. Blackburn. And please tell me what the G and the C stand for.&#13;
BLACKBURN: Gardner Clark Blackburn.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: People knew you as G.C.?&#13;
BLACKBURN: G.C. Part of the time I was called Blackie. I worked on the Mississippi River on the dams, and I used to work for, when I was a regular carpenter, I worked for a boss. They called him Whitey. Because I was Whitey before. So then they called him Whitey, I had to be called Blackie.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: And why did they call you Whitey?&#13;
BLACKBURN: I don't know. My hair was always light, light-colored, and I guess that's probably why.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: What projects were you working on in the Mississippi?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Well, I worked on two different dams as a carpenter, and then I worked for DuPont. We built a plant in Ioway *(phonetic--is he saying Iowa?), and that's why I knew --- of course, DuPont was the same thing down in Oklahoma. I worked down in Oklahoma there. We made stuff for the war.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: And you were working for DuPont at that point?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Yes.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: And doing construction?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Right. I was sort of a layout carpenter down there. I didn't have to go out in the mud and the water. I worked out of the main building.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: So where were you in 1943 when DuPont wanted to send you out here?&#13;
BLACKBURN: When they found me, I was business agent for the carpenters in --- gosh...&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Were you working on a project?&#13;
BLACKBURN: No. I had a regular office and everything. When I got a call from Oklahoma job from my business agent in Savanna, Illinois, wanting to know if I wanted his job. And I said "Well, it's close to home, my family's there and everything," so I quit that job and come back up there. And he retired, and I got elected by full vote. So I was there about two years or so, maybe three, and this recruiter come along for this job out here. And he said "I'm looking for carpenters." He said, "And by the way, maybe you want to go out." And I said I would as a foreman, but not as a carpenter. So he said "Well, we need foremen, too." So I had three carpenters that come out with me. I drove out here from there. I didn't ever see the West like this before. And we got out here.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: And about what time was that? In October?&#13;
BLACKBURN: That was about the last --- in the last three days of October, I think it was.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Now, you said you had a family. They were still back in --- &#13;
BLACKBURN: They were still back there, because I had bought a house in Savanna.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Savanna, Illinois.&#13;
BLACKBURN: Yeah. So they stayed there, and I come out here. And the first thing they said to me when I got to their office the next morning was I'd have to work with my tools for a week before I could... And I said, "Well, who's the manager?" And they told me, and I said "Well, by God, I know him. I better go see him." I went and seen him, and he said --- shook hands, and he said that --- he was the top dog at the Oklahoma job when I was there, so he knew me from there. And I told him, I said "Somebody's wanting me to work with my tools." He said "You don't have to work with your tools, you've been in DuPont too long, you know all their safeties and all that." &#13;
WEISSKOPF: Do you remember his name?&#13;
BLACKBURN: I can't --- there's a lot of names I can remember.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: What was he in charge of at Hanford?&#13;
BLACKBURN: All the carpenter work. All the carpenter construction.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Okay. So instead of picking up your tools, you were a foreman.&#13;
BLACKBURN: Yeah, I was a foreman right off the bat. He gave me, oh, about fifteen guys and three or four helpers. And the first day I worked right in Hanford. We were building the places to eat, and stuff like that, you know.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: In the construction camp?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Yeah. And before the day was out, why, a guy come around to me and said "I understand that you're a heavy construction worker." I said that's all --- I knew more of that than I did this kind of work. So he said "You pick out about five of your best men, and tomorrow morning hit the bus to the area, West area." So I did, and I got out there, and they had me another 15 carpenters, and I had 20 carpenters, and about 8 helpers. And T Plant was just a big hole in the ground. A big hole in the ground.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Had they even started pouring concrete yet?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Seems to me that there had been a little concrete poured in the basement.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: I think one of the things I read was that they started it well before then, but very little work was done --- &#13;
BLACKBURN: Yeah, very little.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: --- because the reactors were getting a lot of the materials --- &#13;
BLACKBURN: Well, they were getting attention.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Yeah.&#13;
BLACKBURN: Also, they were making blueprints in Chicago, and we got new blueprints about every day.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Revised, or just more of them?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Well, some of them were revised, some of them were --- as we went along, that's the way it worked.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: But every day did you have some specific part of the project that there were blueprints --- &#13;
BLACKBURN: Oh, yes.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: --- and it was laid out?&#13;
BLACKBURN: I was foreman over the 224 and 221, both carpenter crews. There was probably about five at that time, in the plant there were about five, or maybe four, carpenter foremen, and each one of them had a crew there. So we put that building up pretty fast.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: And I guess was a lot of the work just doing concrete forming?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Most of it was forming and stuff. Like I said about our blueprints, they had the blueprints all in a little house, and we could come in, the foremen could come in there and get out the blueprint and take measurements and all that different stuff, and put that on a piece of paper and go out again. But we couldn't take the blueprints out.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: How many times a day would you have to go back in there?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Oh, about twice, I guess.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: That's all?&#13;
BLACKBURN: At noon, morning and noon.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: And you were able to take enough notes that could --- &#13;
BLACKBURN: Oh, yes.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: How was that different from a regular job? How might you deal with blueprints on a regular job?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Well, we could carry the blueprints when I worked in Oklahoma, and stuff like that.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Wouldn't you be referring to them many, many times a day?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Probably quite a bit. Especially on some certain jobs.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: So how were you able at Hanford just to look at this huge set of plans twice a day?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Well, it was such a large job. And when you put in one deal for concrete, why, it took piles of concrete to fill that up.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: So you said "We have to make this set of forms this morning," it might be 500 feet long, or something like that?&#13;
BLACKBURN: We made an awful big plan, and used the big rigs. And at the same time we were building that one, why, we were building the 24. And I had men in each place.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: What did they tell you the building was going to be?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Nothing, at that time. All we had to do was guess, because we had so much concrete.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: You were starting to get a feel for how big it was?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Oh, yeah. Gene, it was a big one. And I knew it had to be some explosive, but I didn't know what kind.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: It was DuPont, and it was the war.&#13;
BLACKBURN: See, I was a carpenter on the plant in Savanna, about six miles out of Savanna, where we made the regular bombs and everything like that, so I got to see how they were made, and packed, and painted, and everything like that pretty well, because I was up there during that time.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Were you surprised at how thick the walls were?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Oh, God, yes. On the dams, we had walls, oh, a foot and a half, two foot thick, and got out here and run into six foot, seven foot walls, so I knew something had to be an explosive. But they --- we never said anything. We didn't dare tell our families, or anything like that, what was going on.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: When you were forming up, say, walls, and you started from the bottom and you realized they were seven feet thick, did you form them all the way up, or what was the work --- &#13;
BLACKBURN: Well, you formed one set about, oh, around 18 foot high, and then you poured concrete there, and then you went from --- you'd pull the vans* up, and you go up, keep going up.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: And the rebar would continue on up?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Oh, yes.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: So you started well below grade, then, right?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Oh, we were right --- a big hole. A big hole. I'm just guessing now that the hole itself was 35, 40 foot deep. It was pretty --- they put a (inaudible)* in the bottom of it. Because that had to be deep concrete underneath the cells in there, you know, and the cells are all down under the ground.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Were they calling them cells at the time, when you were forming up all these components?&#13;
BLACKBURN: I don't know what we called them.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Because, on the one hand, it makes it real easy if everybody refers to everything in the same way, but if they're not allowed to tell you what the real name is, then everybody might end up using a different name.&#13;
BLACKBURN: Using everything. That's right.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: So you were working with rebar inside the walls, but at some point as you got up there was a lot of piping, too.&#13;
BLACKBURN: Oh, yes.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: And were you dealing with that with your forming?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Carpenters didn't deal with piping. There were piping people that was putting in there before we poured concrete.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: But who was cutting holes in the form and making sure the holes were in the --- &#13;
BLACKBURN: We cut holes in the forms and stuff.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Was that pretty straightforward?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Some of the same forms we could use for a lot of different cells. See, really, 221 was built, well, in a way a little bit sloppy, but each cell was pretty much the same as the other.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Right.&#13;
BLACKBURN: Until you got down to where we brought in the metal, and stuff like that. (Inaudible)* and stuff like that down there. And then, of course, we had to build a track. Tracks come in the --- &#13;
WEISSKOPF: For the train?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Yeah. I guess you could call the east end, the east end of T Plant, I guess. And the tanks and a lot of all the equipment practically come into the deal through the railroad and through where we put the dissolvers afterwards. Big tanks. There was no way of putting them in through the doors. I had two guys for several months, all they done is build the entrance to the canyon. And after the first months using the blueprints, after that we didn't need a blueprint, we knew just what they were doing. They were all the same, and along about every hundred feet we put an entry into it. And the entry was a level at the top of the settles. So everything from there was down under the ground, see.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: And the entries you're talking about were on the smokestack side of the building, that went into the canyon itself?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Entries were all on the --- let's see. That was east, that would be on the south side.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Southeast side?&#13;
BLACKBURN: South, yeah, of the canyon, the whole length.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: And on the other side of the canyon, the long side, the gallery side --- &#13;
BLACKBURN: That's right, the gallery.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: They had their own entrances.&#13;
BLACKBURN: Oh, yeah. We had the offices, all that on that side.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: On the entrances that went into the canyon, do you remember how those were built up?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Well, they started out like this. And we put steps up to here, and then we put steps this way, and then we put steps into the canyon, and that's where the doors were.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: And those were also thick walls.&#13;
BLACKBURN: So that anything from inside would not affect the outside at all, the radiation or anything.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Was the door anything special? Did you ever see the door? Were you around for that?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Them doors, it's just heavy wood, stuff like that. They were thick and heavy, I remember that.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Back to the building of the forms for a 7 foot wall is in itself no big deal. But do you remember how precise they asked you to make the forming?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Oh, the forming, they wanted it just as close as possible. The forms inside, and then they made all the covers for the cells outside. That was a different game.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: I've seen pictures of that. But you were forming up the cells themselves?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Oh, yes, on the cells themselves. And we had to have them just almost perfect according to the engineers in order for these big tops to fit in just right, see.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: As a matter of comparison, what were your tolerances on other jobs for DuPont, when you were just building a normal type of a factory?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Well, probably half, three-quarters of an inch on a lot of work. But this one here, we tried to be underneath the half-inch.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: And when you were forming the cells, did they have metal forms or premade forms?&#13;
BLACKBURN: We had premade forms that stuck in there. I can't remember what they were made of. I think they were metal. We used them in every cell, the same ones, just moved on down the cells.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Did they have the holes for all the fittings that came into the cells?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Yeah. There, we put in plugs, what we called plugs, and they had to go through the concrete. And some of them come from the other cells, and some of them come in there up where we added chemicals and stuff down through there. And electrical deals, to put electric lines and like that, a lot of that stuff in there.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Were you there when they poured concrete?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Oh, yes.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: So you were there from building the forms and taking the forms down later on.&#13;
BLACKBURN: At the same time. Most of the forms, like I said, when they poured up to this level, why, then you just pulled the forms up with the big train heads*. And we used some of the same bolts that we used to get the bottoms in, and we'd use the same thing up at the top.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: The cells were what? Twenty feet deep, something like that, plus the thickness of the covers. They were very deep.&#13;
BLACKBURN: The cells were all at least 20 foot deep.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: You didn't pour those in one pour, then, that depth? I was wondering how you used those reusable forms.&#13;
BLACKBURN: Some of the forms was pulled up inside, too. I think they were pouring 15 to 20, almost 20 foot concrete. We had a big machine set up for concrete. You didn't bring trucks in. The trucks just put it into the big machines, and the machines come and we pour the concrete, why, it was just a steady stream.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: It was pumped in?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Yeah, pumped in. And fellows worked in there in what we used to call --- I can't think of what we used to call them.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: To tamp down the concrete?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Yeah.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Were they vibrators?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Well, that's what they were, but we had names for them.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: How did you stick a vibrator down into a 7 foot thick wall that was just packed full of piping and conduit and stuff like that?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Well, you could do that. We used both kinds. One vibrator was about that big.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: About three inches across?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Well, not quite three inches. Probably two and a half. And long, about like that, you know.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Two feet?&#13;
BLACKBURN: And then we had what we called a pineapple that roared when you put it in concrete, and it just has it all over. Had both kinds.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: And if any of those pipes had been bumped or knocked or dislodged, it would have been real trouble. Was everybody extra careful, or was it in there --- &#13;
BLACKBURN: Oh, I'm sure it was. We didn't seem to have any problem that way.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Okay.&#13;
BLACKBURN: See, a lot of the pipes themselves, if I remember right, we put in what we called jockeys for these holes, and then the pipes was put in some of them afterwards.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Oh. Through channels in the concrete?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Yeah, that's right. Then afterwards they put these heads on these lines so that the crane could bring in a pipe, all different rods, and put it on to there and then tighten it up.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Uh-huh, I've seen pictures.&#13;
BLACKBURN: Our biggest problem was the gaskets. When they started leaking, why, you had to pull off the jumper, we called them jumpers. You had to pull them off and put in a new one because they would be too hot, some of them would be too hot. If they were chemical jumpers, you could bring them out and redo the deal. But the whole system for 221-T was very simple. Very simple. All we did is bring in the slugs and take the aluminum coats off that we had put on in 300 area. Because, see, I worked a few weeks in 300 area also on making those slugs before I was chosen to go out to 231 Building.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Is that where you first met Roger Hultgren?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Hultgren, I believe I didn't meet him until I got out to 221 for (inaudible)*. See, some of them guys didn't come out during construction, I think they come more or less when it was about ready to start up.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Right.&#13;
BLACKBURN: I think he come from Chicago, too, I believe, if I remember. But I knew him well.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Well, let's maybe change gears for a minute. Let's jump to the end of construction. Did you leave 221 after it was completely finished?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Practically finished.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: You stuck with it most of the time?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Yeah. Well, yeah, I worked till almost October.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Of '44?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Yeah. And then my whole crew was laid off. In fact, we had that part all done, and then 24 was done, so that was my deal. So they talked about our whole crew was going to be laid off. Well, I decided maybe I'd go into operations. So I signed up for operations, but most of my men all went home. They went back to Illinois, and different places like that, where we come from.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Because there wasn't any work on the rest of the site, because it was getting finished up, too?&#13;
BLACKBURN: They were finishing up on the other plant right down below that was supposed to do the same thing the T Plant did. It never did.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: That was U Plant, I guess.&#13;
BLACKBURN: U Plant. But they never did. They never operated that. Later on, they used that for uranium.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: The recycling.&#13;
BLACKBURN: On T Plant, wasn't made for uranium at all. All we did is (inaudible)*, put it in the tanks, wash it with different chemicals, and then let it settle. And the uranium went down and plutonium come up. Then we sucked the plutonium off and moved it on and set the uranium through a big tank. So we did that. We just did that after several, and each time we had the plutonium down to smaller, smaller, and smaller. And then we sent it across to 224. And there they made it smaller and cleaner, and smaller and cleaner. And each batch ended up, oh, probably three gallons or three and a half gallons, and we put them in five gallon stainless steel. I forget what we call them now. And that's the way we transferred in the 231 Building, put them in big deals.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: So, in October of '44 the construction was winding down, and that's when they sent you to the 300 area?&#13;
BLACKBURN: That's when I hired out for operations, I went through all the dope. And I had my clearances and everything anyway, but everybody went through 300 area while they rechecked your clearances and everything. Even though I had clearances for practically everything in construction, they still needed more clearances about your life, and all this and that. So they sent you to 300 area for a week or so. The first couple of days you didn't even get in where the slugs were, you waited till they okayed you.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: When you went from construction into operations, what did you think you were going into?&#13;
BLACKBURN: When I got into there, I still didn't know what the slugs was for, but I knew where they were going, I knew they were going to the reactors.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Did you know they were reactors, or you just knew they were plants?&#13;
BLACKBURN: I think they called them plants or something at that time. But we took the uranium and made slugs about 8 inches long, about an inch and a quarter through, and had them up to 14, 15 hundred degrees, and then we'd shove them up there for just so long, we had clocks. And then when that was ready, we transferred them over into the aluminum. The aluminum was terribly hot, too. And we had these shields, aluminum shields, a little bit longer than the slug was, and that was in this stuff. We pushed that thing down in there, and then we had a cap that we capped it off with, and brought it out, cooled it all down, and then welded the cap with a welder.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: How many slugs at a time would you be dealing with? At any given hour, how many slugs went through your hands?&#13;
BLACKBURN: We put, on a shift, on a shift, see, I think that we were running two or three hundred on a shift, if I remember right. Each shift kept track of what they were doing.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: A shift being maybe eight, nine, ten hours?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Eight hours. Eight-hour shifts. Yeah. And three shifts around the clock. And then we put them all in carriers, and that's the way they were sent to the reactors.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: So in October of '44 the first reactor had already started up?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Oh, yeah.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Okay. So your slugs were needed very much, to keep it going.&#13;
BLACKBURN: We were still making the full-length slug with the new pipes. You know the pipes afterwards got messed up in the reactors. Then they started making small --- I didn't, not while I was there, but afterwards they had to make these slugs smaller so they could get around the...&#13;
WEISSKOPF: The graphite in the reactors was expanding?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Yeah. I was about a month in 300 area, and I was picked to go to 231 because they were just getting some material to 231, plutonium. And I was picked as chief operator, and I was the first chief operator in 321 Building.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: The 331?&#13;
BLACKBURN: 331 Building.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Wait, 231.&#13;
BLACKBURN: 231.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Yeah.&#13;
BLACKBURN: And I...&#13;
WEISSKOPF: And that was to go in from the 221 Building, the big building, to the 224 --- &#13;
BLACKBURN: To 231.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: And from 221 to 224 was piped over?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Yes. We pumped it.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: And how did you get it to the 231?&#13;
BLACKBURN: With trucks.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: You put it in a container and carried it over.&#13;
BLACKBURN: We contained it, and then it went with the trucks. And so then I went down there, and we had two cells down there, and I was chief on both and had about three operators in each cell. And everything was into last deal, cells down there, you know. We put it in, and drop it, pick it up, drop it, clean it, and...&#13;
WEISSKOPF: So you didn't have to be a chemist to do the job, you had to be able to follow the procedure.&#13;
BLACKBURN: We had chemists, too, in the building.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: So, in a sense, you were like a foreman --- &#13;
BLACKBURN: Yeah.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: --- managing --- &#13;
BLACKBURN: I was the foreman.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: --- the actual process.&#13;
BLACKBURN: That's right. I think the chief is supposed to be foreman. He takes care of the help, and then we had the manager of 231, and he had a supervisor, too. Anyway, I was transferred to 231 and run both areas then. And I think, and I won't bet on this, but I think I loaded out the first plutonium to the Army.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Really.&#13;
BLACKBURN: And they come and backed up their truck to the back door, and I opened the door and looked out here, and here's rifles sticking in the air all around. And we loaded them on these pineapples. And I was going to tell you about the pineapple. That was the last thing that we --- we have this three and a half gallon stuff worked down to so many deals, put it in the pineapple and cooked it. We cooked so much, so many deals off from that, and then that left practically a gel in the pineapple, and that's the way we shipped it.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Did you know you had to be cautious with it?&#13;
BLACKBURN: We had to be exact on the amounts. We thought, anyway. We had to be exact on the amount of the liquid that we took off that deal, because we had to weigh that, and weighed every piece.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Did the word criticality come up at that point?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Oh, I'm sure it did, because everything had to be just on the seconds. And when we boiled it down, why, we had to be very careful, just exactly the amount that we took off, the liquid. And we had to weigh everything and make papers out of everything.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Was that first shipment the equivalent plutonium from the first batch of uranium that went through?&#13;
BLACKBURN: I think it was. I think it was. And --- &#13;
WEISSKOPF: It wasn't a combination of four or five batches, or part of a batch?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Oh. Oh, yes, it was more than one batch. See, every one of these deals that we brought down from 224 turned out to be one pineapple. And I think the first shipment, I'm just kind of guessing now, we loaded up 20 pineapples. About 20 pineapples. And we understood, I'm not sure they did, we understood that that Army took that truck and went all the way down to New Mexico. But afterwards we loaded it and they put it in flatcars.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Trains?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Yeah.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Oh, okay. Once the system got going?&#13;
BLACKBURN: The Army went right in the train and stayed locked in there.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: And that was probably in the spring of '45 you were doing that?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Yeah. Yeah. Actually, it was either early November or the latter part of October that I went to 300 area.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Right.&#13;
BLACKBURN: And then I was there about a month, maybe a month, when I was made a chief in the sense of 231.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: You think that was already in '45 when you went there?&#13;
BLACKBURN: It was probably December. I'd say probably --- could have been December. Some of these dates are a little bit funny. But, anyway, I was at 231 Building for about two and a half, three years. And we got a new manager in, and he stayed there about six months, and he knew that I was the carpenter foreman up in 221, and he was trying to get as much experience as he could. So he was all done with 231, and he wanted to know if I'd go up to 221 with him. And I said "Hell, yes. I know that building pretty well." He said "That's just why I want you to go along." So I was put on a shift up there as chief.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: What was your title?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Chief. And I was up there, I would guess, six, seven years. Maybe even more than that. I can't remember just how long. I stayed on one shift all the time. And he was the manager up there.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Who was that? If it comes to you.&#13;
BLACKBURN: I can't remember his --- anyway, he replaced the manager at 231, because he was that guy's manager when he went to the Navy. And when he come out of the Navy, he come right back to that building and replaced the manager there. And then he was trying to get information on the whole thing, because he moved back to Chicago afterwards. He was a very nice fellow. He was a Navy --- I forget what he told me he was. He was way up, something pretty good in the Navy.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: One of the important moments at Hanford was in August of '45 when they finally dropped the bomb and it made the newspapers. Why don't you describe where you were working then, and how it affected you and your job.&#13;
BLACKBURN: I was still at 231 when they dropped the bomb. Of course, I think the general bunch of us pretty well knew what was going on there. But we didn't dare tell our families, or anything like that.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: But you didn't know if it would work, though, either.&#13;
BLACKBURN: No. I don't think they did until they set off the deals there in...&#13;
WEISSKOPF: In New Mexico.&#13;
BLACKBURN: New Mexico.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: So as I understood it, the news came out and immediately everybody told you that Hanford was involved with it?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Oh, sure, right away. We knew right away when it exploded. And then, of course, the papers was full of stuff, and things like that. In the hospital, at Kadlec Hospital, they got a lot of stuff along the walls up there. That's the new hospital, that ain't the old hospital but the new one. They've got a lot of good stuff for guys like me that wander through there and read it, and things like that. That was good.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: So did it change the nature of your job, once everybody knew what you were all involved with?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Well, the only thing was from then on there was a little more hurried. They knew what we was doing, and we could hustle it up a little bit more. And I worked in T Plant then, until PUREX was just about --- &#13;
WEISSKOPF: REDOX or PUREX?&#13;
BLACKBURN: PUREX. When PUREX was just about ready to start putting tanks in, then I was transferred over there. And soon after I got over there, I was a specialist. I was made a specialist at that (inaudible)*.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: How did REDOX fit in between?&#13;
BLACKBURN: There was a gang down there, and to tell you the truth I know very little about what they were doing. We knew some of the guys that worked there, but --- &#13;
WEISSKOPF: T Plant was still going while REDOX was going?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Oh, yes.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: They kept you both going?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Yeah. How they handled their work down there, I don't know. But I knew a lot of the operators, some of them that went and transferred down there, some of them that worked with me in 231, and stuff like that.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Do you think you could describe a typical day at T Plant during operations?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Yes.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: If you knew a batch was coming in on the train at 8:00 a.m., how would your day revolve around, before, during and after that?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Well, the crane operator would take the slugs and put in the dissolvers.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: And let's say if that happened at 8:00, how long before that would you be ramping up for?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Oh, that particular metal probably wouldn't for the next day, maybe two days. When they got a batch ready, they had tanks to put that in. And we took it as we could take it, in batches, which is how we moved it into the tanks. We didn't exactly take it right off the dissolvers. The dissolvers went into another tank. The first thing they had to do was take the aluminum covers off.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Okay. Well, let's go back to the crane operator then and his job. At 8:00 the cask car is down there, and he's starting to put it into the dissolver?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Yeah, in the dissolvers.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Okay. And what are you doing while that's happening?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Well, we're going on with the other material.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Because there's processes happening farther down the line?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Oh, yeah. We were going all the time.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: How many different batches might there be in the building at any one time? You know, from beginning to end?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Oh, I could say four, five. At least.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Interesting.&#13;
BLACKBURN: Yeah.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: And the idea being, you only deal with one batch at a time, but once one is started and moved down the line, you could start another one.&#13;
BLACKBURN: Another one right behind it. See, I had so many operators and so many utility operators. I had an operator on each of the boards, what we called a board. And any movement from one board to --- one tank to another, I had to go unlock. And we were all locked up there. And that was the old-time, I forget what we called them. Anyway, the steam went to them for jetting, and then the air blowed them out to cool them off, and then we locked them up again. So I had a lot of walking.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Because it's 800 feet long. Was there a, quote, gauge board for every section down the way?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Yes.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: For every two cells?&#13;
BLACKBURN: I think it was about two cells, because the operator could move from one tank to another. We did a lot of settling work, so the plutonium come up and uranium went down. And then you washed them both, and then of course uranium was --- it was wasted for us at that time, and the plutonium was what was really after there. It was very simple.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Were you the top of the heap, then, when operations were going on? Were you the one who had the final say about how the process went? Not chemically, maybe, but just as far as --- &#13;
BLACKBURN: No, I had a supervisor. Only he sat in the office most of the time. Of course, he would talk to the operators, and things like that. But I did all the running, had the keys, and had to write a book at the end of a shift, and everything like that.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: The log sheets that I've seen that people would fill out that have the steps listed, and the numbers.&#13;
BLACKBURN: Yeah, we always had a log.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Was the person standing at the gauge board filling that out?&#13;
BLACKBURN: No, that was me.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Okay. But if you had a board --- &#13;
BLACKBURN: Each area where they had, they had a book that told them just how long to settle, just how much chemical to put in there, and what chemicals to put in. And then the operator had to put in that he did this, and he did that, and he did this, did that. That's the way we run that.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: And would there be a sheet, then, at every gauge, every panel?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Oh, yes. It was a book. Actually, it was a book, really. It was, oh, like you see in schools, several pages inside of a book that opened up.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Was it difficult keeping track of multiple batches in the building? You might be dissolving one at one end, and --- &#13;
BLACKBURN: Seems like we had a deal in the office that as it moved along, we moved this thing in the office showing exactly what position we were in all the time.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: What was your title as you were doing that?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Chief.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Chief operator?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Chief in T Plant.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Of one shift?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Of one shift, yeah. We had four chiefs.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: And when the shift changed, you and all the people under you would move out and other guys would move in?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Went home, yeah.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: And you would have to tell them where you were in the process?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Well, yes, we always talked to the other chief when he come in. They always come in about 20 minutes to talk. And he could read what you had put down in the book. And if he had any questions to ask you, well, okay. And before we'd have to run out to get the bus to go to town.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Could you describe what --- the gallery where the gauges were was the operating gallery? What do you guys refer to it as?&#13;
BLACKBURN: How big it was?&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Well, just what it was like working in there. For example, how many guys would there be all the way down the length of the building while you were processing?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Oh, we'd have about nine or ten operators, and we'd have two guys that was taking samples, and that would be twelve.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Somebody in the crane?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Oh, yes, we had the crane operator.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Was he under your supervision, too?&#13;
BLACKBURN: No, not necessarily. He was actually, at that time, when I was a chief, him and I was level as far as that goes. Once in a great while I'd go up there during a shift, fool around with the deal, and he'd laugh about it naturally. Them guys was good.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: You'd look through the periscopes and try to see what it was about?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Yeah, I hooked on a couple of times.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Was it easy?&#13;
BLACKBURN: No. Not for me. Seemed like it was for them.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Do you remember there being a little television screen in the crane cabin?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Well, everything was done with television. He couldn't see anything.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Well, they had periscopes, too.&#13;
BLACKBURN: Periscopes.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: But what about television?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Didn't have television.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Okay. Because I read --- and since you were there during construction, there's a couple of pages of descriptions of how DuPont went to RCA and ordered a closed circuit television system that they installed in the cranes in all the separations buildings, and nobody I know remembers seeing them.&#13;
BLACKBURN: I don't remember seeing them. I never knew there was such a thing as a television.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: It would have stood out, had you seen it, right?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Oh, I'm sure it would.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Okay. I don't know what happened to it, but DuPont paid for it, and they sort of implied they installed it. That's funny. Okay. So you had nine or ten operators --- &#13;
BLACKBURN: Well, I had about ten operators.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: A couple of samplers.&#13;
BLACKBURN: Two. They were operators. One of them had to be an operator. And then we had people making up chemicals. One operator and probably two utility operators. And then --- &#13;
WEISSKOPF: Where would they be?&#13;
BLACKBURN: They were up...&#13;
WEISSKOPF: The same place?&#13;
BLACKBURN: No. They were on the same side that the offices were. And we had big tanks back there with all the different kinds of chemicals. Everything. We had nitric all the way from 60% down to 2%, I think it was. And then we had I think about two or else three operators in 224, and a couple of utilities there, too.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Were they under your supervision?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Yes.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: In the 224 Building as well?&#13;
BLACKBURN: 224 and 21. It was handled just like --- my same supervisor was supervisor to the 24.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Well, how did you --- if you were unlocking and physically having to be in the 221 Building --- &#13;
BLACKBURN: Didn't have much of that unlocking over there. A couple times a night I went over there and checked out everything that was going on.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Do you remember the process of sampling and how often that happened? How important was it?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Well, real important. The sampling was real important. The samplers, I remember one time when I and Hultgren went in the canyon and took a sample by ourself. Filled up a pot in order to send it. I think we sent that to New Mexico, too, I believe.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: For special analysis?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Yeah.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: And why did you guys do it versus the normal samplers?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Because we did it sort of out of --- we didn't do it with any RM* or anything.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Oh. You sort of snuck in.&#13;
BLACKBURN: We did things once in a while that wasn't supposed to be done, probably, but we did it.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: If that was more or less typical, what did you do before you went into the canyon?&#13;
BLACKBURN: We all had to change clothes to go into the canyon.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Wearing air masks then?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Yeah. Yeah. Oh, yes.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Going back to a typical sampler, were there times that you always took samples at certain points of the process?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Oh, yes.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: So they would know when it was coming up.&#13;
BLACKBURN: They would know. Well, you could talk to them. See, a lot of times they sat by the phone on the outside of the building there, or in the hallways, things like that.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: On the canyon side?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Yeah.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Suited up, ready to go in?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Oh, they were suited all the time for eight hours.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Oh.&#13;
BLACKBURN: Because you never know, every time we got word from the other people of what was going on, why, then we could either move material or do some more washing in the same place.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: So how many times in one batch would the samplers need to go in, do you think, and take a sample?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Well, they would practically sample it in each tank.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Oh, really.&#13;
BLACKBURN: I think each tank was sampled, if I remember right.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: So it would be many times.&#13;
BLACKBURN: Oh, yes, they took quite a few samples.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: So a batch took about 24 hours to go through, maybe less?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Oh, more than that.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: More than that?&#13;
BLACKBURN: More than that. I would say one batch would take more than 24 hours to go through.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: If it started Monday morning, it would be done sometime Tuesday?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Probably Tuesday.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Okay. And in between they'd be taking a dozen samples?&#13;
BLACKBURN: I'm sure they would. I'm sure they would. They would sample every tank. And if something went wrong with the sample, why, we'd have to resample, like that, you know.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: And I presume there must have been some pressure on everybody, if you're having to resample?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Everybody, yeah. They used to hang out, the samplers used to hang out where they run the analysis and stuff, things like that. They didn't have (inaudible)* in the canyon, or anything like that.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Would they have to undress, take off their overalls before they went in?&#13;
BLACKBURN: They had to take off one pair.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: One pair.&#13;
BLACKBURN: Yeah.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: But they kept the other pair on?&#13;
BLACKBURN: See, they generally had two pairs.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: So could you describe what it was like? When they knew they had to get a sample, what did they do before they entered the canyon and on in?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Well, they had to --- we had to call them, and they would pick up their samplers at the lab and go in and take the sample and take it back to the lab.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: How long would that take, do you think, between when they were notified to when they returned to the lab?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Oh, probably 15 minutes, 20 minutes sometimes.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Was there ever a time when you sampled, and you resampled and realized that something was drastically gone wrong with the batch?&#13;
BLACKBURN: I don't remember much of that.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Did you ever have to dump a batch because something had gone wrong?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Well, we had to rework a batch.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: You wouldn't dump it in the waste tanks and be done with it.&#13;
BLACKBURN: No.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: You'd always send it back.&#13;
BLACKBURN: Send it back. You wouldn't want to throw away that plutonium.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: No. Did you get a lot of pressure when something like that would happen?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Well, what it did is held back everything behind it.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: And what other kind of ancillary jobs were there? We mentioned people at the gauges, people mixing chemicals, people sampling. People in the laboratories?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Oh, yes.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Were they also part of your shift?&#13;
BLACKBURN: No. I didn't --- well, they were the shift, same shift, but they had their own supervision.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: So your people would take them samples, and they would give you numbers to enter into your logbook?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Had to come back to our office, our numbers.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Okay. And those numbers had to be within a certain range?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Right.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Did you have much leeway with those kinds of things?&#13;
BLACKBURN: I don't think so.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: It was all pretty much laid out.&#13;
BLACKBURN: Yeah. The only chemicals were all run through the labs, too, you know. The chemicals, they made chemicals upstairs in our buildings, and they would do it, each one was made up when you put the chemicals together with the book. And then they'd take a sample of that and send you to the lab.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Would they make a whole bunch at one time and keep it in a tank, then have it for many batches?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Yeah, we had batches.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: So if you needed nitric acid at a certain level, they would make up a big batch, test it --- &#13;
BLACKBURN: Big batch, and we'd take just what we needed out of it. But there was so much waste at T Plant. That's why we got the PUREX.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: And when you say waste, you mean in any given batch.&#13;
BLACKBURN: The stuff to fill down, to fill the tanks down in the tank farms. I don't know for sure exactly, but I think that PUREX, our waste was about 10% of what T Plant. I'm just guessing that.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Well, they weren't getting rid of any of the uranium, right?&#13;
BLACKBURN: And PUREX we wanted uranium and we wanted plutonium, both. So that wasn't waste. Our uranium went out into a tank, and then we loaded trucks, sent it to U Plant.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: And at T Plant everything except the plutonium was returned to the waste tanks.&#13;
BLACKBURN: To the waste tanks, right.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Was there a lot of effort to conserve chemicals and to lower the waste as much as possible? Was there much you could do about that?&#13;
BLACKBURN: You couldn't do that.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: The process was fixed.&#13;
BLACKBURN: We went by what they give us to process, yeah. We didn't see much of the big-shots from Chicago until 231. They come out there an awful lot.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Really.&#13;
BLACKBURN: And then we'd have to clean up behind. They'd mess up our room pretty bad.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Were they trying to just improve that last step of the process?&#13;
BLACKBURN: That's right. They were --- well, experimenting; let's say it that way. And they all had different names. They didn't have their regular names when they come.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Fermi went under the name of Farmer, I believe.&#13;
BLACKBURN: Yeah. I don't know, they had all kinds of names that they come out there with. They were very smart. They knew what they were doing. We took their word for it, everything. But we had a lot of cleanup work to do after they left every time.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: They weren't quite so careful, huh?&#13;
BLACKBURN: No, not as we had to be. We had to be. And when we shipped everything, everything had to be checked out completely, you know.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Let me ask you about the crane operator again, since that was such a key job.&#13;
BLACKBURN: It was.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: If you had a problem with some of the piping, say, that had to be replaced or adjusted, how long would it take, once you gave him the command of what needed to be done, how long did it take him to move up and down, take off the cell block covers...&#13;
BLACKBURN: Oh, we're talking probably an hour, half an hour.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: To at least get the process started?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Yeah. He would have to take off the deal. We had some regular cells in the east end of the building, or he'd have to take the deal and then pick up a new one there, bring it in on the flatbeds and stuff like that and take it up. I'd say probably somewheres near an hour, probably.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: So the pressure was on him, though, right?&#13;
BLACKBURN: They were pretty good.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: And what would you do with the equipment you took out, if it was hot?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Then it went into cells and stayed there.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: For how long?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Months.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: The cells were big enough to hold that kind of thing?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Oh, you could pile a lot of used stuff in the cells.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Do you remember any of it ever being taken out and dealt with?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Yes.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Would they take it out on the train car that brought in the fuel?&#13;
BLACKBURN: No, no. They brought in flatcars.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Into the tunnel?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Yeah. And we cocooned a lot of stuff before it went to burial. But for a long time all T Plant was operated and things like that, we didn't do any of that. We did more of it afterwards.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Because in the early days, I guess, there was pressures to produce, and worry about the details later on.&#13;
BLACKBURN: That's right. Yeah.&#13;
*[Start of side A of 2nd tape, not as clear. Echoes. You might want to listen to your tape from this point.]*&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Describe again, then, about the dissolver. You said you didn't have to empty it between batches?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Never did. You always leave a bunch.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: I've heard the word heel* used. Does that ring a bell? Where they would leave something in there.&#13;
BLACKBURN: Yeah, we always left something.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: What was the idea of leaving something in there, instead of just finishing one whole batch and emptying it out?&#13;
BLACKBURN: I don't know why that was. But you always left --- there was always some slugs in there.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: The first dissolving was to get the aluminum off.&#13;
BLACKBURN: That's the first thing you did, yeah.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: And that was like a sodium hydroxide?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Seemed like we used --- &#13;
WEISSKOPF: It was like lye almost?&#13;
BLACKBURN: I thought we used sulfuric. I'm not sure.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: And would you leave it in the same dissolver for the next step?&#13;
BLACKBURN: No, no. You jetted that off to the waste. We had to get that out.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: And what was left was more or less bare aluminum slugs?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Uranium slugs. Almost the same as we were running in the 300 area.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Did you wash them in water or anything in between?&#13;
BLACKBURN: No. As far as I know, we just took this --- I think we used 60% acid to dissolve it.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: And once it was dissolved, then you had material to work with.&#13;
BLACKBURN: Yeah. It never dissolved them all, it just dissolved the top, you might say, and that's what we jetted, jetted out into holding tanks.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Could you explain how those jets worked? They weren't pumps, right?&#13;
BLACKBURN: In some places we used pumps, but most of the places a jet, you had a suction line, and you got a jet here with a certain deal, and you run the steam through that. And when that steam runs through that, it sucks your material right with it.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Did it add steam to the material?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Oh, yes.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Okay.&#13;
BLACKBURN: Oh, yes.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: So you had to factor that in?&#13;
BLACKBURN: You had to factor that in, because that was part of your (inaudible)* afterwards. The more steam you used, the more liquid you come up with.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: How effective was that as a pump? Did it work pretty well?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Jet is wonderful. Jet is wonderful.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: No moving parts?&#13;
BLACKBURN: It just sits right there and you run the steam through your deal.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Basically, you could only, I guess, pump so high, because you were working on a vacuum principle, you're sucking it out?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Just sucking it right out.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Okay. Another issue was the dissolvers was where the really dangerous gases were let off. That was sort of the most toxic part of the process?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Probably.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: And they ran the exhaust directly out from there to the stack?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Went to a stack. Of course, all the cells were all made to...&#13;
WEISSKOPF: I was under the impression that the dissolvers had their own special jet pipes.&#13;
BLACKBURN: They could have. They could have.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Were you also watching what was coming out of the stack during dissolving?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Sometimes.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Was that your job, or was it somebody else?&#13;
BLACKBURN: That's not my job, no. We had people that worked in maintenance that were supposed to watch some of that kind of stuff.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: How about the weather report before you were allowed to dissolve?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Right.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: How did that come to you? When you knew there was going to be a batch coming in...&#13;
BLACKBURN: They had their own weather station at Hanford. Every night they sent up a balloon, stuff like that, to get directions and things like that. And we got all our deal right from the...&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Well, what would you do if they said the weather was going to be bad for two days?&#13;
BLACKBURN: We didn't do it.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: What did you do?&#13;
BLACKBURN: We just didn't. We could move material.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: The processes were still going.&#13;
BLACKBURN: We couldn't dissolve.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Okay. Was there ever like a 10-day period when you weren't allowed to dissolve?&#13;
BLACKBURN: I don't remember anything quite that long that I can remember. But there was a lot of days that you couldn't dissolve.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: But it didn't mean you sat around drinking coffee.&#13;
BLACKBURN: No, no. We still operated the rest of the building.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: And you never had to wait so long that the building had no processes going on?&#13;
BLACKBURN: No. There were some times when we used to flush tanks, clean the tank out completely and bring the metal in. So we didn't dissolve every day.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Did the crane operator do a lot of inspections to see that things were okay? How would you know that things weren't leaking, or rusting out, or...&#13;
BLACKBURN: We had things in our sumps and had a deal showing --- if we had a leak in a cell, a sump told us that we had it. He didn't have to worry about that till we told him.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: One cell, the supercell* that was real deep, or the collection of cells that was like (inaudible)* deeper than the rest.&#13;
BLACKBURN: That was a big cell anyway, because there was a lot of stuff put in that.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: And where would the stuff come from that went into that?&#13;
BLACKBURN: From the rest of the building.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: It wasn't from the tanks, it was from spills and things like that?&#13;
BLACKBURN: It was what we called connectors. It was connectors for stuff that we was transferring from one cell, from one tank to another, and from another cell into that. And if we got a leak, we stopped it immediately when we got a signal. And then the crane operator went and inspected it. (Inaudible)*&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Where the connector met the well* of the cell, that joint might leak.&#13;
BLACKBURN: Right.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: And liquid would go down onto the cell floor.&#13;
BLACKBURN: Right down into the sump, see.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: And a drain that went all the way down.&#13;
BLACKBURN: We always had sumps in there.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Was there a drain from that sump down to that supercell*?&#13;
BLACKBURN: I believe that we were able to jet a sump out of there into a tank.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Your discretion?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Yeah. Yeah. That's the only way we did it.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: The normal waste, the uranium waste, was sent out in a pipe.&#13;
BLACKBURN: All the way out, and just went right down to the --- &#13;
WEISSKOPF: Only if that pipe leaked would anything end up in the cell itself. The cells were to remain dry at all times if possible.&#13;
BLACKBURN: Supposedly, yeah.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: And did you hose down the cell if there was a leak?&#13;
BLACKBURN: They were hosed. They were hosed.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Did guys do it or did the crane operator do it?&#13;
BLACKBURN: If I remember right, the crane operator did it.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Would go hose out the cell?&#13;
BLACKBURN: Yeah. See, at that time we couldn't fool around regasketing anything. Didn't know how, I guess, to regasket. When we got to PUREX, we were able to regasket a lot of stuff. I don't know why, but the guys could do it.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: I could see either way, because taking off the gasket and putting one on doesn't sound difficult, but it depends, I guess.&#13;
BLACKBURN: It depends. At T Plant we didn't think you could do that.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Do you remember near the end of construction at T Plant when they had to go through and replace a lot of gaskets before the plant started up?&#13;
BLACKBURN: I'm sure they did that.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: Supposedly they were using Teflon gaskets.&#13;
BLACKBURN: The wrong gaskets or something.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: And when the impact wrench tightened them down, it was too much for them.&#13;
BLACKBURN: Yeah.&#13;
WEISSKOPF: So they went to a different kind of gasket.&#13;
BLACKBURN: I heard about that. I didn't see any of it.&#13;
	(End of interview)&#13;
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            <name>Title</name>
            <description>A name given to the resource</description>
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                <text>Gardner Clark "G.C." Blackburn</text>
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            <name>Subject</name>
            <description>The topic of the resource</description>
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                <text>Hanford Atomic Products Operation</text>
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          </element>
          <element elementId="41">
            <name>Description</name>
            <description>An account of the resource</description>
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                <text>An oral history interview with Gardner Clark "G.C." Blackburn conducted by Gene Weisskopf for the B Reactor Museum Association as part of an interview series focused on the T Plant and writing a Historic American Engineering Record (HAER) document for the T Plant.  Blackburn was a carpentry foreman in the 200 West area.   </text>
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            <name>Creator</name>
            <description>An entity primarily responsible for making the resource</description>
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                <text>B Reactor Museum Association</text>
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            <name>Publisher</name>
            <description>An entity responsible for making the resource available</description>
            <elementTextContainer>
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                <text>Hanford History Project at Washington State University Tri-Cities</text>
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            <name>Date</name>
            <description>A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource</description>
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                <text>11/17/1999</text>
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          <element elementId="47">
            <name>Rights</name>
            <description>Information about rights held in and over the resource</description>
            <elementTextContainer>
              <elementText elementTextId="41251">
                <text>Those interested in reproducing part or all of this oral history should contact the Hanford History Project.</text>
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            <name>Format</name>
            <description>The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource</description>
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            <name>Identifier</name>
            <description>An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context</description>
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              <description>An account of the resource</description>
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                  <text>Oral History Interviews conducted by the B Reactor Museum Association.  The collection is split between a series of audio oral histories taken in the late 1990s and early 2000s by Gene Weisskopf that focuses on the T-Plant, and a series of video oral histories done in the early 1990s by Bill Putman that focus on the B Reactor and Hanford construction.  </text>
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              <description>The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource</description>
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              <name>Language</name>
              <description>A language of the resource</description>
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                  <text>Hanford History Project at Washington State University Tri-Cities</text>
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              <name>Rights</name>
              <description>Information about rights held in and over the resource</description>
              <elementTextContainer>
                <elementText elementTextId="26226">
                  <text>Those interested in reproducing part or all of this collection should contact the Hanford History Project at ourhanfordhistory@tricity.wsu.edu, who can provide specific rights information for these items.</text>
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      <name>Oral History</name>
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          <name>Interviewer</name>
          <description>The person(s) performing the interview</description>
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              <text>Gene Weisskopf</text>
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          <name>Interviewee</name>
          <description>The person(s) being interviewed</description>
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              <text>William M. Ryan</text>
            </elementText>
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          <name>Transcription</name>
          <description>Any written text transcribed from a sound</description>
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            <elementText elementTextId="41242">
              <text>N/A</text>
            </elementText>
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          <name>Duration</name>
          <description>Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.)</description>
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              <text>00:47:53</text>
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          <description>Rate at which bits are transferred (i.e. 96 kbit/s would be FM quality audio)</description>
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                <text>William Ryan Oral History Interview</text>
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            <name>Subject</name>
            <description>The topic of the resource</description>
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              <elementText elementTextId="41232">
                <text>B Reactor National Historic Landmark (Wash.)</text>
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          <element elementId="41">
            <name>Description</name>
            <description>An account of the resource</description>
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                <text>An oral history interview with William Ryan conducted by the B Reactor Museum Association.</text>
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          <element elementId="39">
            <name>Creator</name>
            <description>An entity primarily responsible for making the resource</description>
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              <elementText elementTextId="41234">
                <text>B Reactor Museum Association</text>
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            </elementTextContainer>
          </element>
          <element elementId="45">
            <name>Publisher</name>
            <description>An entity responsible for making the resource available</description>
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              <elementText elementTextId="41235">
                <text>Hanford History Project at Washington State University Tri-Cities</text>
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            </elementTextContainer>
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            <name>Date</name>
            <description>A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource</description>
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                <text>11/27/2000</text>
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          <element elementId="47">
            <name>Rights</name>
            <description>Information about rights held in and over the resource</description>
            <elementTextContainer>
              <elementText elementTextId="41237">
                <text>Those interested in reproducing part or all of this oral history should contact the Hanford History Project.</text>
              </elementText>
            </elementTextContainer>
          </element>
          <element elementId="42">
            <name>Format</name>
            <description>The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource</description>
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                <text>MP3</text>
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            <name>Language</name>
            <description>A language of the resource</description>
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              <elementText elementTextId="41239">
                <text>English</text>
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            <element elementId="50">
              <name>Title</name>
              <description>A name given to the resource</description>
              <elementTextContainer>
                <elementText elementTextId="40978">
                  <text>CREHST Museum Oral Histories</text>
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            <element elementId="49">
              <name>Subject</name>
              <description>The topic of the resource</description>
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                  <text>Oral History; Hanford Site; Richland, WA</text>
                </elementText>
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              <name>Description</name>
              <description>An account of the resource</description>
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                <elementText elementTextId="40980">
                  <text>Oral Histories conducted at and collected by the Columbia River Exhibition of History, Science &amp; Technology (CREHST) Museum.  The CREHST Museum, closed in 2014, was dedicated to preserving the history of the Hanford Site and Richland, WA and held the Department of Energy's Hanford Collection.  After closure of the CREHST Museum most records and archival holdings were transferred to Washington State University's Hanford History Project where they are now held.  </text>
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              <name>Creator</name>
              <description>An entity primarily responsible for making the resource</description>
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                  <text>CREHST Museum, Gary Fetterolf, Terry Andre</text>
                </elementText>
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              <name>Date</name>
              <description>A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource</description>
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                  <text>1999-2013</text>
                </elementText>
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              <name>Rights</name>
              <description>Information about rights held in and over the resource</description>
              <elementTextContainer>
                <elementText elementTextId="40983">
                  <text>All resources have consent transferred to Washington State University's Hanford History Project.  Contact Hanford History Project for information on use and rights.  </text>
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            <element elementId="44">
              <name>Language</name>
              <description>A language of the resource</description>
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                <elementText elementTextId="40984">
                  <text>English.  </text>
                </elementText>
              </elementTextContainer>
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            <element elementId="43">
              <name>Identifier</name>
              <description>An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context</description>
              <elementTextContainer>
                <elementText elementTextId="40985">
                  <text>RG2-4A</text>
                </elementText>
              </elementTextContainer>
            </element>
            <element elementId="81">
              <name>Spatial Coverage</name>
              <description>Spatial characteristics of the resource.</description>
              <elementTextContainer>
                <elementText elementTextId="40986">
                  <text>Hanford Site; Richland, WA</text>
                </elementText>
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            <element elementId="82">
              <name>Temporal Coverage</name>
              <description>Temporal characteristics of the resource.</description>
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                  <text>1943-1990</text>
                </elementText>
              </elementTextContainer>
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            <element elementId="90">
              <name>Provenance</name>
              <description>A statement of any changes in ownership and custody of the resource since its creation that are significant for its authenticity, integrity, and interpretation. The statement may include a description of any changes successive custodians made to the resource.</description>
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                <elementText elementTextId="40988">
                  <text>Oral histories originally conducted by, or collected by, the CREHST Museum.  Property and rights transferred to Washington State University upon CREHST closure in 2014</text>
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            <element elementId="91">
              <name>Rights Holder</name>
              <description>A person or organization owning or managing rights over the resource.</description>
              <elementTextContainer>
                <elementText elementTextId="40989">
                  <text>Washington State University's Hanford History Project.  </text>
                </elementText>
              </elementTextContainer>
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      <name>Oral History</name>
      <description>A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge.</description>
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          <name>Interviewer</name>
          <description>The person(s) performing the interview</description>
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            <elementText elementTextId="41225">
              <text>F. Gary Fetterolf</text>
            </elementText>
          </elementTextContainer>
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        <element elementId="3">
          <name>Interviewee</name>
          <description>The person(s) being interviewed</description>
          <elementTextContainer>
            <elementText elementTextId="41226">
              <text>Jack A. Houston</text>
            </elementText>
          </elementTextContainer>
        </element>
        <element elementId="4">
          <name>Location</name>
          <description>The location of the interview</description>
          <elementTextContainer>
            <elementText elementTextId="41227">
              <text>Home of Jack A. Houston</text>
            </elementText>
          </elementTextContainer>
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          <name>Transcription</name>
          <description>Any written text transcribed from a sound</description>
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              <text>N/A</text>
            </elementText>
          </elementTextContainer>
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          <name>Duration</name>
          <description>Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.)</description>
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              <text>02:15:39</text>
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          <description>Rate at which bits are transferred (i.e. 96 kbit/s would be FM quality audio)</description>
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              <text>126kpbs</text>
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            <name>Title</name>
            <description>A name given to the resource</description>
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                <text>Jack Houston Oral History Part 1</text>
              </elementText>
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            <name>Subject</name>
            <description>The topic of the resource</description>
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                <text>Hanford Atomic Products Operation</text>
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            <name>Description</name>
            <description>An account of the resource</description>
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                <text>From CREHST Oral History Agreement: "Segment 1: Early life including Depression years.  Segments 2 &amp; 3: Young adult, military, years following military</text>
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            <name>Creator</name>
            <description>An entity primarily responsible for making the resource</description>
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                <text>CREHST Museum</text>
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          <element elementId="45">
            <name>Publisher</name>
            <description>An entity responsible for making the resource available</description>
            <elementTextContainer>
              <elementText elementTextId="41221">
                <text>Hanford History Project at Washington State University Tri-Cities</text>
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              <elementText elementTextId="41222">
                <text>10/4/2012</text>
              </elementText>
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          <element elementId="47">
            <name>Rights</name>
            <description>Information about rights held in and over the resource</description>
            <elementTextContainer>
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              <text>ORAL HISTORY PROJECT&#13;
TITLE: CREHST ORAL HISTORY 2003   &#13;
INTERVIEW DATE: JULY 10, 2003&#13;
INTERVIEW LOCATION: UNKNOWN&#13;
INTERVIEWER: UNKNOWN  &#13;
INTERVIEWED: ALFRED WEHNER&#13;
TRANSCRIBER:  JUDY SIMPSON&#13;
LENGTH:   24:00 MINUTES&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: Today we are interviewing, Alfred Wehner.  Al was born in October 1926, in Guesbox, Germany. At age 14 he joined the (Figgler Hitler Juggen) or the “Hitler Youth Flying Core“, to become a fighter pilot. Fuel and manpower shortage led to his ground assignment on the Russian front.  He was part of a small force defending Luecow. They held Luecow for two days and fled to the Alp River. His group was then ordered to head toward Czechoslovakia to fight the Russians. When the war ended he was 500 kilometers east of his home town, and 200 kilometers behind Russian lines. He found his way home thirteen days later.  Following the war he attented Glazing Medicene and Industry. He immigrated to the United States in 1953. He and his wife moved to the Tri-Cities in 1967, and he went to work for Battelle. Over the years, Dr. Wehner has authored more than 120 scientific publications and has received three U. S. Patton. His research has been in the area of electro-aerosol and intoxiocology he continues to work as a consultant. Today could you tell us a little bit about your story? Growing-up in Germany and how you became involved in the “Hitler Youth Flying Core”?            &#13;
&#13;
ALFRED: I was born, as was mentioned in, October 1926.  ……………… When (inaudible) came into power I was six years old when World War II started, for Germany I was 12 years old, and when Hitler came into power a few years later there was (inaudible). Every youth at the age of 10 had to join what you would call here the Cub Scouts and at the age of 14 you were automatically transferred to the Hitler Youth, had become a leader (spoke in German) which were Cub Scouts. I was interested in flying and the war was still going on. What I did not want to become was a member of the infantry. I love flying, it gave me a chance to put my fate in my own hands and hoping I wasn’t to be killed. I wanted to be able to do my own mistakes and not due to a Sergeants order, who said……CHARGE! The first year of the flying core we had to build our own glider planes. (Inaudible, possibly German) At the age of fifteen I got my first wing, and by the age of 17 I had three wings and was an accomplished glider pilot. At that time because of my age, 17. I was drafted, again I did not want to serve in the infantry, so I volunteered for the (spoken in German) German Air Force. I was drafted, that was in August 1944, at the age of 17. After a brief boot camp I went to the Air Born Academy with three (inaudible). It is a separate intuition like the Air Force Academy here. Like Colorado, of course it was not that fancy. Our flight training began.  My aim, my hope was to become a fighter pilot. In February, of March “45” we run out of aviation fuel curtsy of the Air Forces. A general shortage of fuel; so we were given rifles and sent to the east of Frankengo to stop the Russians; which by that time had drove into Czechoslovakia over running the (inaudible). Our troop trade we were 200, the next 20 miles, and we had picked up a 1000 recruits somewhere.  We were loaded into cattle wagons and sometimes driven to the settlements to form a new division in the infantry. They drove us right to the Russian tanks. At that time the Russians had started their last assault on Berlin. In two bits of movements. The north Wahshoogah, in the south Bahchoconth in a slow movement to capture the land, and we were driven right to those tanks in Bahchoconth.  They shot us up; we were out armed, so we ran for our lives.  The Russian tanks between us (shows Alfred moving arms back and forth). About 200 of us managed to escape and we came to a small town called Gluehow, this was Azeeway these days, this was Jewish, Germany. The Nazi official was overall capsule authority in those towns.  He ordered us to the trenches, the folks had already dug trenches around Gluehow, and so we were ordered to the trenches. He gave every 10th of us a rifle.  The trenches were full of bazookas, and the Russians made the mistake of attacting with the tanks, and we knocked them off as they came. If they would have attacted us with broomsticks that would have killed us all. We held look out for two days. We broke out one night it was pretty and we could see a movie, a piece of junk that came to happen. We reversed our caps and blackened our faces. At the top of our column, I think there were some of the stragglers, top column was a motorcyclist who spoke Russian there were some other armed forces stragglers with vechiles with an 88 gun and two with 22 milimeter guns.  We drove these fields….like grapes. We drove right threw the Russian lines. I could see the Russian’s in line. I could see the puffs of their cigarettes. We just drove threw…but that roués lasted only as long as there was night. Daylight broke there were some ammunation fights…battles.  Most of us managed to get out.  Our general thrive was to go West, West, West, away from the Russians, because we knew the areas where Russians guarded. What they did to prisonors and civilian population. So, we reached the Elva River.  The Elva River flows southeast to northwest. We had hoped to cross the Elva River to go to the cross over the Elva to go to the Americans, but somehow we got orders to go up the Elva River which lead us to which is now Czechoslovakia, and that was the last German bastion that was still fighting. The other army groups; Italy, Scandinavia; West, and the German (inaudible). The commander of this Czechoslovakia group was General Sharnay (inaudible) Nazi he gave us orders to fight to the last man. Then he shed his uniform, wore some civies took a plane and flew over to the Americans. In any event, my 9th, early morning was the day wakeup the (inaudible). In the meantime, the Russians had taken Berlin, I think around May 1st , and the combined army groups of Surecoff and Doneff then made a right angle turn south driving toward Braug, only 200 kilometer wide front and everything that was east of that sweep was cut-off from Germany, that was Germany. I had the misfortune of being at that group (inaudible) and we were not allowed off. (Loud laughing from another group-inaudible). Something about being 18. My hometown was 500 kilometers, about 350 miles, west of were I was, but we were 200 kilometers inside Russia. The (something) kilometers and the rest was American occupied the territory. The Allied Armed Forces had already captured all German soliders after capulation. They had to go through a prisoner of war camp. I presume it was to screen out Nazi’s; war criminals or whatever. I had no intentions of imposing on their hospitality.  It was an adventurous trip home, sometimes my life hanged in the balance….again, and again. I made it after 13 days to my home town, but of course, I came home to a free country.  All the cities were rubble. I thought at the time being used to the German, I thought in my lifetime they could not pick-up that rubble. Survices to say at first, the first three years out of the war were rough. We starved and there were signs the Americans had made up signs on the trees, “Don’t fratenize”. So, we were the enemy, on the account of the trustee’s that had become public at the Concentration Camps and all that. We were tyrants among the nations. The only offered currency offered before 1948 began what was subsequently called (inaudible).  From 1948 on you could start buying things again; before that you could not buy anything. Not even a nail, if you needed coupons for suits, for clothing, for shoes, which were hard to get. I got a coupon for a suit because I had grown out of my suit that I had left at home when I went to the war. After a long wait I got a coupon and I went to the store and they didn’t have any suits. The experiation date on my coupon, well the coupon expired, so I had to apply for another one. So that is some of what life was after the war. The American policy at that time was “The German’s Shall Starve”, “Starve to Death” this actually in the only, when the East Germans fought their government under Soviet occupation (inaudible) and then the Western allies wanted a counter balance and slowly the West Germans started more and more power itself, the samething we wanted to do in Iran, except in Iran amounted to weeks and months, where Germany took quite a number of years. So things got better by 1950 except there were still ruins. I had the good fortune to come here, and to find a sponsor.  I was always infatuated by the United States as a kid I had models of …about the Wild West. (Loud laughing….inaudible). During the war I would admire the B-17’s, beautiful planes, although they were a curse in the end. Incidently, after the war the number of sports were prohibited, like shooting of course, we taught shooting, judo even foil fencing was some of the (inaudible). Cause you can’t do much with a foiling fence against an Atomic Bomb. In 1949 these laws were loosened and these sports came up again. Right after the war there was no schools, no Universities, no member of the Nazi Party was allowed to continue in his profession other than manual labor.  They all had to go through denazivication or there was a (inaudible) board had to go to court.  The court consisted of “anti-Nazi” of course there was an initial bias to begin with. There were a lot of people that joined the party and paid their $2 a month and attempt their careers. All the Nazi members, Party members could not practice their profession that was dangerous. My Dad was a dentist (laughing inaudible) in all these times he was arrested away from his patient and disappeared for 5 months. We did not know if he was alive.  A lot of these people were sent to France to work in the mines; under very stressful conditions, many died there. In that time he disappeared from the face of this earth and I was alone, but my mother left us when I was 8 years old.  I was 18 years old by that time. After five months I got a form letter from an American concentration camp. (Inaudible) camp.  They kept him; there was no arrest warrant, no charge. After fifteen (or could be 50) months they told him go home now. He could not resume his practice until he went through the denazifacation process, which took a year or two.  The ironary of it all, the people who had to go through this process were classified in five groups. Number 1 was the main criminal types that were (inaudible). Number 4 were the ones that just paid their dues, and had done nothing bad. Number 5 were the one’s who had to prove that they even suffered under the Nazi’s or had helped people who were persecuted by the Nazis. My Dad was classified as Number 5.  (Sentence inaudible……lots of loud laughing).  I was fortunate to (inaudible) American occupiation; my hometown was in the American occupied zone. I found a sponsor because it was my desire to come to the United States, and she sponsored me then on April 6th in 1953 it is just like a couple of months ago. That is it in a nutshell my experience over there. I was there at the wrong time and the wrong place.&#13;
&#13;
UNKNOWN: Were you moved to the United States when you arrived here in 1953 and where were you living?&#13;
&#13;
ALFRED: Well, I arrived in Obant, NJ which was the harbor for New York.  I lived in New York City for two years, and was then a member of the 7100 Hospital United States Air Force, in my hometown that was where I was allowed to practice on Americans; I was there from “1954” to “1956”, and then I had to look for a new job because I couldn‘t practice here. I could not find a job in New York for an accountant. I met my wife and we married in Germany.  I met her (inaudible).  We had a 6 month old baby; we loaded everything we had in the car and drove down the east coast line, she had some friends from the Air Force Hospital, so I thought I could find a job.  We then drove down to Flordia…..nothing. I figured let’s go to California, I always loved California. I might as well have stayed in Berlin, although I have never been there.  Our last big stop was Texas. A collegue of mine said, “Al, if you ever come to Texas you have got to visit us”. So on our way to California we stoped in Texas.                                                                                                                 &#13;
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              <text>ORAL HISTORY PROJECT&#13;
TITLE: CREHST ORAL HISTORY 2003   &#13;
INTERVIEW DATE: JULY 10, 2003&#13;
INTERVIEW LOCATION: UNKNOWN&#13;
INTERVIEWER: UNKNOWN  &#13;
INTERVIEWED: ALFRED WEHNER&#13;
TRANSCRIBER:  JUDY SIMPSON&#13;
LENGTH:   24:00 MINUTES&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: Today we are interviewing, Alfred Wehner.  Al was born in October 1926, in Guesbox, Germany. At age 14 he joined the (Figgler Hitler Juggen) or the “Hitler Youth Flying Core“, to become a fighter pilot. Fuel and manpower shortage led to his ground assignment on the Russian front.  He was part of a small force defending Luecow. They held Luecow for two days and fled to the Alp River. His group was then ordered to head toward Czechoslovakia to fight the Russians. When the war ended he was 500 kilometers east of his home town, and 200 kilometers behind Russian lines. He found his way home thirteen days later.  Following the war he attented Glazing Medicene and Industry. He immigrated to the United States in 1953. He and his wife moved to the Tri-Cities in 1967, and he went to work for Battelle. Over the years, Dr. Wehner has authored more than 120 scientific publications and has received three U. S. Patton. His research has been in the area of electro-aerosol and intoxiocology he continues to work as a consultant. Today could you tell us a little bit about your story? Growing-up in Germany and how you became involved in the “Hitler Youth Flying Core”?            &#13;
&#13;
ALFRED: I was born, as was mentioned in, October 1926.  ……………… When (inaudible) came into power I was six years old when World War II started, for Germany I was 12 years old, and when Hitler came into power a few years later there was (inaudible). Every youth at the age of 10 had to join what you would call here the Cub Scouts and at the age of 14 you were automatically transferred to the Hitler Youth, had become a leader (spoke in German) which were Cub Scouts. I was interested in flying and the war was still going on. What I did not want to become was a member of the infantry. I love flying, it gave me a chance to put my fate in my own hands and hoping I wasn’t to be killed. I wanted to be able to do my own mistakes and not due to a Sergeants order, who said……CHARGE! The first year of the flying core we had to build our own glider planes. (Inaudible, possibly German) At the age of fifteen I got my first wing, and by the age of 17 I had three wings and was an accomplished glider pilot. At that time because of my age, 17. I was drafted, again I did not want to serve in the infantry, so I volunteered for the (spoken in German) German Air Force. I was drafted, that was in August 1944, at the age of 17. After a brief boot camp I went to the Air Born Academy with three (inaudible). It is a separate intuition like the Air Force Academy here. Like Colorado, of course it was not that fancy. Our flight training began.  My aim, my hope was to become a fighter pilot. In February, of March “45” we run out of aviation fuel curtsy of the Air Forces. A general shortage of fuel; so we were given rifles and sent to the east of Frankengo to stop the Russians; which by that time had drove into Czechoslovakia over running the (inaudible). Our troop trade we were 200, the next 20 miles, and we had picked up a 1000 recruits somewhere.  We were loaded into cattle wagons and sometimes driven to the settlements to form a new division in the infantry. They drove us right to the Russian tanks. At that time the Russians had started their last assault on Berlin. In two bits of movements. The north Wahshoogah, in the south Bahchoconth in a slow movement to capture the land, and we were driven right to those tanks in Bahchoconth.  They shot us up; we were out armed, so we ran for our lives.  The Russian tanks between us (shows Alfred moving arms back and forth). About 200 of us managed to escape and we came to a small town called Gluehow, this was Azeeway these days, this was Jewish, Germany. The Nazi official was overall capsule authority in those towns.  He ordered us to the trenches, the folks had already dug trenches around Gluehow, and so we were ordered to the trenches. He gave every 10th of us a rifle.  The trenches were full of bazookas, and the Russians made the mistake of attacting with the tanks, and we knocked them off as they came. If they would have attacted us with broomsticks that would have killed us all. We held look out for two days. We broke out one night it was pretty and we could see a movie, a piece of junk that came to happen. We reversed our caps and blackened our faces. At the top of our column, I think there were some of the stragglers, top column was a motorcyclist who spoke Russian there were some other armed forces stragglers with vechiles with an 88 gun and two with 22 milimeter guns.  We drove these fields….like grapes. We drove right threw the Russian lines. I could see the Russian’s in line. I could see the puffs of their cigarettes. We just drove threw…but that roués lasted only as long as there was night. Daylight broke there were some ammunation fights…battles.  Most of us managed to get out.  Our general thrive was to go West, West, West, away from the Russians, because we knew the areas where Russians guarded. What they did to prisonors and civilian population. So, we reached the Elva River.  The Elva River flows southeast to northwest. We had hoped to cross the Elva River to go to the cross over the Elva to go to the Americans, but somehow we got orders to go up the Elva River which lead us to which is now Czechoslovakia, and that was the last German bastion that was still fighting. The other army groups; Italy, Scandinavia; West, and the German (inaudible). The commander of this Czechoslovakia group was General Sharnay (inaudible) Nazi he gave us orders to fight to the last man. Then he shed his uniform, wore some civies took a plane and flew over to the Americans. In any event, my 9th, early morning was the day wakeup the (inaudible). In the meantime, the Russians had taken Berlin, I think around May 1st , and the combined army groups of Surecoff and Doneff then made a right angle turn south driving toward Braug, only 200 kilometer wide front and everything that was east of that sweep was cut-off from Germany, that was Germany. I had the misfortune of being at that group (inaudible) and we were not allowed off. (Loud laughing from another group-inaudible). Something about being 18. My hometown was 500 kilometers, about 350 miles, west of were I was, but we were 200 kilometers inside Russia. The (something) kilometers and the rest was American occupied the territory. The Allied Armed Forces had already captured all German soliders after capulation. They had to go through a prisoner of war camp. I presume it was to screen out Nazi’s; war criminals or whatever. I had no intentions of imposing on their hospitality.  It was an adventurous trip home, sometimes my life hanged in the balance….again, and again. I made it after 13 days to my home town, but of course, I came home to a free country.  All the cities were rubble. I thought at the time being used to the German, I thought in my lifetime they could not pick-up that rubble. Survices to say at first, the first three years out of the war were rough. We starved and there were signs the Americans had made up signs on the trees, “Don’t fratenize”. So, we were the enemy, on the account of the trustee’s that had become public at the Concentration Camps and all that. We were tyrants among the nations. The only offered currency offered before 1948 began what was subsequently called (inaudible).  From 1948 on you could start buying things again; before that you could not buy anything. Not even a nail, if you needed coupons for suits, for clothing, for shoes, which were hard to get. I got a coupon for a suit because I had grown out of my suit that I had left at home when I went to the war. After a long wait I got a coupon and I went to the store and they didn’t have any suits. The experiation date on my coupon, well the coupon expired, so I had to apply for another one. So that is some of what life was after the war. The American policy at that time was “The German’s Shall Starve”, “Starve to Death” this actually in the only, when the East Germans fought their government under Soviet occupation (inaudible) and then the Western allies wanted a counter balance and slowly the West Germans started more and more power itself, the samething we wanted to do in Iran, except in Iran amounted to weeks and months, where Germany took quite a number of years. So things got better by 1950 except there were still ruins. I had the good fortune to come here, and to find a sponsor.  I was always infatuated by the United States as a kid I had models of …about the Wild West. (Loud laughing….inaudible). During the war I would admire the B-17’s, beautiful planes, although they were a curse in the end. Incidently, after the war the number of sports were prohibited, like shooting of course, we taught shooting, judo even foil fencing was some of the (inaudible). Cause you can’t do much with a foiling fence against an Atomic Bomb. In 1949 these laws were loosened and these sports came up again. Right after the war there was no schools, no Universities, no member of the Nazi Party was allowed to continue in his profession other than manual labor.  They all had to go through denazivication or there was a (inaudible) board had to go to court.  The court consisted of “anti-Nazi” of course there was an initial bias to begin with. There were a lot of people that joined the party and paid their $2 a month and attempt their careers. All the Nazi members, Party members could not practice their profession that was dangerous. My Dad was a dentist (laughing inaudible) in all these times he was arrested away from his patient and disappeared for 5 months. We did not know if he was alive.  A lot of these people were sent to France to work in the mines; under very stressful conditions, many died there. In that time he disappeared from the face of this earth and I was alone, but my mother left us when I was 8 years old.  I was 18 years old by that time. After five months I got a form letter from an American concentration camp. (Inaudible) camp.  They kept him; there was no arrest warrant, no charge. After fifteen (or could be 50) months they told him go home now. He could not resume his practice until he went through the denazifacation process, which took a year or two.  The ironary of it all, the people who had to go through this process were classified in five groups. Number 1 was the main criminal types that were (inaudible). Number 4 were the ones that just paid their dues, and had done nothing bad. Number 5 were the one’s who had to prove that they even suffered under the Nazi’s or had helped people who were persecuted by the Nazis. My Dad was classified as Number 5.  (Sentence inaudible……lots of loud laughing).  I was fortunate to (inaudible) American occupiation; my hometown was in the American occupied zone. I found a sponsor because it was my desire to come to the United States, and she sponsored me then on April 6th in 1953 it is just like a couple of months ago. That is it in a nutshell my experience over there. I was there at the wrong time and the wrong place.&#13;
&#13;
UNKNOWN: Were you moved to the United States when you arrived here in 1953 and where were you living?&#13;
&#13;
ALFRED: Well, I arrived in Obant, NJ which was the harbor for New York.  I lived in New York City for two years, and was then a member of the 7100 Hospital United States Air Force, in my hometown that was where I was allowed to practice on Americans; I was there from “1954” to “1956”, and then I had to look for a new job because I couldn‘t practice here. I could not find a job in New York for an accountant. I met my wife and we married in Germany.  I met her (inaudible).  We had a 6 month old baby; we loaded everything we had in the car and drove down the east coast line, she had some friends from the Air Force Hospital, so I thought I could find a job.  We then drove down to Flordia…..nothing. I figured let’s go to California, I always loved California. I might as well have stayed in Berlin, although I have never been there.  Our last big stop was Texas. A collegue of mine said, “Al, if you ever come to Texas you have got to visit us”. So on our way to California we stoped in Texas.                                                                                                                 &#13;
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              <text>ORAL HISTORY PROJECT&#13;
TITLE: CREHST ORAL HISTORY 2003   &#13;
INTERVIEW DATE: 2003&#13;
INTERVIEW LOCATION: UNKNOWN&#13;
INTERVIEWER: UNKNOWN  &#13;
INTERVIEWED: BOB SMITH&#13;
TRANSCRIBER:  JUDY SIMPSON&#13;
LENGTH: 10:01 MINUTES&#13;
                           &#13;
INTERVIEWER: Bob Smith everyone.&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: Bob you came to us from Kansas. What brought you out this direction?  To the Tri-Cities. &#13;
&#13;
BOB:  Well I had been a member of the Kansas National Guard back at Pittsburg, KS. It was 1951 and the Korean situation was going on; the Federal Government made active about five different towns around southeast Kansas, and my town was one of them. (Bayberry 159 Next sentence I do not understand what he is saying).  They sent us up here to Fort Lewis and that is how I ended up in this part of the country.&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: What did you think of this area when you first arrived? &#13;
&#13;
BOB: Well I really thought it was pretty nice. In Kansas it kind of gets hot in the summertime….110...120 was not that unusual. Here it is maybe 100…105….sometimes it may get a 110. Winters here are milder than they were in Kansas. I just liked the area here.&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: Right, liked the area.  I have here on my paper that you and your wife had the same babysitter when you were young. Could you tell us a little bit about that and how you met? &#13;
&#13;
BOB: Yeah, we were both born in a little town called Cherryville, KS; actually we met at the old community house which is a couple blocks down here. When I did start work here in 1953. To live in Richland you had to be working out at the Hanford Project. Single people stayed in the dormitories, and the other people who their daughters and sons workers had their own houses that they lived with their Mom and Dad with. Well I met this gal at the Community Dance, because that is where single people could meet it was a non-alcoholic event. She asked me “Where I was from” and I told her and she said “What! I was born there too!” Three thousand populations in Kansas. I thought that was strange.  I found out later that her mom knew my mom and actually her babysitter was also my babysitter. So, I it was unusual that we would meet out here. &#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: Growing-up and working in the “50’s” could you tell us a little about some the Cold War preparations occurring?&#13;
&#13;
BOB:  Well, the Cold War preparations, like I say, I got here to work at Hanford in “53” and they were just in the process of building the 105 K East and the 105 K West reactors out on the project there. They were the newest type; they were production reactors not the commercial reactors to make electricity. They’d keep plutonium for the atomic bomb. Richland was kind of known for one of the fast growing cities in the nations. Especially even a couple years before I was, they had the highest birth rate in the nation, because it seemed like 90% of the people were in the 20’s to 40’s like that…had lots of kids. It was later known as the “Atomic City” because it was one of the two places where the bomb was built. &#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: Being in the fastest growing city in the nation at the time then; what were some of the recreation actives and forms of entertainment in the area?                        &#13;
&#13;
BOB: Well of course, you have the Columbia River right out here; lots of people would go boating, fishing.  We did have, we still have an outfit called “The Richland Light Opera”. It amazes me what kind of talent we have in the Tri-Cities.  People who work on a project is work in Kennewick or Pasco. They could put on plays that were real good, outstanding.  The same thing with the “, Richland Light Opera”; which was a musical group, people would join in from the Tri-Cities, they had fantastic voices. So basically you can watch your own community with what they could come up with. We had the Atomic Frontier’s Day Races; also the Atomic Cup race started in 1966 out here. Which Budweiser is pretty active in winning now, and was then too. We had those to go to; also, hunting and fishing there were good areas around here to do that. That’s what I did in Kansas. Their were ski slopes up around Mt. Rainier, so really it was the ideal location.     &#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: And with so many people here could you tell us a little bit about the housing situation?&#13;
&#13;
BOB: Yeah, the housing; I got here in “53” and it still was a government town; run by the government. General Electric had the contract; to all the business in town paid rent to their stores they had their business in. I lived in the dormitory it was $17.50 a month rent….it would be nice.  So, when my wife and I decided to get married we had to signup on the list to get a house, because all the houses were government housing and they were built, they were designed by a guy in Spokane who was well known for his designing houses. So, we put in for a house maybe a month or so before we got married, and we ended up with a “B” house, duplex house one floor type thing.  An “A” house was a duplex type that was two story. The houses were just numbered; “A house”, “B house”, “C house”, clear up through to “Y house”, I live in a “Y” house now. It is a recent house. In 1957 the government turned it over to the city and the people got to buy the houses. People with their business’ got to by their building so… if you hear about alphabet houses that is how they got started. &#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: You mentioned that General Electric was one of the companies around here. What other effects of business were around the area at the time?             &#13;
&#13;
BOB: Well now, you had your private business around town, uh Western Auto would get their franchise to do that. As far as other companies; Welch’s Grape Juice was over in Kennewick; Port of Pasco in Kennewick they had a lot of shipping; they had a lot of fruit and vegetables in the Tri-Cities area here. As far as local businesses’ there weren’t to many, Welch’s Grape Juice, and Lampson’s Crane Company which made cranes that are sent all over the world and they about still make the biggest cranes and crawlers for NASA. So there were not very many businesses, local business that got franchises from ……………………  &#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER:  As a radiation time keeper what were you in charge of or responsible to do? &#13;
&#13;
BOB: Okay well, my first job was a clerk typist.  I probably should mention a little bit about that. Being stationed at Fort Lewis we would come to Yakima Firing Center, a couple of times during the year. My buddy and I hitchhike to Yakima, so we were out there hitchhiking and some guy pulls up in a nice new convertible Oldsmobile, brand new, we got in and we were not bashful about asking questions “Where did you get a car like this? or You must have a good job to afford this.” He said, “I got a pretty good job”, “What do you do?” “I am a guard a showman over at Hanford atomic works.” “Where’s that at?” “Well that’s 80 miles from Yakima.” “Gee, whiz what kind of money do you make?” We were not bashful. He said “I make a $100 a week” and that was pretty good for 1951 and I said, “WOW, that’s pretty good, because I just left Kansas as a clerk typist for clay manufacturing making $30 a week as a clerk typist” “Boy, I could learn to be a patrolman for that”. Anyway, I basically put in for a job, and wound-up as a clerk typist making $60 a week. I did that for one year and then I went into radiation time keeper I did that for five years; I followed construction workers around, because they were constantly building reactors here. Following them to radiation zones keeping time on the “radiation zone” because we only allow a certain amount radiation to leave. We had pistol decimeter but they weren’t the kind they have now a days, self-readers that you could look at the light. In those days, you would have to turn the pistons turned in an eye and you would have to keep time on them and that is what I did for five years. Eventually, I went into RH monitoring and that is what I did from “59” until I retired in “93”.&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER:  Our time is just about up here.  If you could just leave us with one quick impact …What was the biggest impact on your life in living this area and your job?&#13;
&#13;
BOB: Probably, realizing something magic about the Hanford Atomic Works. Man…Atomics that sounds interesting.  I must have been a little curiosity about science, because in being here when they were making the plutonium and top secret information.  We didn’t know what these things looked like and it was all kind of fast ending. If we go too far we still have time for one more name.     &#13;
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              <text>Toivo Pippo</text>
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              <text>00:22:54</text>
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              <text>ORAL HISTORY PROJECT&#13;
TITLE:   CREHST ORAL HISTORY: Toivo Piippo&#13;
INTERVIEW DATE:  JULY 2003&#13;
INTERVIEW LOCATION: Unknown&#13;
INTERVIEWER:  Joyce&#13;
INTERVIEWED:  Toivo Piippo&#13;
TRANSCRIBER:  Judy Simpson&#13;
LENGTH:  23 minutes&#13;
&#13;
TOIVO:  I am from Astoria, OR.  My first name is Toivo.  There is pure Finnish unadulterated blood in there.  There is no mixture of any kind.  When I came to Astoria I got a scholarship to the University of Oregon for basketball.  My sophomore year there our squad played Ohio State for NCAA Championship.  We were looking to win that game.  There were five of us on that squad from Astoria, all Finns. My next year at school the Draft came along.  If I remember correctly, Washington D. C. had a large bowl full of numbers, just pieces of paper.  They were going to start drafting guys, of course, at that time we did not have any idea of what was happening.   So, all of a sudden on the radio they were talking about these numbers, if your number was called you were going to be drafted.  The only thing I ever won was that draft.  I got the first number, which was 158.  I have never won anything else…. ever.  I am sorry that I won that time.  That did not turn out so hot. That was the end of that basketball game. &#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: Then I understand that you had to go to training.  To pilot training.  Can you tell us a little about that?  &#13;
&#13;
TOIVO:  This was peacetime and I was drafted out of Astoria.  Everything was disorganized; the draft people, the rules, and the regulations.  So, when I went to Astoria to be drafted, I asked for a deferment.  This was in the middle of the basketball season. They did not understand that, nobody understood that. That I should be able to finish school, no…. they did not understand that. So I was drafted and sent to Portland, OR and got in a line of four that stretched out to the street.  We did not know what the lines were for. I was part way into the building and there was an enlisted man at a desk and he said, “Fellow do you know where you are going?” and I said “I think I am going into the Army”.  He then looked at me and said “Do you known where you are going if you stay in that line?”  I said “No”.  He said “You are going to be in the tanks in Texas next week”.  He said, “Do you want to go there?”  I said, “No”.   If you go over to the next line over, you go in that line you are going to windup in the Louisiana swamps.  He said “They have mosquitoes   &#13;
down there.” I said “I do not want to go there.”  The third line come to find out was up in the snow all that stuff.  I did not want to do that. The last line you could sign-up for a two year hitch, but this was regular Army at that time. Air force would not separate there, this was just regular Army.  I was sent to Moffat Field which is on Bay Shore from San Fran Cisco, south a little ways.  There is a large airfield there by the name of Moffat Field.  I think it is still there. Upon arriving there we were the first group of draftees to come to this place.  Here you were trained left-right, left-right, canes and all that good stuff. When we got there, they had strings of sidewall tents, with wooden sides and a canvas top. My tent was the second one from the beginning, the first tent. The next morning we were out there, they had a can tied to a nail and you had to go around and pickup cigarette butts, “Police the area” they call it. Next to us was a tall skinny guy, he looked familiar to me, but he was in G.I’s underwear, which was huge and baggy, kind of funny looking. I could not place him right away. I found out a short time later.  This was “Jimmy Stewart” he was living next to me. He was living with three enlisted people.  This was peacetime, and these guys were tough characters……man, I would not want to tell you the things that they did to the ninth or whatever.  I was appointed the coach; the guy wanted me to be the coach of the base basketball team. We started to practice, and we had very good players from around the United States.  We played our first game, and he was at the first game.  After the game I went to the room where we pickup our mail.  They have the alphabetical boxes.  Well, Piippo was alphabetically close to his name. So, when I was there picking up my mail, he would show up and we struck up a speaking relationship, kind of a friendship.  He would always say, “Nice game”.  He would make a friendly comment. He came to all our games, and he was a real good moral character. He trained us to march.  Everyday we went out and marched, of course, we were civilians. He had a high voice.   So, we would march around for a little while and pretty soon we were all out of step, and bumping one another.  He would turn around and look. He would get exercised, and his voice would go up higher, and higher.  Then we would start all over and still get mixed up. Finally, he would just literally scream. Boy, he could put it way up there. We weren’t laughing at him, we weren’t laughing at the marching, and we were laughing at him, because he got so exercised.  A short time later he was over that. Boy…he taught us, the left-rights and all that stuff. He came to all our basketball games.  At that time, they had what was called a “Dayroom” as large as this here. In there are magazines, Colliers and Life, and you could play pool.  He would be in there on Saturday mornings sitting by himself in a chair, and very quite. People then would go to him, and talk to him. He would hardly talk to any body. Being that I was acquainted with him, I got the courage to sit down with him in the beginning.  We started to chat and I got to know him pretty well. One morning, he was writing a thing out on some paper. I said, “What are you doing?” He said, “I am going to be on KGO tonight at 6 o’clock.” He’s going to sell War Bonds and he’s going to making a speech. I looked at him and thought gee this guy never talks.  How’s he going to make a speech? Many of us turned the radio on, and he came on he said “My, my, name is James Stewart.  I am a lonely Corporal in the Army.  I am not an important person.” He was very impressive, really impressive. So, when we came back the next morning we went into the “Dayroom.”  All these people in the “Dayroom “stood-up and clapped for him. They thought that was a big deal.  A short-time later I went to the library, a big base library.  He was in there studying. I went up and asked him “What are you doing?” He said “I’m taking a correspondence course to get a commission from the Air Force from the Army.”   Come to find out he was a graduate of Penn, I think. He really studied, he was a student, so we chatted for awhile, all of sudden he told me “Well I passed it and tomorrow I’m leaving to go to the Air Force”.  There were guys like me around who had came out of college, and we could qualify that.  We followed him right into the Air Force. Like sheep going over a hurdle. I did not know a thing about airplanes, anything never touched one.  Why you going into the Air Force? Well, Stewart’s going.&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER:  So did you continue to serve with Jimmy Stewart and go through the training? &#13;
&#13;
TOIVO: Uh, Can I tell one more story? &#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: Sure. &#13;
&#13;
TOIVO: The last training exercise we had on marching; this was in a valley near Stanford University.  There were hillsides up there, we were suppose to go up that hill, marching on a dirt road, an airplane was suppose to come by and he is suppose to holler “Hit the ditch”, we are suppose to jump under whatever was there. They had issued us with uniforms that had with huge pockets (here). All of a sudden he hollered “Hit the ditch”, and we went hit our belly on the ditch. I looked up and right in front of my face was a bunch of a huge bunch of grapes. We all looked around there, and there were grapes everywhere.  We were in the middle of a winery vineyard with grapes in it. When the airplane was gone he hollered “Fall in”.  We went out there and he looked at this company and everybody had pockets full of grapes. His voice went up a couple of octaves. He settled down, and we went back to the base.  There was a “One Star” General’s car waiting for him.  I guess they gave him the word, two thousand dollars worth of grapes disappeared out of the orchard. Well, he wound up in England as I did.  We were 10 air miles apart.  I think he flew 17 missions, which was not all that many, but he was doing.   A very patriotic fellow.&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: Who (Meant to say “What”) is the average number of missions that a pilot would fly any idea? &#13;
&#13;
TOIVO: Well, it doesn’t work out that way. I was there early in the air war.  London was still being bombed, and it was a mess down there. You started to fly in combat, and there across the channel German fighters were waiting for you. We never had daytime escort there, and after we made it across the channel &#13;
we made our way to a target. This is a long story. He flew 17 of those things, and I flew 67. The way that works out is that…they said “Twenty and you get to go home”, well when you got 18 they extended that number. When you got the next number they extended that number. Some of those people that were flying, well they were not warriors. Guys that could function under military conditions up in the airplane. Many of them got out for that reason, they just couldn’t. They were dangerous in there, and others found ways to try to get out. The point was, if you were reasonably functioning warrior, so to speak; they wanted to keep you in so they would extend you five; because to replace you, and replace that crew would take a lot of training. Going through the process of finding people that could function under those battle conditions.  So, there was not a set, they publicized that, but it really did not work out that way.&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: Can you describe the plane?  How many in the crew, and what their roles were?&#13;
&#13;
TOIVO: This was a B-26 a multi-engine bomber.  Made by “Martin Company”.  Last week on the tube was an hour long program about the B-26 and what went on, most of the things that went on.  So, it was the first airplane that came out with a tri-cycle landing gear, wheels up front, and wheels on the side. It had four bladed props the first one and it also had a hub in front of the propellers that had a break an electrical break inside there.  This system controlled the pitch angle of your propeller; it was automatic so if you needed more power it would take a bigger bite then.  It could reduce itself to eighteen degrees the blade, but the way it turned out the brake failed often; then the propellers went flat and you could hear them, wind-up and POW. There were eight people on board; there was a bombardier up front; two pilots; an engineer with a double, double-double, fifty caliber machine guns; two waist gunners; and there was a turf in the far back. If you were flying a lead mission (how to get) there was another person on board.&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: Did you frequently fly the lead position?&#13;
&#13;
TOIVO: Rarely. I was what you call a “bomb jockey.” That meant that you could function in the Air Force, which I didn’t enjoy at all. I thought that was a bummer, before that word ever came around. I was a “bomb jockey” and I just took bombs over there and dropped them and back. That kind of thing.&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: At any time during your missions, in later years, did they ask, did they add fighter cover for you?    &#13;
&#13;
TOIVO:  Good question. I had great hostility toward this part of war efforts. When we went there we were young kids; eighteen and nineteen. When we started to fly there they sent the first twelve missions across the channel to a place called “Emodin Electrical” place and none of those planes came back that afternoon.  I thought I must be a lousy pilot because I didn’t get to go. Afterwards I said, “Boy, I lucked out of that one”. Twelve more went out the next day and they never came back. So they increased the altitude to medium altitude fifteen, sixteen, or eighteen pounds. Over there is a bomber command, and here is your air field. The bomber commands there are high ranking people who make up the missions where you are going and the whole bag.  They call up at night to your airfield and give you all that information. You do as they ordered you to do.  These people never had never got out of that desk.  I don’t know I think, because we did things that we thought was completely senseless. Flying in the air, people getting killed.  I often wonder, I wonder today. Here I am a dinosaur and flew a lot of missions. Those guys who made that up I wonder if they did anything besides pushing a pencil. I still ache about that considerably. &#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: Is there, uh I’ve heard there was a nickname for the B-26 squadrons.  They called it……&#13;
&#13;
TOIVO: Many, they were all bad.&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: But, you talked about the first twenty-four that went over and did not come back, and eventually call the B-26 “The Widow Maker”.&#13;
&#13;
TOIVO: No, No, that was a……. I happened to be in the first B-26’s that were sent out to “McNeal Field” in Tampa. We were single engine students that just graduated.  We were very embroiled pilots. Man….and so here they had this B-26 airplane….refresh you question again. &#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: Did they call the B-26 the “Widow Maker”? Because of these first…..&#13;
&#13;
TOIVO: Yes.  I will go back to that. That airplane crashed so often that there was a daily crash of a B-26. You could be on the airfield and you heard the break was failing, and the propellers were like this.  They didn’t bite anything so the thing went down. Daily these things went down. I think 150 of those airplanes were lifting in Tampa Bay, and uh “McNeal Field” quite a horrendous number.  There were other defects that were never taken care of before the airplane was released to fly. All kinds of, I could go in a long story about the defects that were never ….so here these young kids came over there and they never had …and they were flying a plane that was untested that killed people daily.  What else? &#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: Oh I’m sorry I was going to ask….we have three minutes left with Mr. Piippo                         &#13;
&#13;
UNKNOWN: You have two and one half minutes left now, Joyce.&#13;
&#13;
JOYCE:  Would you mind if any of these teachers here ask you a question?&#13;
&#13;
TOIVO: Do it.&#13;
&#13;
JOYCE: Anyone have a question for Mr. Piippo?&#13;
&#13;
UNKNOWN: I do. Hear about that in NCAA championship.&#13;
&#13;
TOIVO: That the best part. &#13;
&#13;
UNKNOWN: I bet your not hostel about that at all.&#13;
&#13;
TOIVO: No, No not at all. Played Ohio State, the Pacific Coast was divided into a “Northern” and “Southern” division those champions played each other.  They then were west of the Mississippi and played Ohio State, in Evansville. That was good stuff. I was a sophomore, and I was not a big contributor to that effort. Mostly I think that I was a spectator.&#13;
&#13;
UNKNOWN: How many people would they tend to gain in those years?&#13;
&#13;
TOIVO: The University of Oregon about eight or nine thousand. They still do the same thing. A lot of people.&#13;
&#13;
UNKNOWN: Mr. Piippo when you got back from the war, how old was you?&#13;
&#13;
TOIVO:  I was 24. That is not the important part, when I came back I was all screwed-up.  I was grounded I was a wreck. They called it “Battle Fatigue” at that time. Today they have “Post War Trauma”, I think’ and they talk about that. I have permanent “Post War Trauma”. It is suppose to be with you forever.  It changes your personality and whatever. I went to two different hospitals for treatment for psycho stuff. They wanted to shot me full of penathoal.  Make you go…bah, bah, bah. I refused, my wife said, “You should of, you should of”. She also says “It’s not too late”. &#13;
&#13;
UNKNOWN:  Mr. Piippo what would you like us to convey to young people today, uh something to remember World War II for.&#13;
&#13;
JOYCE: Did you hear the question?&#13;
&#13;
TOIVO: Good question. My point of view; we have a certain demeanor or quality I think that is kind of indestructible, and all that stuff. When you get into combat the shell that is shot is about that tall it was an 8mm shell, and it burst in a ball so to speak-a lethal a hundred yards in every direction. Shrapnel….metal flying through the air. When you are in your airplane psychologically you want to have your feet on the ground.  Really. The first time your flying and one of these things explodes beside you; you’re sitting there and you can’t do a thing.&#13;
&#13;
JOYCE:  I am sorry you guys, I am going to have to interrupt. &#13;
&#13;
                    &#13;
&#13;
&#13;
&#13;
&#13;
&#13;
&#13;
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Richland, WA</text>
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              <text>ORAL HISTORY PROJECT&#13;
TITLE: CREHST ORAL HISTORY   2003   &#13;
INTERVIEW DATE: 2003&#13;
INTERVIEW LOCATION: UNKNOWN&#13;
INTERVIEWER:  UNKNOWN&#13;
INTERVIEWED: LEE NITTEBURG &#13;
TRANSCRIBER:  JUDY SIMPSON&#13;
LENGTH:   8:30 MINUTES&#13;
&#13;
LEE:  Okay, I grew-up on a farm in South Eastern South Dakota about two miles from next door line; about twenty miles from Sioux Falls.  I don’t know if any of you have been back in that area, but it’s a farming community where I grew up. When you go across the Missouri River on the west side of it; it is just like going from one country to another. It goes from farming into cattle country and things like that. My Dad had a farm that was 200 acres.  He rented 80 acres.  I was born there in 1925. I had an older brother during World War II; he did not pass the physical because he had a heart attack, and he was about 25 so he didn’t get in. Then in “43” or “44,” then “43” and January of “44” I took my physical.  I did not pass because I had problems with my feet. So I went into the farming for four years; we had 200 acres that we were farming.&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER:  So what brought you out……out here?&#13;
&#13;
LEE: I went to the South Dakota School of Minds in Rapid City. At that time there were airplane industries; Boeings, there were other airline manufactures, GE from here. I visited our colleges and talked with those who were graduating, and told us about the area and the type of work. I decided I wanted to get involved in the type of work here. So that is how come I ended up here in 1951 and it was during the Cold War; that was way they were getting so many tech grads until they were called. Graduates out of college coming out here.  The story was that there were 250 tech grads and 250 secretaries same time. I mentioned secretaries’ fact because Bob’s wife was a secretary in the design group I was in. My wife to be worked down the hall and eventually we got married. &#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER:  It says here that you have obtained your Masters through the GE College of Nuclear Knowledge. &#13;
&#13;
LEE: That’ right.&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: What is that? &#13;
&#13;
LEE: Ok, GE had a night school going on -a class a week, so it took quite awhile. You went to college at night school here in one of the dormitories which was down where Rite-Aide is now was the women’s dormitories; the men’s dormitories were on the other side of the Federal Building complex. You had to graduate from one of the universities; Oregon State, Oregon University, Washington State, or Idaho. I took Idaho, because it was one of the few that you did not have to put in one quarter at the school if you had not graduated from there originally. That is how come I ended up with a degree from Idaho, but they could not issue the degrees here through GE. &#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: And what was your local job here in the Tri-Cities area.&#13;
&#13;
LEE: I came here I went to work in construction engineering.  I worked as a mechanical engineer; I had a Bachelor’s and Bachelor’s Degree in mechanical engineering. I worked primarily in ventaltion; filteration of the reactors, and so on, eventually did that. I did a lot of piping anywhere from this size (shows his little finger) and smaller up to 2 to 3 feet in diamerter. I did; steamlines, waterlines, airlines, and various types of facilities. I worked in all the reactors out here in the plant doing revisions of these desiginer visions of these various things primarily ventaltion and piping. I also worked in all the separation plants and all the main labatories on the plant.&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: In order to do that you must have had some type of clearance.&#13;
&#13;
LEE: Right&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: “Q” clearance or Top Secret clearance. What were the culture and the feeling out at Hanford?&#13;
&#13;
LEE: Okay, when I came to work here you had to have a “Q” clearance to work in any of the government work facilities. I did not have a “Q” clearance.  They sent me on off site inspection.  I was hired in June 1951.  I was sent to an area near Chicago, I worked there for about 3 months. Then I went to Stanton, I got my clearance, but they needed help back in Elizabeth, New Jersey next to New York City, so I went back there and had a great big…a lot of fabrication work going on there. Vessels that were going to be installed out here.  I got back in December of…. “51“.  You had to have 3 to 4 months of rotation in three different organizations.  Then I went to work in the construction engineering, and then I went to work in nuclear fields out in the 300 area.  I was offered jobs in all these locations, but I wanted into design engineering because I enjoyed that. I was glad that I did. &#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: Okay, What did you and your wife do for an evening of fun?&#13;
&#13;
LEE: Well, like Bob, we went dancing up here at the Community House. These plays were being put on primarly in Richland. We ended up in a “C” house when we got married.  We were married two weeks after Bob and Vi were married in the CUP church, in 1954. In 1956 when things cooled off, we didn’t like the “C” house because our particular locatation the houses were built around a grassy area and the back of our house faced the street. We decided we would buy a house over in Kennewick, so we moved to Kennewick. Both Betty, my wife, my late wife and I liked to see senery and we would travel around the area. We would go to the coast and go clam digging.  A minister we had taught us how to do that. We enjoyed that. We would just travel around when they were building the farms up north of here. We would get on these paved roads and all of a sudden…..end of road.  You backup where you came from to get somewhere else. &#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: What has been the biggest change to the Tri-Cities?&#13;
&#13;
LEE: I would say, that the expanison; the number of companies that have come in; privationization; and the number of people that have been brought in, do to that. When we bought our first house after we got our family going we decided it was too small, we had a house built out about three miles out of Kennewick and within about eight years we are completely surrounded.  We ended up selling that and that is where one of the school houses on 19th Street is located there in Kennewick. It is the land I used to irrigate.       &#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: Wow, I see that all the time. I see we have run out of time.&#13;
                                      &#13;
   &#13;
                &#13;
&#13;
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              <text>ORAL HISTORY PROJECT&#13;
TITLE: CREHST ORAL HISTORY -2003   &#13;
INTERVIEW DATE: JULY 10, 2003&#13;
INTERVIEW LOCATION: UNKNOWN&#13;
INTERVIEWER:  UNKNOWN&#13;
INTERVIEWED:  EVA DUNIGAN&#13;
TRANSCRIBER:  JUDY SIMPSON&#13;
LENGTH: 24:26 MINUTES   &#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER:  This is Eva Dunigan. Did I say that right?&#13;
&#13;
EVA: Yes.  That is with one “n”.&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER:  With one “n” that’s right.&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: She came out of Kentucky many years ago. Her birthday is coming up the end of the month, so remember. Send a post card or something. She married Paul in 1942.&#13;
&#13;
EVA:  Don’t for get FX.    &#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: Oh, FX? Who is FX?&#13;
&#13;
EVA: Francis Xavier&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: Francis Xavier, okay. They both worked at the University of Chicago, and if you guys are knew to their history a lot of the real center piece of Nuclear power the ideas came out of the University of Chicago with Enrico Fermi and Robert Oppenheimer. If I understand this right, you were able to work with these fellows, and cross paths with them.&#13;
&#13;
EVA: Oh, yes I worked for them.  I took dictation, typed-up their reports. So that they could send the reports out. In those days we had dittos and mimeographs we didn’t have any other way to do it. &#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER:  The other thing here is when later on just the when the work got going. You and your husband came on out here to Pasco.&#13;
&#13;
EVA:  We were transferred here. My husband was transferred by Dupont. Dupont didn’t transfer me they didn’t take me on until I got here. The day I got here I signed up with Dupont. &#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: Can you tell us what “Enrico Fermi”, what he was like?  Are you guys’ familiar with Enrico Fermi? He was the one that did experiments, if I remember right, under the bleachers of University of Chicago as the first chain reaction.&#13;
&#13;
EVA:  Yea, right, that was Decent, I think that was David, in December 1943; it wasn’t “43”, and I don’t know I forgot the date. We were transferred there in the spring if “43” and we were there until December and then transferred out here. So we left Chicago, December 31, and every one in our apartment was all dressed-up for the  New Years Eve party; except for us, we were dressed to go down to get on  the Northern Pacific and come out here. We had studied up on the state of Washington and thought we were coming to the “Evergreen State”. &#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: So what did you think when you got here?&#13;
                &#13;
EVA: Well when we arrived in Pasco, actually the train stopped about, it seemed to me like about at Ethiopia. But I guess it wasn’t that far out, but it seemed like it at least, because we had to walk on the tracks for quite awhile until we got to the station. The Pullman cars were way back at the end, of course, like they are. There were a lot of other cars in front of us that had GI’s that were going to Fort Lewis. There were about six of the men being transferred out, and I was with them.  A lot of gentlemen opened doors for me and stuff. &#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: So when you first stepped out of that train what was……..the?&#13;
&#13;
EVA:  It was in January, it was the middle of the night, and it was darker than I don’t know what.  We then went into the….First of all, the smallest town I’d ever seen. The smallest town I’d ever lived in was Tulsa, OK, of course that’s not really small. When we got here I just thought it was nowhere. We walked on the ties and walked along the walk until we got to the station, and then we went in; there were real dim bulbs on the ceiling.  All these people were in there, well I guess there in their work clothes, very un-kept though.  They are sitting around and lying around sleeping, some of them even on the ground. It was kind of scary. They kept asking people if they were with the “operations” or “construction”.  I happened to hear my husband say “He was with “operations”. So I said, “Operations! Operations!” because we had been separated.  The reason they were doing that because they took these “panel cars” or whatever you want to call them, for the people on construction, and took them out to Hanford. We just went to the “Transit Quarters” which they called it then.  They had just opened the week before one-way; the Hanford House now. So we did have some place to stay that day. It was still like I said, “So black you couldn’t see anything”.  There was one traffic light in Pasco, and later I learned that it was at 4th and Lewis. That was about the only light we saw, because there were no lights on the bridge; although I could see the river down in the darkness. So, that was quite a different experience than anything I had ever had.&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: Did you think most of the people knew what they were doing there? What was the point and what they were there for? &#13;
&#13;
EVA: Well they knew what their job was, if that is what you mean.  I don’t know what they knew. I knew what I knew, of course; we had the “office secrecy” we did not talk about it. So, I should not talk much about things I tell people. I was never released from that “office secrecy”. &#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: So may I interrupt you? So before you left you had to take an oath of secrecy? &#13;
&#13;
EVA: Well, I went to work at the University, and I was with the “MedAllergic Laboratories” there, in the information office.  That is were we got our reports and did our secretarial work for all these “PhD’s” and what have you. Also, they had the “Engineer” the “Army Engineers” you know like….what’s his name….&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER:  General Groves?&#13;
&#13;
EVA: Yeah, Yeah, General Groves. They had an office for them, and if their secretaries or whatever it was were ill, well one of us was called to work for then.  So, I also worked for the General. I really called them by mostly “Gentleman General” or most of the other ones at the University we would call “Doctor”, because most of them were PhD‘s at least.&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER:  So did you have opportunity to meet “Mr. Oppenheimer”?&#13;
&#13;
EVA: Yes, I met him and Dr. Teller, Dr. Fraunk. I also, did work for them. I took dication for him. I happen to be able to understand a lot of accents. They were speaking English, but they had accents, but I grew-up with the people, a lot of people from Geremany. So I had grown-up with that, I didn‘t have a problem with that. I worked for a lot of them.&#13;
&#13;
UNKNOWN: Because of question system, are you doing “Okay”?&#13;
&#13;
EVA: Yeah, I’m doing okay. &#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: Living in this area, I have heard some stories about…..for recreation type things that people did around here. What was there to do?&#13;
&#13;
EVA:  Well I….We went to work (hah, hah) and so…the first week we had a room with a couple that lived in Kennewick.  They had a duplex, a two bedroom duplex.  We were in, we were staying with them and she, we had our, we were more fortunate than a lot people, because she had our meals there too; she cook and served our meals; and packed our lunches. Now our lunches were sort of strange and kind of different too. We might have: a bear sandwich; a deer sandwich; or a stuffing sandwich.  That was the strangest that I have ever.  You know homemade mayonise on some bread, and put some bread stuffing off the turkey, you know, and then put that in the white bread. I must admit that went in my waste basket. We were at 300 Area, of course there was really not……in Richland there was the cafeteria, big cafeteria, which was…well that building right across the street from the bank. We’d go in there in the morning and they had so many people, and they were cooking so fast. That you’d get a pancake and it was raw in the middle, but the outside was burned.  The same with your egg…the outside of your egg would be almost black, and the inside would be just not cooked.  I mean really raw not just a runny yoke, but the….That was not a happy time for our breakfast, that is why I said we were fortunate that we had our meals with them. So we were in there until our house was built, and we got a “B” House on Hunt.  When we arrived they were digging basements, and then we go to move into the house, it was ready to live in in May. That was kind of different too. &#13;
&#13;
UNKNOWN: What year was that?&#13;
&#13;
EVA: Pardon.&#13;
 &#13;
UNKNOWN: What year was it?&#13;
&#13;
EVA: 1944.  May “44” is when we got into the house; like I said we were in Kennewick in a room there.  I worked in “300” and then, of course, like I said I had been in information, in Chicago, so you would think I would go into information. In those days, it was working like them, like you worked for the people in army.  You didn’t go in with your origin, you went into something completely different, and so I went into payroll. That was okay, I just knew how much everybody made then.&#13;
 &#13;
UNKNOWN: How did you like the winds? The dust storms.&#13;
&#13;
EVA: I didn’t like those. I especially didn’t like it, sometimes when I lived on Hunt. Sometimes the buses would breakdown; the bus would breakdown I guess from the sand, I don’t know why.  You would get on the bus to go home, and you would end up walking. So you’d walk home out George Washington Way, by the time I would get home….of course we wore skirts and nylons.  I had nylons, because I got those in Oklahoma before we left. Anyway, that sand went right threw it.  I’d get home and have little blood spots all over my: arms; face; legs; and nose. If I happened to get home first, I said “Don’t speak to me” until I get this washed off. We had a very quite time. As far as past-time there were all kinds of clubs starting and that sort of thing.  Like I said though, “We were pretty busy because we did get to work a lot of overtime”. You had Sunday off, but not Sunday if you had to do your laundry, your house, to shovel out the sand.&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: Do you have any children?&#13;
&#13;
EVA: Ah, yes.  I had one son. He works for the DOA, and his name is Paul FX Dunigan Jr.&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: How was it with him growing up in Richland? &#13;
&#13;
EVA: He likes Richland. Because he wanted to come back to see us after he got his degrees.  He came back&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: So when you got here were they just starting up the schools? &#13;
&#13;
EVA: Well, we lived closer to Jefferson School.  Jefferson School was going at the time we moved into &#13;
Richland.  That is all we really knew about the school, because at that time I didn’t have nobody at school.&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: After they dropped the bomb….did you. What was the sense, of the feeling of the people of the community? Was it dog low then? Or do you know?&#13;
&#13;
EVA: Well I think people were excited they thought, well we finally know what’s going on. I new they were making something to blow stuff-up.  I didn’t know when or how they were going to do it. Because I handling all those reports all the time.  Even though I was in Payroll out here I still knew what we were working for. Yeah, that was very good. I was telling somebody awhile ago, after this gentleman talking.  I got letters from my bother and his buddies who were in Japan. Their Company was getting ready to go into the main storage (inaudible), instead they got to go into occupation, and they went to school for about a year.  None of them were getting killed, you know what I mean.&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: So, so, after the mission was completed you guys must have decided to stay here or did you move away and come back…..or.&#13;
&#13;
EVA:  Oh, we stayed here.  My husband like it, he was kept as an engineer, he liked to work. He changed companies though, you know what I mean.  They were with Dupont and GE.  He went on, and he was with Bechtel and then he was with Westinghouse. The last few years he had the same office with three different companies. He was out at “300 Area”.&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER:  You guys have questions?&#13;
&#13;
UNKNOWN: Did a lot of the people that you worked with did very many of them stay here? Did a lot of them move on and did not come back here that you know of?&#13;
&#13;
EVA: The ones I worked with, you want to know where they are now or what did they do or what?&#13;
&#13;
UNKNOWN:  Well did some stay?&#13;
&#13;
EVA: Some stayed a lot of them left, especially the girls, because they went back because their fiancés, husbands and so forth were out of the service and they had jobs where they had been. All the gentlemen I work for are dead and a lot of the other people too.  &#13;
&#13;
UNKNOWN: Were all the dams in the river when you came?&#13;
&#13;
EVA: No, there was Bonneville.&#13;
&#13;
UNKNOWN: There’s only one.&#13;
&#13;
EVA: And then the one that is up that way on the…..&#13;
&#13;
UNKNOWN: Grand, Grand the big Grand Coulie.&#13;
&#13;
EVA: Coulie, yeah Coulie.  The one at Wenatchee, I guess.&#13;
&#13;
UNKNOWN: Oh, so the river was a lot different then.&#13;
&#13;
EVA: The Snake did not have all those dams on it. &#13;
&#13;
UNKNOWN: So the rivers were a lot different when you went down to them, and stuff I mean, as far as.&#13;
&#13;
UNKNOWN: You were here in the Flood of “47”?&#13;
&#13;
EVA: Yes I surly was. &#13;
&#13;
UNKNOWN: And that was an exciting time, because we were all flooded in here.       &#13;
   &#13;
EVA: Yeah, that was 1948, in fact the reason I know is because my son was born in June of 1948, and my mother-in-law was coming out from Boston.  They had to go by way of Vernita to go all that way to get into the station to bring her out. Then some friends of ours did stay with us just before that.  They had a room in Pasco they couldn’t get to work at the “200 Area” very easily everyday, so they stayed with us. &#13;
&#13;
UNKNOWN: So, now what areas flooded? &#13;
&#13;
EVA: Well the river was up here, it was up to where the hill is-up to George Washington. Is that what you mean?  &#13;
&#13;
UNKNOWN: Up, Up above the dike? &#13;
&#13;
EVA: No the dike wasn’t there. &#13;
&#13;
UNKNOWN: Okay, alright.&#13;
&#13;
EVA: They put the dike up during the flood in fact.  That’s why we didn’t get any top soil out on Davison where we live. &#13;
&#13;
UNKNOWN: They couldn’t get across the Yakima River.  &#13;
&#13;
EVA: They couldn’t get across the Yakima and they couldn’t cross the Columbia into Kennewick either, remember?&#13;
&#13;
NO RESPONSE.&#13;
&#13;
EVA: The other year where the river was up pretty high well, down at the end of New Comer. We were living there, we just moved out of Davis house just before that.  Well the river was up the other year just as it had been that year. And the road, the bike road was covered down there. &#13;
&#13;
UNKNOWN: What exactly did they have your husband working on out there? What exactly was he doing?&#13;
&#13;
EVA: He was a chemist.  He was working on Alana Lab. &#13;
&#13;
UNKNOWN: He was working on………..&#13;
&#13;
EVA: Alana Lab. &#13;
&#13;
UNKNOWN: And he was creating what…..what were they…..&#13;
&#13;
EVA: We were not talking about that remember? Remember I told you. &#13;
&#13;
UNKNOWN: I can push. &#13;
&#13;
UNKNOWN: I heard that when you came into Richland you had to have security clearance just to be (not audible). Just too even go. (?) &#13;
&#13;
EVA: We didn’t have to. Now we came in an old car, like an old pasture car, like I said the operation people got brought out here from the station to what is now the Hanford House. In pasture cars, but the people in construction were taken on out to Hanford.  Well they were just trucks with some wooden seats put on it on each side of these great big trucks, and that is the way they came in. The reason I said we were fortunate that we got with this other couple in Kennewick, because at that time they had just opened some jobs in Richland for men but they didn’t have women’s jobs built yet, so I would have had to live in the jobs out of Hanford and then go into the “300 Area” and he would have lived in Richland.  So that made it a little bit better, like I said I liked having my meals fixed, because I didn’t exactly care about cooking anyway.  &#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: So, there was a big trailer park out there.&#13;
&#13;
EVA: Oh, yes.&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: Was that saved for construction?&#13;
&#13;
EVA: That was construction families, yes.&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER:  Did you intermingle a lot with mainly the construction people or the professional people more?&#13;
&#13;
EVA:  I didn’t, I really don’t know…..When we went through sign-up we had to go out there for some of or part of the sign-up for the x-rays and all that stupid stuff. That was really the only time I was out there. When I went through their employment stuff out there.  Shortly after that they changed so then the room right next to us in the “3706 Building” was being used for most, except for the physical part. Then they moved into town before the year was up. When they got the “ADD Building” and that stood out where the Federal Building is now. We had offices there.  We moved into there. &#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER:  Do you remember roughly what the payroll was and how many people were on it? &#13;
&#13;
EVA: I don’t remember. &#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER:  There were thousands.&#13;
&#13;
EVA: For construction, yes. For operations, I don’t think so. Also, they had monthly payroll and weekly payroll.  I was in the weekly payroll, most of the time.&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: If there was one thing that you would want to, say to our students and schools to remember (UNAUDIBLE), what do you think it would be?&#13;
&#13;
EVA: I would like them to remember or hope that they would not have the same experience that we had. So many people were uprooted and unhappy.  So many people broke up because of that. I knew so many of them where the wife, this was it, she just didn’t want to stay here.  It was the end of the world; which it was. I was working it did not matter, I would rather work out here where my husband was than back in Chicago which I would have done if they had not let me come along.&#13;
&#13;
UNKNOWN: How did you feel in the fact that there was no poverty here? Everybody had a job. Everything was getting completed; there was low rent; if you needed a lawn mower you come out and got it; you needed a garden hose you got it. There was no poverty out here what so ever and if you didn’t live here you didn’t have a job.&#13;
&#13;
EVA: There was poverty in Pasco.  I saw a lot of that. Yes, that was good, but I figured we had earned it, because after all they brought us to where there was nothing they had to get us something for us to stay.             &#13;
 &#13;
INTERVIEWER: So would you be able to keep those items? So if you needed a lawn mower you’d …….&#13;
&#13;
EVA: No, you just used it.  The neighbors could use it or you had to take it back.&#13;
&#13;
UNKNOWN: Are you kind of amazed that the way it was when you came; has turned into what it is now the Tri-Cities?&#13;
&#13;
EVA: I’m glad it did.&#13;
&#13;
UNKNOWN: Oh, yeah.&#13;
&#13;
EVA: Well of course we were just going to be here, I mean that is what we were all told.  This was just going to be here until the war was over.  Well, I don’t know what war they meant, because we have had a war ever since. I ask them then and I still ask that question. Maybe someday when the wars are all over, uh.&#13;
&#13;
INTERVIEWER: Were people relieved once they got here and relieved…..that?&#13;
&#13;
EVA: Oh, yes. You have heard of the “Termination Winds” and usually toward the end of the week the winds would be really bad and we were really busy in payroll with their checks and bonds and their everything all… so they could get out of here.&#13;
&#13;
UNKNOWN:  Termination notices. &#13;
&#13;
UNKNOWN:  Noise can not understand question.&#13;
&#13;
EVA: They were scary, especially like people like….transit men from Oklahoma where they went threw tornados all the time.  They were thinking they were getting a tornado of course.  They were scary too, because I had never been in those kinds of winds and have never had sand chew me up like I was telling you. We saw them in movies.  My friend somehow got, I wrote and told them about this the tumbleweed rolling down the road and stuff like that.  They thought I was just kidding.  They thought I had seen to many westerns.  &#13;
   &#13;
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              <text>ORAL HISTORY PROJECT&#13;
&#13;
TITLE: UNKNOWN   &#13;
INTERVIEW DATE: JULY 10, 2003&#13;
INTERVIEW LOCATION: UNKNOWN  &#13;
INTERVIEWER: RENEE GACKLE&#13;
INTERVIEWED: GREG GREGER&#13;
TRANSCRIBER: JUDY SIMPSON&#13;
LENGTH: 25.20&#13;
&#13;
RENEE: Hi! We’ll open it up with a couple of questions in the beginning, and then we will open it up with you. If you have any particular question raise your hand or we will keep going.&#13;
&#13;
GREG:  One comment, we are competing with them. Please (inaudible-I think it is “please keep in mind I have a) hearing aid. &#13;
&#13;
RENEE:  Thank you. Some of the questions that they have given to me from just this sheet here, (inaudible- and get some juicy tidbits about you) and then get these people to talk to you. It says, “You were selected for an Army Special Training Program? Is that right?  Will you tell us about that? I do not know anything about that. (Renee points to the audience and asks, “Do you?”. &#13;
&#13;
GREG: The Army and I were into the war and really realized they needed technical trained people; really to protect themselves. So they felt (inaudible). We had to take very hard technical tests and I was fortunate enough to pass these tests. We were actually sent to (inaudible) experience this kind of. (The next 10 or more sentences or paragraph is very inaudible.) (Cameraman was being very noisy…talking making response inaudible. There was loud laughing in background. ) &#13;
&#13;
UNKNOWN:  Renee, Renee, I can interrupt you as an old friend; you are going to have to speak up. Okay?&#13;
&#13;
RENEE: (She asks a question but it is inaudible. Cameraman is speaking and can not hear question.)&#13;
&#13;
GREG: At that time my brother had been drafted in the military (inaudible- possibly he had owned a flight or light plane) as a flyer. He is a flyer.  (Very noisy filming sounds from camera inaudible.) Something about the 13th Airborne (inaudible) and then they decided “What we really need in the Army is the infantry - the infantry.&#13;
&#13;
RENEE: (She asks a question but there is so much noise it is inaudible. The Cameraman is walking in and out of frame. The Cameraman is making a lot of noise with the camera; clacking and clinging.)&#13;
&#13;
GREG: (He answers but it is inaudible because of much banging and clanging of the camera.)&#13;
&#13;
RENEE: I don’t know a whole lot about that. (Many more sentences are inaudible.) Where and when (inaudible)?&#13;
&#13;
GREG: When the ASTP was spent we were sent to various infantry divisions in the state for training; I was sent to the One hundred and third in farming conditions; which was in Haleyville, Texas, and this was a shock (inaudible-they got you a rifle) and had milk (inaudible) and all of a sudden we were an infantry. It was very serious, really serious. What this government would do is training young Private PFCs and then they would be sent away as replacement in Europe. Anyway that must have been “42” or “43” the whole division was sent to Camp Shags’; then aboard a transport luxury liner; “The Monticello” made to carry about a thousand people in peacetime. Thirteen thousand of us were shipped and we landed at Marseilles, France. (Next line is inaudible.) The frontlines were up and beyond that, so we were trucked into where the combat was. We relieved the 45th Division. &#13;
&#13;
RENEE: I can tell that (inaudible). What were you thinking about (inaudible) was it a scary thing or…?&#13;
&#13;
GREG: Well not at that point; I had some scary times of course; of course everybody does the first time, and a lot of fray point’s things that you are not used to.  All in all, I was very fortunate.                &#13;
&#13;
RENEE: Did you actually participate in combat or…?&#13;
&#13;
GREG: I belonged to “K” Company; we called ourselves “The K Company Commandos”, and we ended up with the most decorative company in the Regiment. As in most things, you have your worst day; the first day you know oh so little, and after that things get better. &#13;
&#13;
RENEE: Does anyone else have a question that you might want..?&#13;
&#13;
UNKNOWN: Did you see a lot of action?&#13;
&#13;
GREG: Oh yes! &#13;
&#13;
UNKNOWN: Yes. &#13;
&#13;
GREG: Actually the German Army was pretty battered-up and it is funny the attitudes; the first prisoner we took, he was sat down with four people guarded him. Two months later we got used to things and things had changed. I have seen where whole companies or regiments were surrendering and we would just wave them back to the rear. We made sure they had no weapons. Sent them back and let the rear people take care of them. So things could change. It was certainly not the first line German Army such as it was in North Africa that we were up against. We ended up; we made quite a dent into Germany; we were past the national line the fifty-third; then in December when the break through, in the north, of “The Battle of the Bulge” we were rushed back to be in a holding position, but we were not actually in it, but we were close enough to see the artillery to the north. We were there over Christmas; then we pulled back and had to retake some of the area we had already taken. &#13;
&#13;
RENEE: So about approximately how much time did you actually spend in the…when you were an Officer? &#13;
&#13;
GREG: Three years.&#13;
&#13;
RENEE: Three years.&#13;
&#13;
GREG: I got out before most of my company that was interesting. When the War was over we were in occupational territory; this was pretty comfortable there were really not many duties and you were looking for things to pass your time. I was surprised, when my military service number was called-up to be; leave the company, go to the States for a furlough, and then go to Japan. There were others that joined me, but I was the only one from my company. Well the idea of a 40 day furlough sounded like it would be worthwhile. I never thought it would happen. I got to the shipping point in France, on the coast, when I came down one morning the Sergeant there in charge said “The news (inaudible) is the Bomb has been dropped.” That of course, would be, of course he used the word “Atomic Bomb”. I had enough physics to know that something new and complicated that I really didn’t know the details of. We went ahead, our group shipped out, although, we heard that we were the last ship that left. While we were in route to New York the second bombs dropped, and the war was over. So, instead of going to Japan we ended up in the States early and the war is over; so in a couple of months I go out. I then used the G.I. Bill to get a Degree from the University of Nebraska. I appreciate particularly well that is another story. &#13;
&#13;
RENEE: So what did you do to have fun? You said that “You were passing the time in periods like this”.&#13;
&#13;
GREG: Well you know it was a time of non-fractionation; you could not even talk to them a German. That relaxed and most towns had swimming pools; guys got up baseball games; you could go up and explore the countryside. Actually we ended up in Innsbrook which was a great place in the Alp Mountains. You could take a trolley from the end of the street, Main Street, right up to the resort. The resort had been reserved for us; so there was skiing there in June and July; because it was such an altitude gain. That is the one place in Europe I wouldn’t mind seeing again; the Innsbrook area.&#13;
&#13;
RENEE: Can you think of how many countries that you actually visited; when you were stationed at? &#13;
&#13;
GREG: France started in France into Germany and Austria. I might mention that what I have always enjoyed; is an unusual experience; the day we were told the War was over everything pretty much stopped. I had gotten the reputation of being a knowledgeable of photography, 35mm photography. I had taken my own camera with me; I had actually taken more than a thousand shot of various types of action. A man from another company knew I had some background in this; he came over with a jeep, we were doing nothing but waiting he said, “How about going with me to that town we just passed, a bigger town? We just went through the town. Nothing happened we just kept going. He said, “I would really like to get a missing part of my camera.” He had a Leica camera; which was a very good camera; it had no take up spool, and until he had it he really could not use it. (Inaudible there was too much laughing.) We went back to this town, that was an interesting experience, there were no troops in the town; American Troops; you would drive down the street, and look down the side streets you would occasionally see a German uniform, but they were trying to get out of sight. We could not find a camera shop, and finally we saw one building and he said, “Let’s try that one.” The reason he said that is sometimes when we would go through a town they would ask that all the guns would be collected at one place; often the County Seat or something like this. Anyhow, we knocked on this door of this rather elaborate building; well we went in to the main door and then went down this corridor; we heard voices in one room, so we knocked on the door and it was all of a sudden silent. Then we could hear somebody walking to the door, and it was opened and here was this long table with very dignified looking elderly people, in it, sitting on both sides. At the end was obliviously the Burger Meister; he had on a special uniform, with a big ban across show his prestige. We all stared at each other and he spoke to the woman, and she said, in English, in broken English, “Are you the people from your country, who have come to help us form our new government?” I was thinking “Wow! What have we got into?” before I could figure out a politically smart thing to say. My buddy said, “Do you know where I can get a piece for my camera?” She then more or less said to them, “They can’t help us.” She shut the door and we were out. I could image what she was saying, “Oh, their just souvenir hunters.” That was my big moment and I missed it. &#13;
&#13;
RENEE: How did you get from (inaudible dropped the bomb) how did you get back to here? In the Richland area and get involved…with?&#13;
&#13;
GREG: Well at the University of Nebraska; one of my good friends was an engineer and he ended up working at Hanford, like in the notes. So after I got my Degree and tried some professional photography work. I made the mistake of not being smart enough to examine a town before we committed ourselves there for awhile. We did this in a town in Colorado; Walsenburg, Colorado. Taking over a studio that someone else had started. Well we were not smart enough to recognize it was a mining town and only about half of the miners were working normally; so after a year we decided this is not where we want to spend out lives. We pulled our stakes and I drove out to Hanford here by myself. I checked in with my friend; who was working in radiation monitoring. He said “I know your background is in photography, but they are hiring monitors.” So I checked in and gave them my background. I had a funny thing happen to me there; they said, “When they were examining my photography credentials; you are over qualified for the one photography job we got; but we are hiring monitors, would you like to have that kind of job?” So I took it and I became a monitor.&#13;
&#13;
RENEE: About how many years did you do that?&#13;
&#13;
GREG: Well I was a monitor for three years and then I became a Supervisor in the monitoring.  Then I got into Reactor Administration; I was a measurements person and then when they began closing them down. I got into data processing, and I ended up down at the “Senior Systems Analyst” cataloging the payroll savings plan and the pension plan, and all those things that have to work when you have a couple of thousand who depended on a check every two weeks.                                                                          &#13;
&#13;
RENEE: So what did you do with your pictures you guys took?&#13;
&#13;
GREG: Well that is another side of it. I was in a position to keep the home address of all the people in the Company; so I made-up a set of 200 of the best of them, and offered them copies to all these guys. Can you imagine 200 pictures for $12? I sold about, my first $1000 worth of pictures. So that was my first money from photography I had really made. We are still in touch because many of those appreciated they did not have cameras and this is great for them to have. &#13;
&#13;
RENEE: Is there any other questions that you have? Yes.&#13;
&#13;
UNKNOWN: Where were you when Pearl Harbor was bombed? How did you find that out? &#13;
&#13;
GREG: I was still home. I was at home.  I was not yet in the service.&#13;
&#13;
UNKNOWN: How did you find out about it?&#13;
 &#13;
GREG: Radio.&#13;
&#13;
UNKNOWN: How did you feel about it? &#13;
&#13;
GREG: Well our attitude was; they’re so foolish to do that. We did not realize, of course, that they had been building up their military for many years. (Inaudible-we were caught or difficult) I think that was an incentive to get in. I was on a ranch and it left my Father with very little help. Both my brothers and I had gone, but I felt like this is something we had to do. &#13;
&#13;
UNKNOWN: When you were in Europe what kind of food supply system did they have for the troops? &#13;
&#13;
GREG: What kind of a what?&#13;
&#13;
UNKNOWN: What was the food? What did they give you to eat? &#13;
&#13;
GREG: Well the kitchen would supply you if they could, but if, in the combat situation you had the K Rations. You know what they are…  Don’t you? &#13;
&#13;
UNKNOWN: No.&#13;
&#13;
GREG: Well it was a couple of packages about this long and this thick, and in it you had one can of Spam; a couple of cookies; some toilet paper; some decaf, no it was powdered coffee. You could make coffee if you had water. That was the meal. There was a slightly better one if you were lucky enough to get it, we call them something else. You had two or three cans a little bit more. What would happen is if we were in reserve for a few days then the kitchen could reach us, and give us something better? A little incident about that I might mention; for the first time after we had been over there for several months; the kitchen we heard got fresh eggs. We thought “WOW” that is something we missed. So the next morning we really lined-up early.  Do you know what they had done? They BOILED them! That kitchen crew came real close to being shot! The next day even the Captain got on their case, he said, “Tomorrow you are going to make for each person eggs the way they ask for them.” and they did!&#13;
&#13;
UNKNOWN: How long were you in Europe now? &#13;
&#13;
GREG: Let’s see, we landed at Marseilles in November and I got back in August of the next year. &#13;
&#13;
UNKNOWN: November of which now?  That was November of which year?&#13;
&#13;
GREG: Well that would have been “44” and “45”.&#13;
&#13;
UNKNOWN: “44” and “45” so you were right toward the end?&#13;
&#13;
GREG: Yes the tail end, right. That certainly made a difference; the Germans had been heavily depleted. I had another little incident which I really haven’t resolved. When we were following the Germans; the troops over the Rhine River or to the Rhine River they had blown the bridge; even before some of the people had got off it. The rest of them there were in rafts.  My company was ahead of me; they went across in rafts. When I came to the edge of the river I found an envelope there, which was unusual, and I stuck it in my pocket when I had time to look at it. It was a series of 13 pictures taken, obviously taken by a professional; a very high rated photographer because it was pictures of Hitler and his top staff; taken eight to ten feet away.  The circumstances were a meeting with a Russian, I am sorry, with a Japanese General in a town in occupied Russia. There was German writing on the rear and I have their names; I had it translated. I am trying to think of the right use to make of this. I would like to see it published or make use of some particular fashion; I have not found the right source yet to do that. I have never heard of this meeting; I have tried things on the internet, but so far I have not had much luck in finding what kind of meeting that happened between the Japanese General and the German people.&#13;
&#13;
UNKNOWN: So you do still have the pictures? Were you able to keep the pictures?&#13;
&#13;
GREG:  Yes. I still have them.&#13;
&#13;
UNNKNOWN: Those are priceless. &#13;
&#13;
RENEE: So how did you get; how did you relate all that with your craft of flint knapping? I understand your wife,   and other things you, and Margaret do.&#13;
&#13;
GREG: Well when I was still in a one room school, a country school, then we had about 8 pupils in 8 grades. The new (inaudible) I suppose I was in the 6th grade in the library which was one shelf this long. Was about a…it wasn’t a Native Indian, but a cave boy; the story of how he and his older brother had to make their tools or go to the tool maker; from the family would make stone points for them. That really stirred up my interest, however, where we lived there was no river near there; I looked all the time I was there. I only found one or two pieces of little rock that were of some Indian origin; now this was at the edge of the sand (hills or field) in Nebraska. I don’t know if any of you have been there are not. When I say sand I mean sand. When I was 4 or 5; I used to pickup and put into a special box any rock that was bigger than my little fingernail; twenty miles north it was all different. Entirely different on the Newbury River…but this is really sand. That is what you’re ranching in. &#13;
&#13;
RENEE: We kind of have to wrap thing up. I just wanted to “thank you” (inaudible-loud clapping) share your life with us. We just really appreciate it. (Inaudible-loud clapping) I am sure that you could share with us some fascinating things.&#13;
&#13;
GREG: Is there any other questions? &#13;
&#13;
UNKNOWN: How did you meet your wife?&#13;
&#13;
GREG: At the University of Nebraska.            &#13;
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                  <text>Oral histories originally conducted by, or collected by, the CREHST Museum.  Property and rights transferred to Washington State University upon CREHST closure in 2014</text>
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                  <text>Washington State University's Hanford History Project.  </text>
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      <name>Oral History</name>
      <description>A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge.</description>
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              <text>Gary Fetterolf</text>
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            <elementText elementTextId="41039">
              <text>Steve Bickel</text>
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          <name>Transcription</name>
          <description>Any written text transcribed from a sound</description>
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            <elementText elementTextId="41040">
              <text>ORAL HISTORY PROJECT&#13;
TITLE:  Bus-Train Transportation&#13;
INTERVIEW DATE: 1/23/10&#13;
INTERVIEW LOCATION: CREHST MUSEUM&#13;
INTERVIEWER:  Gary Fetterolf&#13;
INTERVIEWED:  Steve Bickel&#13;
TRANSCRIBER:  Bob Clayton&#13;
&#13;
GARY: This is an Oral History / Video History interview with Steve Bickel 724 North Volland Street Kennewick, WA and F. Gary Fetterolf as interviewer. Steve you came up in the transportation department and I’d like start you out with just a little bit about how you came here, your personal history, your service time, whatever you feel comfortable with there.&#13;
 &#13;
STEVE: Well I hired on at Hanford in March of 1976 March 9th Back in June I believe they had a strike it lasted all summer for 3 ½ months. So I got here just in time for the strike and I worked on the railroad as   what they called a gandy dancer working with the track crew until after the strike. Soon there after I went to the bus lot in transportation. In those days it was called Bus and Railroad Operations. Then I started driving bus and very shortly after that I was asked by one of the supervisors if I would be interested in taking a supervisory position. Which I promptly said no. So he made me a lead and had me doing the job anyway so I thought well I’m doing the job I might as well take the extra pay which would be an incentive. So that’s what I did. I was a bus dispatcher / railroad dispatcher and when one of the railroad dispatchers retired I took his position for approximately 6 years. Dispatching the railroad which was quite fun. It was probably my best years of employment at Hanford. And after that I got promoted to mid-management. Calvin Seally and I ran the Bus and Railroad Operations day to day business. I did that up until just before the bus lot shut down and I transferred out to Crane and Rigging. And then from Crane and Rigging I went to K-Basin and then from K-Basin I went to Ground Water which I’m currently at right now and that’s pretty much of a history of me at the Hanford site. I’ve been all over for a number of years.&#13;
&#13;
GARY: Ok could you give us a history of the transportation division as far as you know it and start in whenever you want back in the forties or when you came in. And if you’ll hold those photographs up as you go along. First of all you might start a little bit farther back than those photographs start. &#13;
&#13;
STEVE: Well originally the original bus lot was a little further down Stevens toward the southern part of Richland. In those days it was considered north Richland. What we considered north Richland hadn’t been built yet. It was down there. There’s a little bus station right across from the school grounds that used to be the location of the original bus lot. That was just a Quonset hut and that’s where all the buses left from.&#13;
&#13;
GARY: It was across from Chief Joseph wasn’t it?&#13;
&#13;
STEVE: Correct. They built what they call the new bus lot in 1954 and that’s where it’s currently located now. Although it’s not a bus lot anymore the skeleton is still there. And that’s what this represents. (Holds up photograph) This photograph here they had a leveled off asphalted lot. They put a bunch of pipes in it for the busses to come down. Next to that on the bus door side they had additional pipes to keep passengers and buses from intermingling. So that’s a picture of the buses being loaded.&#13;
&#13;
GARY: Those are the Flexible buses not the original ones.&#13;
&#13;
STEVE: That’s correct. During this time we had both GM and Flexible buses that were operating. These were considered the new bus and these were a 1966 Flexible. The GM was 1956. Somewhere in the early to mid ‘50s. But those are the ones that we were most proud of. None of them had power steering. None of them had air conditioning. They didn’t have any of the luxuries. They were the size of an over the road bus but they had all the amenities of a city bus. They had the bench seats. They carried 53 passengers.&#13;
&#13;
GARY: I know when we got those buses they were the latest and greatest and they were really nice buses. We were really happy with them.&#13;
&#13;
STEVE: Oh yeah. The heating was kind of sparse in the older ones. The Flexibles had a much better heating system in them.&#13;
&#13;
GARY: Can you describe what happened when the ball joints on those older buses got worn? When you hit a bump or something. &#13;
&#13;
STEVE: You handled them pretty much with a lot of upper body strength. They weren’t the easiest to drive. Like I said there was no power steering. You actually had to be rolling to get the steering wheel to turn unless you were a weight lifter or something. We literally put our foot on the dash and started pulling on the steering wheel like it was rope to get them to turn. It was interesting.&#13;
&#13;
GARY: Those are large steering wheels too.&#13;
&#13;
STEVE: Yes very large. And some of them had a lot slack in them so you had to be pretty aware. But after you take the same route year after year after year you get to know the bumps in the road and you get to know the routes pretty good. And the passengers by the way. There was a lot card games going on. When I hired on in like I said in ‘76 there was a grand total of 6,000 employees on the entire site and we had all the reactors running. We didn’t know everybody by name but we certainly knew each other by sight. (Holding up a photograph) This is just a broader picture of the same area. It shows how many buses could be lined up. Each one of those lanes had a sign on it. The signage had for you know 100-F, 100-N, 100-K and the different shifts. We had a sign up next to the building that would show what shift was going because we had people that rotated from facilities and they would need to know what shift was going to what area.&#13;
&#13;
GARY: That was one of my questions was to what that sign meant. It was for the 100 areas I know for outage crews.&#13;
&#13;
STEVE: Right. And during the outages we would send crews to specific locations whether it would be F or H or K or even D and we’d have the crews report there. And this is just a narrower picture of the same bus lot. It was quite interesting. As you can see there’s not a whole lot of room between the edges of the buses. I think we had less than a foot on each side. So making the turns to come into those lanes and the lanes got worn it was interesting to keep the buses and the railing from meeting. And of course in these days passengers had to walk from the parking lot which was over here down in front of the buses to get in their lane. As a bus driver you had to be very cognizant of the foot traffic before you went on your appointed run. This is a picture of day shift at the bus lot. You couldn’t capture all the people of course because there was a little over 200 employees working at the bus operations when this picture was taken. So this is day shift.   And it was in celebration of some goal that we had set for ourselves and achieved. Probably a million man hours or a million miles safely. I don’t recall. The individual is shown here holding a certificate so I know it’s for some kind of ceremony. I’m in there somewhere I just have located myself yet. Some of the big players were over here. Leona Robinson who was the head of Bus and Railroad Operations for a number of years. So we had to have good management support in those days. And then of course like I told you about the passengers walking in front of the busses. We thought that wasn’t the safest way to do business. There was a lot of near misses over the years. We designed a new bus lot when we had to repair the old one. We took out all the poles and the pipes and leveled the ground out. Took up all the asphalt and then repaved it. We decided after going to all that effort we didn’t want to put the poles back in and have the same hazards we had been dealing with the 40 years previously. We redesigned it and this is a picture of the grand opening of our redesigned bus lot with our new busses which were MCIs which replaced the Flexibles and the Eagles. Well we still had some Eagles but they were being run down, This is a larger picture of the same ceremony. And we were also instrumental during the last days of the bus operations of course none of us knew it was the last days at the time but we were instrumental in getting contracts with Ben Franklin to help some of our employees and some of our less-abled employees to get back and forth to work. In accordance with the new ADA laws which were brand new in those days we had some vehicles we purchased and then some that Ben Franklin purchased as well to adequately get our employees to and from their work locations. And that was the beginning of the end for the bus lot. And this is a picture of those vehicles that we were so proud of at the time. And then we had purchased a whole new fleet of MCIs that we had specially refurbished for us. I have a couple of pictures of those as well. This is the same picture at a different angle. &#13;
&#13;
GARY: I remember those old Eagles and their squeaky brakes. &#13;
&#13;
STEVE: That was the Eagles yeah. We had a lot of complaints on that from routes. We would start so early in the morning picking up our employees that people weren’t getting their sleep. We got a lot of complaints. As a matter of fact there is a kind of interesting story about that. We were working for Rockwell had the main contract out and they were the makers of the brakes as well.&#13;
&#13;
GARY: I remember a lot of stories cursing Rockwell because of those brakes.&#13;
&#13;
STEVE: Right. Rockwell one of their sub contractor one of their sub divisions was the builder of the brakes. They got a lot of bad press over that. &#13;
&#13;
GARY: Also the air conditioning didn’t work very well. &#13;
&#13;
STEVE: The air conditioning would work sparsely. It would work. And then if it didn’t work there was no way to roll the windows down.&#13;
&#13;
GARY: Yeah that was really a problem.&#13;
&#13;
STEVE: We had those little hatch windows at the top. That didn’t adequately flow air. There was a lot of complaints about that as well especially in August. But these new buses that we got they had back up systems. I don’t know of a single failure on the air conditioning with those. They were a good bus. Of course we didn’t operate them long. From the time we finished the new bus lot until we closed was about 9 months. Broke a lot of hearts. A lot of people had a lot of history there. A lot more than me. I had 20 years there. There was a lot of people that had more than that. &#13;
&#13;
GARY: It was also very very convenient. As a rider I was always the rider not the driver. And it was very convenient to catch a bus half a block from my house and ride all the way to work. &#13;
&#13;
STEVE: It was very good service. We had very good service. We had a number of schedules. We had 28 reporting shifts just at the bus lot. To adequately take people to and from their job assignments and shifts that they were working. &#13;
&#13;
GARY: Before we get into the rail one of the questions I had was about the shift pick ups. How many buses actually went per route? You start out picking up the drivers.&#13;
&#13;
STEVE: Correct we had a driver’s shuttle.&#13;
&#13;
GARY: Then your patrol. Where do you go from there? 100 area first. Pick up about 5 or 10 minutes before the 200 areas. &#13;
&#13;
STEVE: Yeah you’re right. But actually it depends on the time frame you’re talking about because when I first started there all the shifts were manned at all the areas and shortly there after in the early ’80s we shut down all the reactors. So there wasn’t as many people. So we cut back on buses. I think what most people remember in the time frame is going to be mid ’80s. And I think we had something like 9 buses going to 100-N because 100-N was still going. Up until Chernobyl. And I believe we had 2 buses going to D area. I think we had 1 bus only going to K. It all depended on the passenger count. On the driver’s run there was a couple of them we had a lot of drivers living on the Stevens shuttle. So we had a bus take the Stevens shuttle for the drivers. We had vans go the other routes to pick up drivers. And we didn’t run the whole route for drivers. We knew where they were and we’d pick them up on the corner. &#13;
&#13;
GARY: I remember I live right across the street from where Herman Meyers lived so I can remember the vans coming by and picking him up. &#13;
&#13;
STEVE: Right we just made a route to the drivers. It was easier that way because we only had 6 or 8 per route. So we started using vans there towards the end. Patrol as well. Patrol it was kind of depending on what shift it was and how heavily manned it was. We got down to where there was only 1 patrol bus. In the very end we only had 1 patrol bus and it would hit all the areas between east and west of the headquarters. And that was it. &#13;
&#13;
GARY: I started riding a bus in the 1970s and at that point we had express buses going out to various plants within 200 east and 200 west. And those would not even go into the bus lot. Usually the express buses people knew which buses they were and they would park their cars in a parking lot or something to catch that express bus so they wouldn’t have to go through the bus lot. They would get out a few minutes earlier. And get in a few minutes earlier. I think getting in a few minutes earlier was probably more important than getting out. &#13;
&#13;
STEVE: That’s right back in the ’70s we had at least 1 express bus for each area. I think we had 2 for 100-N because 100-N was the largest passenger express that we had. We couldn’t do it in 1. But yeah you’re right. I remember that as well. We also had express buses from the bus lot itself. We had that express lane. And that express lane was going out to it wouldn’t go around the inside of the site. It just went to a particular location like I think we had one for PUREX and Dash-5 and 100-N that went right there and it didn’t go any place else. A lot of different routes. That all changed when 8 nines came about. I don’t know if you recall 8 nines but in the later ’80s Calvin Seally and I put together a schedule for an 8 nines shift which was kind of interesting because we didn’t get a whole lot of extra resources but we had to utilize the resources we already had. Put in an entirely different shift. &#13;
&#13;
GARY: I have a photograph or a slide somewhere of the last bus leaving PFP and going up the hill to that railroad crossing and stopping. I got a shot of it about the time it got to the railroad crossing. I deliberately brought my camera out which meant I had to bring my car out because I was working in an area where I couldn’t take my camera into work. &#13;
&#13;
STEVE: Right in those days they were really strict. &#13;
&#13;
GARY: But I could leave it in the car. So I left it in out in a nice hot car and got the shot that night. &#13;
&#13;
STEVE: We used to have to stop at all the railroad crossings. And the bus drivers used to complain that they would go on vacation and they would stop at all the railroad crossings without even thinking. Because they were so used to stopping at all railroad crossings. &#13;
&#13;
GARY: Let’s go into rail a little bit. &#13;
&#13;
STEVE: Well unfortunately even though I was a railroad dispatcher for quite some time I don’t have a whole lot of pictures that I can find so far. This one I have has some importance because this was 50 years without a loss time injury for the railroad. So from the time of conception of the railroad out here right up to this photograph here. They had had no loss time injury at all. On both the railroad and track maintenance. Which is incredible. It’s an incredible record. I don’t think any railroad in the world can boast about a term that long with no loss time injuries. So they got all the big shots together and invited me as well and took this photograph inside the 1171 railroad shop. I kept it and got it laminated because I was pretty proud of that achievement. We all worked well together. It was a pretty cohesive crew. Got a lot of good work done. Moved a lot of materials over a number of years. &#13;
&#13;
GARY: Now from what I understand a rail between the reactors and the spent fuel processing plants was made to the highest standards of rail. &#13;
&#13;
STEVE: We maintained a standard for the track crew did an excellent job keeping our tracks in an operable condition. Even with the schedule we had. Even when we were moving fuel at the highest levels we always kept our schedule. And track maintenance worked around our schedule. It’s really incredible that they did such a good job. They always came through and got the track back in service before we had to get on and use it. They did an excellent job. &#13;
&#13;
GARY: I read somewhere that there were 7000 cars of coal annually that was brought out to the areas. That was probably in the hay day. You’re probably too late for the around town type buses as opposed to the ones going out to the areas. Early on they had shuttle buses around the city of Richland. &#13;
&#13;
STEVE: Yeah that was in the ’70s and ’80s.&#13;
&#13;
GARY: I’m not talking about the ones going out to the plant. These were just going around town. &#13;
&#13;
STEVE: That is before my time. The daily bus service. They also had them in Kennewick. Actually they 2 buses going to downtown Kennewick to pick up employees and take them out to Hanford too. That was before my time. And Yakima they went to Yakima as well. &#13;
&#13;
GARY: Milwaukee. The Milwaukee maintained the roadbed beyond riverland yard. Is that correct?&#13;
&#13;
STEVE: Yes that was up behind 100-N area. Actually it’s behind B area but most people don’t know what B area is. &#13;
&#13;
GARY: Do you know when Northern Pacific was granted trackage rights on the south end of the site? &#13;
&#13;
STEVE: No that was before my time as well. That was sometime I believe in the early ’70s late ’60s early ’70s.&#13;
&#13;
GARY: Also a question about real old times Have you heard when Northern Pacific used to drop off at the yard before they got the trackage rights. They used to drop everything off at the yard in 1100 area. Do you know when that rail started being Northern Pacific and UP started having access to the rail yard there? &#13;
&#13;
STEVE: No I really don’t recall. But I remember both of those bringing us coal from different parts of the country. And it was actually before my time when they were in the riverland yard they were dropping off cars and we’d go out there. We had a substantial yard out there. And they would drop them off at night and we’d go pick them up in the morning and deliver them. Whatever supplies they were gasses and chemicals and coal. Yeah that was before my time. I was also a weight master. To be a rail dispatcher in those days you had to be a weight master. So you would weight all the coal coming in. &#13;
&#13;
GARY: I remember the gauntlet tracks down here. Did they have similar tracks out at the riverland yard?&#13;
&#13;
STEVE: Yes they sure did. Out there by midway. Quite the process. &#13;
&#13;
GARY: Take your engine on the track where it doesn’t go over the scales and then your cars that you’re weighing on the track that goes over the scales. &#13;
&#13;
STEVE: You know it’s really unfortunate now I think back on it. We had log books. Railroad dispatchers historically have had to keep log books. So we had to keep log books on everything that came in and went out. We had log books there from day one in the store room next to the office. So I had access to all that information and all that history but unfortunately you know you are getting paid to do a job. You don’t have time to set back there and reminisce over what has taken place in the past unless you had an objective. There’s some people that you probably ought to talk to that have a whole lot more history than I do that are still around. &#13;
&#13;
GARY: Overtime rights.&#13;
&#13;
STEVE: Oh yeah overtime rights. That was our biggest business as a bus dispatcher. You know everything that’s scheduled is kind of routine. You have a set schedule and you just follow that schedule and it’s pretty mundane. However the overtime rides is where you get some excitement because people are calling from every site and every office building there is on site scheduling overtime rides home and you have limited number of vehicles and drivers and times to take people home. That was where a dispatcher earned his pay. You had to juggle if you had a van going to Yakima you didn’t want 6 people calling from 6 different places going to Yakima. You’d have to schedule them being picked up by one vehicle to take them all at once. So it was quite challenging. You had to really keep your thinking cap on. And then when the person delivered his last passenger in Yakima you had to have it in the back of your mind where you were going to send him next to pick up the next ride. So it was challenging. It was fun but it was challenging. &#13;
&#13;
GARY: I remember in the later days especially if you had someone for instance going to Prosser maybe or Sunnyside or Grandview 2 or 3 people you’d slap all of those in one van. Everybody always used to hate having people ride the van or the car the sedan or whatever home because a lot of times you’d have to go to one town and then the other town. And it’s only about 4 hours before you’re getting ready to go back out to the site again. You only have about 4 to 6 hours to sleep there before you have to get back and get going. The sooner you got home the happier you were. &#13;
&#13;
STEVE: We got a lot of complaints. Unfortunately most people it wasn’t their job so they didn’t need to think about the logistics of it. We were taking people to Moses Lake and Selah and Moxie and clear up by Jump Off Joe and…what’s the name of that restaurant up there on White Pass. Whistlin Jacks we’d even take people out to Whistlin Jacks. So when you had someone going to Whistlin Jacks you had to get somebody who was going to Moxie or Yakima or some place to go with them. Otherwise we’d run out of drivers taken people singly, and then you know you complained about the 4 hours turn around. You wouldn’t get home. We had a limited number of drivers and we had to get everybody taken care of. I think overall we did an excellent job. We really did. &#13;
&#13;
GARY: Someone mentioned there was even someone who lived in Wenatchee. That’s amazing.&#13;
&#13;
STEVE: A lot of times we’d combine Richland Kennewick and Pasco. We tried not to do that because the cities are so diverse. You could be 45 minutes in one city trying to locate a couple of different homes to drop 2 employees off. So we tried not to do that but sometimes we were forced to. &#13;
&#13;
GARY: It takes me right now…my son and daughter-in-law and their family live in south Kennewick and it takes me over a half hour to get to their house from Richland. &#13;
&#13;
STEVE: The dynamics have changed quite a bit since the early ’90s. There’s a lot more traffic here and a lot more traffic lights. And we’ve got circles I don’t think the buses would make it through. It would be a different ball game now. &#13;
&#13;
GARY: Do you remember the bus accident that happened in the ’70s? &#13;
&#13;
STEVE: Oh yes sir. I was on shift when that happened. That was really bad. &#13;
&#13;
GARY: I was scheduled to ride that bus out. And my usual seat partner since I wasn’t there nobody happened to sit in the seat next to him and he was essentially loose in the seat. And when that happened he flew clear across the bus hit the far side of the bus and then bounced back into the isle way just in time to be hit by another person coming down on top of him. He suffered some internal injuries but other than that he didn’t suffer any broken bones. One of the passengers at least had a broken pelvis. The bus driver didn’t come out of it too good either.&#13;
&#13;
STEVE: No actually there was no deaths and that was amazing. That was a tanker a semi truck tanker that had just off loaded at 100-N and was coming back and didn’t see the light change and actually ran the red light. The bus driver had the green and the right of way. &#13;
&#13;
GARY: Yeah and he was the second bus too. &#13;
&#13;
STEVE: Right and actually it was really a blessing that it happened the way it did. That truck hit the front axel square on. If that truck had hit a couple of seconds later it would have gone right trough the bus. That bus would have been folded over like a pretzel. So it was actually fortunate the way it happened. &#13;
&#13;
GARY: I happened to pass the accident on my way out there. &#13;
&#13;
STEVE: Yeah that wasn’t one of my better days. That was a hard day. People started jumping out of the bus. I was out there trying to get them calmed down to keep them from jumping out of the windows because I was afraid that there would be more injuries. There was an emergency exit on that bus in the back. I got people set up there to help them down. The impact was in the front of the bus so of course the normal exit door was blocked with people on top of people. It was pretty…I’ll never forget that ever. Pretty traumatic.&#13;
&#13;
GARY: That was a bad accident. Now this driver was a vendor? In other words he was coming out from private… he wasn’t one of the government drivers?&#13;
&#13;
STEVE: No it was a truck and trailer a big heavy rig. And they estimated his speed at about 60. I believe he fell asleep at the wheel but I’ll never know…we’ll never know. But he was ok too. Yeah he came through it ok. The speed limit was 35. And they had no skid marks to measure but with the impact I was told that they estimated his speed at about 60. So it could have been lots worse. &#13;
&#13;
GARY: That’s about all the questions I had. Do you have any other comments you want to add?&#13;
&#13;
STEVE: Well just you know it’s history now and it wasn’t all fun and games but it was a real memorable enjoyable part of my life. I did a lot of things that I’m very proud of. I worked with a lot of brilliant people. It was really a pleasure. I really enjoyed it for the most part. There was days like that one you just mentioned that wasn’t very good but for the most part it was a very enjoyable memorable part of my life. &#13;
&#13;
GARY: Ok well thanks a lot Steve. &#13;
&#13;
STEVE: You’re welcome thanks for having me.           &#13;
&#13;
    &#13;
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Bus Travel</text>
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                <text>1/30/2010</text>
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              <text>CREHST Oral History Project&#13;
TITLE: Dr. Bair Comment&#13;
INTERVIEW DATE: October 25, 2004&#13;
INTERVIEW LOCATION: CREHST&#13;
INTERVIEWER: Todd Kenning&#13;
INTERVIEWED: William J. Bair&#13;
TRANSCRIBER: Robert Clayton&#13;
&#13;
Dr. Bair was a pioneer in the field of health physics. He was employed at Hanford beginning in the era when GE was the prime contractor. He did innovative research on the effects of radiation using animal models. &#13;
&#13;
DR. BAIR: I was born in Jackson, Michigan 80 years ago. Lived most of my early life in Ohio. I was drafted in to the Army in 1943. Prior to that for a few months after I got out of high school I worked on the railroad as a machinist in the roundhouse. So that was a good experience because I knew I wasn’t going to do that for the rest of my life. But anyway I was drafted in ’43 and served in the infantry for 3 years in combat in Europe. I was in Czechoslovakia at the end of the war in Europe. And then my division was shipped to the Pacific for the invasion of Japan. Of course by the time we got there the bombs had been dropped and I stayed as part of the Army of Occupation for I guess maybe up to 6 months. I think it’s ironic that the bomb of course one of them was fueled with plutonium saved my life. I talked to Glenn Seaborg about that on a couple of occasions because he had a nephew that said the same thing. But anyway it’s ironic that I ended up out here at Hanford doing most of my research on plutonium. The health effects of plutonium. &#13;
&#13;
KENNING: And what year did you come out? Where did you get your schooling?&#13;
&#13;
DR&gt; BAIR: After I got back from the Army in ’46 I went to Ohio-Wesleyan University and got a bachelor’s degree in chemistry. And then I got a fellowship a National Academy of Sciences fellowship in Radiological Physics at the University of Rochester in Rochester, New York. That first year it’s what we call Health Physics now. They didn’t have that term or use that term at that time. And at the end of the first year I was asked by Newell Stannert a professor there if I would stay on as a graduate student. And I did that with the idea that I would do my research in radiation biology. The biological effects of radiation. But at that time they had no degree program so I was in the Department of Physiology for a year until they got that program established. I finished my PhD in 1954 and I received the first PhD in Radiation Biology in the world. That’s my one claim to fame. Incidentally my professor Newell Stannert he’s about 94 now and still alive in San Diego. I gave a lecture this last spring in his honor down in California. But then after I graduated and got my degree in ’54 I looked around for a place. I had options at Yale, Oak Ridge, Tennessee, and out here. My wife and I decided we’d try the west. And they offered more money too, which was a big factor. But anyway we came out in 1954. I came out to do research at the cellular level. And within 2 years I was working on the effects of breathing radioactive material because at that time there were concerns about workers being exposed to plutonium, ruthenium, and other aerosols in the workplace. Also at that time there were ruthenium particles being dispersed in the plant environment out here. Most of them were large enough that you could actually pick them up. But they were still concerned about the people actually breathing them. Anyway that’s how I began to get into the inhalation area. I served in that position until about 1960 so that was about 14 years 15 years. &#13;
&#13;
TODD: So that was the?&#13;
&#13;
DR. BAIR: Inhalation of radioactive materials.&#13;
&#13;
TODD: Did the program have a title?&#13;
&#13;
DR. BAIR: Not specifically. It was the Inhalation of Radioactive Materials. &#13;
&#13;
TODD: And the department you were working for?&#13;
&#13;
DR. BAIR: I was in the Biology Department.&#13;
&#13;
TODD: The Biology Department for the Department of Energy?&#13;
&#13;
DR. BAIR: No no no this was back in the days of the Atomic Energy Commission. &#13;
&#13;
TODD: Right oh ok still AEC.&#13;
&#13;
DR. BAIR: Right. Now the Biology Department I should say something about the Biology Department. When the plant started up out here the management brought in Herb Parker from Oak Ridge. Herb Parker had been out in Seattle. He was an Englishman from Manchester but he had been at Swedish Hospital. When the atomic energy business got started they hired him to go back to Oak Ridge to start a program to look after the health of the workers. They knew nothing about radiation protection in those days. I shouldn’t say that because they did have some experience with radium and other things but certainly this was a totally new ball game. When the    aspect or prospect of making plutonium and other radioactive materials was totally new. So they brought Herb in to organize a radiation protection program, a health protection program, at Oak Ridge. And he did that. Actually he really started the whole field of Health Physics. Then when Hanford began operations out here they asked him to come out here and essentially set up the same program. One of the first things he did was to hire Dick Foster, a PhD from the University of Washington in the fisheries department, to come over and set up a research program to monitor and study the potential effects of the operations here on the salmon and other aquatic life. Then they also began shortly after that to look at the other aspects of the environment. The terrestrial environment…the whole ball of works. I mean what was going to be the impact of this plant on this whole area? &#13;
&#13;
TODD: What was the time frame when they started doing this? &#13;
&#13;
DR. BAIR: They started doing this shortly after he arrived and I can’t tell you the exact date. I think I could find the date for you.&#13;
&#13;
TODD: But approximately what year?&#13;
&#13;
DR. BAIR: It was approximately 1953. Oh whoops I’m off by 10 years about ‘43/’44. Anyway one of the groups that they began to set up was one to look at health effects. And this was when they hired Harry Konanberg. I think he might actually have been at Oak Ridge too to come out and get started this biology department. Initially this whole operation was in the same group as the medical people, which was headed by Dag Norwood. Dag Norwood was one of the first persons to really develop a very effective a health surveillance program for workers in the atomic field. Of course he died a number of years ago but his legacy is still out here in the Hanford Environmental Health Foundation. But anyway shortly after that time probably around 1947 I suppose ’48 maybe even earlier they split off separated the biology environmental work from the medical. And they also at the same time separated out the health physics- the routine monitoring of workers and the film badges and all that kind of work they separated that out.&#13;
&#13;
TODD: Ok when you came here in 1954 if you could tell us what your work was and kind of what it was like around here in ’54.&#13;
&#13;
DR. BAIR: When I arrived in ’54. First I’ll tell you a little bit about the biology department that I joined. The main effort of the biology department had been was still looking at the potential effects of radioiodine. And they had a large herd of sheep that they were working with. Dr. Leo Bustad who eventually became dean of the Veterinary School at Washington State University was in charge of that program. They also had a herd of miniature pigs. And they also developed a strain of white pigs because they were interested in looking at the potential effects of these particles these so called “Hot” particles ruthenium particles on the skin. &#13;
&#13;
TODD: What was the name of these particles?&#13;
&#13;
DR. BAIR: Hot particles. That’s where that term originated. In this case they were particles of radioactive ruthenium. And these were crystalline materials crystalline particles that had been released from the separations stacks. So they were out in the environment. So one of the points they were looking at was what the potential hazard of those particles were when they fell on people’s skin. So they used pigs to do that. &#13;
&#13;
TODD: And the white pigs were?&#13;
&#13;
DR. BAIR: Good animals for that. They used the miniature pigs then for studies similar to what they had done for sheep. Miniature pigs were good because they took up a lot less space and they ate a lot less food. They were a good experimental animal and I think some descendants of that herd they developed out here are still being used in the pharmaceutical industry and other places. At least we sold some to some of those companies from the private Battelle herd. Anyway the emphasis there in the animal area was on the hot particles and the iodine. We were beginning to get interested in plutonium because there was a potential for people being exposed at the plant of course. The environmental people were going out and collecting samples from the field. Wayne Hanson, Bob Genoway was another one. They would get on a big Dodge pickup like vehicle they had a seat mounted up there and they would go out shooting jackrabbits. I have photographs of some of that. So they collected samples that way to see if any radioactive material was being picked up by those animals. Essentially monitoring the environment that way. They also had plant studies going on to try to determine whether the radioactive material if any of it that was released was causing any or would cause any problem with plant growth. Before I arrived back in the ‘40’s they had a farm across the river over at Ringgold that they farmed. They did that over there because it was far enough away from the site that it would not be contaminated. So they did some studies over there. So the biology program was pretty extensive when I arrived. The river problem was actually chromium because they used chromium in the cooling water to prevent to reduce corrosion in the reactor. So they were concerned about chromium toxicity in the aquatic in particularly in the salmon. A lot of work was done on that. There was a small group looking at fairly basic kinds of effects and that’s the group I was hired into. My boss was Frank Hungate who is no longer here. He’s in Seattle. I looked at microorganisms looking at potential genetic effects of radioactive materials. We were interested primarily in whether when you have a radioactive material when it decays it becomes another element. Sulfur-35 becomes a chlorine. So if you have radioactive sulfur in a biological molecule and all of a sudden becomes chlorine what happens?  Could that trigger a mutation? So that was the first thing I actually worked on.&#13;
&#13;
TODD: Excuse me sir. In microorganisms? What particular?&#13;
&#13;
DR. BAIR: Ecoli was one of them and we used various yeast. Anyway our objective was to determine was that particular mechanism was the potential for causing mutations. We had some results that weren’t all that exciting.&#13;
&#13;
TODD: That’s typical science isn’t it? &#13;
&#13;
DR. BAIR: Oh yeah that’s right. And I don’t think anyone is looking at that area now. But after I had been there 2 years the man who had been hired. He was a physician. Ralph Waggert had been hired to develop a program looking at potential effects of breathing radioactive materials. He was working with 2 people: Lewis Temple his son is actually a physician here in town Edward Temple. Another one was Don Willard and another one was Victor Smith. And Victor Smith lives in Kennewick and Don Willard lives in Kennewick also. Ralph Waggert died suddenly and I was selected, elected, drafted or whatever to take over responsibility for that program. The reason I was asked to do it the University of Rochester had led the field in developing the technology for studying radioactive materials in the air radioactive aerosols. They had the aerosol technology program there. They began to do the studies. They were really leading the field. Primarily in uranium. A lot of uranium was being used in those days for the weapons program of course. And a lot of that dust was spread around in those big plants out here, in Oak Ridge, and other places. So the University of Rochester had this large program going on to study the toxicology of uranium. So since I was at Rochester some of that had to have rubbed off on me. I was supposed to have absorbed some of that. Well I had some classes.&#13;
&#13;
TODD: Well it was so brand new the whole concept.&#13;
&#13;
DR. BAIR: Well true. But anyway I was drafted to take responsibility for that program. And I learned a lot. I learned a lot from Lew Temple and Don Willard and the people who were already working in it. But we found from some of our first studies we actually were the first to prove that if you gave animals enough plutonium in the repertory tract if they inhaled enough you could eventually get some cancers. And I have to tell you that the idea that you can easily produce cancers, lung cancers, by inhaling plutonium is wrong. It was a long trial and error period to get just exactly the right dose. You could give them enough plutonium that the radioactivity would actually damage the lungs so severely that it would kill the animal. And of course if the animal died in a month or two months it wouldn’t live long enough to demonstrate a cancer. So we had to work hard to develop techniques that would really show if plutonium would cause a cancer. And we did finally find that you could give enough but not too much that you would begin to find a few lung cancers in mice and rats. I think probably the most important study along that line was with dogs. And this was, you asked about dogs earlier. At this time it was kind of rare for us to do work for other agencies we were working for the Atomic Energy Commission. But the Air Force was interested in the effects of plutonium because they were carrying bombs with plutonium in them. They asked us to do a study looking at the effects of being exposed to large amounts of plutonium aerosols. So we did that and we had a few dogs on the lower dose end that lived you know 2 years. And so we just we kept them. &#13;
&#13;
TODD: What kind of dogs were they?&#13;
&#13;
DR. BAIR: Beagles. Now we chose beagles because back in Cornell I was a graduate student. Cornell University had developed a beagle colony. They were looking for an animal species that would be useful for relating to potential human effects and I don’t even know what they were studying at the time. But they found that the beagle was a very good animal for this purpose. So they developed background information on beagle dogs. And that helped us because we didn’t have to do a lot of that it was already done. So we selected the beagle dogs for that study. We bought from licensed dealers we didn’t go around getting pets from anybody. &#13;
&#13;
TODD: That’s pretty important that you did not go around taking people’s pets.&#13;
&#13;
DR. BAIR: We eventually got some beagle dogs from I believe Washington State University and also from down in California at Davis. They had a beagle colony down there. But anyway we eventually had about 3 or 4 different groups of beagles and we set up our own colony. We raised our own dogs. WE were self-contained in a sense. And I might just add while were on this subject. Our dogs we had I forget just how many veterinarians we had working out there. Those dogs and of course the other animals too they had the full time attention of veterinarians and specialized animal care people. The dogs and all the animals were in probably the best facilities and certainly received better care than any animals in the community. They had the regular health check-ups and received all the inoculations they needed. And besides that they were well fed and cared for. We had probably some of the oldest beagle dogs out there that you’ve ever heard of. I think we had some living 18, 19 years because they were even though they had plutonium.&#13;
&#13;
TODD: Well if you take good care of dogs there going to last longer just like human beings.&#13;
&#13;
DR. BAIR: You know what the average life span of our dogs out there far exceeds the average life span of pets by many years. But anyway we did one of I think our first major observations out there was the fact that some of these dogs did eventually develop lung cancer so we continued to use beagle dogs to get some idea what the dose would be for a human. Trying to extrapolate from a dog to humans. &#13;
&#13;
TODD: This was with plutonium dust did you ever do any with uranium dust here?&#13;
&#13;
DR. BAIR: We did some with uranium ore dust somewhat a little later and radon. I don’t know whether you know about this or not but one of the earlier observations back in the early ‘40s was the fact that uranium miners were beginning to show up high instance of lung cancer. And it was difficult to know early on whether it was due to radon, whether it was due to uranium ore dust, with the residue from explosives they used in mines, the oil from the jack hammers the drilling equipment that they used all these factors arsenic all different things were in the mine. Historically back in the late 1800s over in Germany and Czechoslovakia they found that there was a high instance of lung cancer in hard rock miners. They were not I can’t remember now what they were mining at the time but arsenic was considered one of the factors.&#13;
&#13;
TODD: Arsenic yes.&#13;
&#13;
DR. Bair: And it wasn’t until the late ‘20s middle ‘20s that it was lung cancer. You know if you go back many years you never hear of lung cancer…consumption all various different kinds of things. But I think it was in the ‘20s that they diagnosed their problem as lung cancer and begin to feel that maybe it was radioactive material but you know radioactive materiel was not very well known in those days having only been discovered at the turn of the century. But anyway we did do studies with uranium and with trying to understand what in your mine environment was causing the problem. We eventually did find that radon was causing the problem. We also did some studies that combined radon with smoking because most of those miners smoked. The results are still kind of iffy. You couldn’t expose the dogs or rats or hamsters or any of the animals we used to this ore dust and have them smoke at the same time. So we either had to expose them to cigarette smoke before or afterwards. I think we exposed them afterwards had a little more effect more enhanced effect than if they smoked before they were exposed to the radon and ore dust. Anyway there was some evidence of enhancement by smoking. &#13;
&#13;
TODD: Now you were doing that particular one with the beagles also.&#13;
&#13;
DR. BAIR: We did that with beagles. We did that with hamsters primarily hamsters and beagles. We did studies with some of the fission products: cerium, strontium strontium-90, with iodine&#13;
&#13;
TODD: That’s iodine-131.&#13;
&#13;
DR. BAIR: Right. One of the things that we tried to test. One of the AEC atomic energy commissioners I think his name was Wilson. He was I believe a physicist. He wondered if you had in a rector containment vessel a release of iodine-131 if you immediately released a large amount stable iodine if this would not reduce the effect on the people that were breathing it. We do know that if you saturate the thyroid with stable iodine it won’t pick up near as much of the radioactive iodine but you gotta do this before hand. His idea was if you did this simultaneously. And we did find in some studies that yes you could reduce the uptake of radioiodine in the thyroid if you also got a big dose of stable iodine. But here again you are talking about something that itself can be toxic. Anyway I don’t think that they ever utilized that but we did show that under certain circumstances it was feasible. &#13;
&#13;
TODD: Ok I’m going to change the subject just a little bit. Now you are going to add some things about the plutonium dust and americium.&#13;
&#13;
DR. BAIR: Right. Back in the early ‘60s we were working with plutonium-239 the plutonium isotope that’s used in the bombs produced in the reactors. It’s the main product here. About that time Merle Eisenbud at New York University asked us if we hadn’t considered doing some studies using plutonium-238. Plutonium-238 is a very high activity plutonium. It’s much more radioactive than plutonium-239. It’s a very hot material. Thermally hot actually. It was beginning to be used in space flights and satellites as a fuel. It’s a thermal-electric fuel. They can use it to produce electricity. It’s a heat source used to produce electricity in the satellites. And it’s also used in some of the weapons systems I understand as part of the triggering system or something. I don’t know exactly. So we began to look at that and we went to my old laboratory in Ohio to get some plutonium-238. The first studies were very interesting. We found where as plutonium oxide is very insoluble, very insoluble the plutonium-238 is mush less insoluble than plutonium-239 oxide. If you put 239 oxide in your lungs it just stays there in the lymph nodes a long time. But if you inhale plutonium-238 even though it’s supposedly an insoluble oxide it begins to disintegrate primarily probably because of its high specific activity. It’s unstable physically unstable so the particle begins to break apart in smaller pieces and thus becomes more soluble.  You know a greater surface area. So anyway this was a discovery we made here and I remember going back to the Pentagon and telling them about this. I was in a meeting with several admirals and generals from the Air Force, and the Army, and the Navy telling them they could not use plutonium-239 as a surrogate for plutonium-238 in their planning. They didn’t believe me. You have 2 isotopes same material they should be the same. But they did not. Anyway I had a couple of meetings back there trying to convince them. I did convince them of course that that was the case. But that had an impact on a lot of things. For example I was on a committee advising the space and the military people on this program putting these snap devices they called them in the satellites. Initially when they began to make these things they put the plutonium-238 in the oxide soluble form thinking that if they had an accident it would just burn up. And they did that. They had an accident and they just burned up. So what happened was we had plutonium	-238 scattered all around the world. So anyway one of the things we did as a result of our studies we convinced them and the committee I was working with knew part of this or was part of this we convinced them that they should design their thermal electric system containing plutonium so that the plutonium was in a very insoluble form. So they then produced a ceramic form of plutonium-238 oxide which they use today. So if they have an accident and it comes back it’s going to come back in one chunk. And they have had a couple of those that have dropped in the oceans with no more worldwide contamination of plutonium-238 from that source. I want to say something about americium I want to tell you about some of these things that I feel I made an impact. Back in I think it must have the 1980s I received a call from 60 Minutes. This woman said, “You know we’re interested in doing a segment of a show on americium-241 because we know it’s used in smoke detectors. So we’re concerned that these smoke detectors after people get through with them they through them out in the trash and they go out in the dump and the source gets scattered all around. Well I told her I said, “You know I don’t think that’s a good idea. Because if you think about the lives that are saved by people using smoke detectors, Then you could begin to consider how infinitesimal the risk is, the health risk to people getting those materials and actually getting enough of it in their body. They could not get enough from one smoke detector to cause any problems. Well after several phone calls she called back and she said, “You know we agree with you, we will not do that show.” So I feel I made a real contribution (Laughter)&#13;
&#13;
TODD: Well you know it’s funny when we tell people, everyday people that americium in the smoke detectors. We’ve had people say I am going to get rid of my smoke detectors. And that’s just silly. &#13;
&#13;
DR. BAIR: Well if 60 Minutes had done that show it would have been terrible. And they didn’t do it.&#13;
&#13;
TODD: Ok we’re going to get to the alligators now. &#13;
&#13;
DR. BAIR: Ok back in about early 1960s we had an aquatic physiologist out there Bob Schifman who was planning to do some experiments to see how sensitive alligators were to radiation. In the radiation biology field we’ve done an awful lot of studies with various species. What you do is you can’t do these studies on people so you’ve got data from many species and then you begin to put man into this whole scheme of things. Where does he fit? He was going to do this study with some alligators. Well they had them in a can …should I show you a photograph now? This shows the 100-F area and down at the bottom is a picture of the Aquatic Biology area with some pens, fish pens. And Bob Schifman kept the alligators in these fish pens. I think he had 20 or 30 alligators maybe. Well one day a fisherman over at Ringgold well he picked up an alligator’ He was fishing on the bank and an alligator crawled up. So he took this alligator and displayed it at BB and M sports store. It’s no longer there. The people from the laboratory soon recovered that. . They came and got it of course. But anyway there was an alligator that had gotten loose in the Columbia River and a fisherman had found it.&#13;
&#13;
TODD: Excuse me. How big was the alligator?&#13;
&#13;
DR. BAIR: Well they were probably from 30 to 36 inches maybe 40” maximum. Bob Schifman took a position somewhere else so the alligators were sitting there and they were going to be destroyed. So I said oh we can’t do that. I’ll take over that study and I’ll go ahead and do it. So we did. We did a pilot study to find out how sensitive they were. We had to get this study going. Nothing had ever been done so we were starting from scratch. We exposed a group of 20 or around 21 or 22 alligators.&#13;
&#13;
TODD: Now these were still about 3’ long?&#13;
&#13;
DR. BAIR: Yeah about that size. So these alligators had gotten out through that fence. How we don’t know but they squeezed through there and headed right for the Columbia River.   &#13;
&#13;
TODD: What did you expose them to?&#13;
&#13;
DR. BAIR: X radiation. And the timing was not good for what subsequently happened. We put them in the same ponds out there and I knew that obviously one had gotten away before. So the ponds are surrounded with chain link fence about 4 feet high. And we had plywood panels wired to the outside of that and overlapping so there would be no alligators getting out. Well that was not good enough because one morning our animal care-takers came out there and the first thing they saw was tracks going down to the river. &#13;
&#13;
TODD: Now these were alligators that had been exposed?&#13;
&#13;
DR. BAIR: Except for one. One was a control that was not exposed. The other 3 were exposed to radiation and we knew the doses and everything. We thought well we don’t want fisherman to find these alligators. So we got in touch with our management and with PR and they put a note in the paper saying that these alligators had escaped so people would know about it. But we were still working for General Electric Company then. That was before Battelle came in. And as happened that morning one of the vice presidents from General Electric was in town. So he picked up the newspaper. I think it was an evening paper in those days and there it was. He jumped on W.E.Johnson who was the plant manager. And W.E.Johnson obviously turned to Herb Parker who turned to Harry Konanberg who jumped on me. But we had already begun looking for the alligators. Going along the river. And we actually by that time we had found 2 of them. At that time the reactors were operating and the water from the reactors going back into the river was warm. And so the water along the shore was pretty warm and that’s where we found the 2 alligators.&#13;
&#13;
TODD: What time of year was this?&#13;
&#13;
DR. BAIR: I think it was July/August that time frame. Then they weren’t satisfied even though they knew we were doing this. Herb Parker sent a note to Harry Konanberg asking for a weekly report on what we had done to recover those alligators. So everyday I put out a crew looking for alligators. We searched as far down the river as Finley looking for 2 alligators. &#13;
&#13;
TODD: You searched as far as Finley.&#13;
&#13;
DR. BAIR: We did. We of course didn’t find them. But just the same I had to put a crew out everyday from I think the beginning of September until January. And every Friday I had to turn&#13;
 In a report to Harry Konanberg who sent it on to Parker who sent it on to Johnson the status of our alligator hunts. &#13;
&#13;
TODD: But you only found 2? So you still had 2 you were still looking for?&#13;
&#13;
DR. BAIR: Still 2 outdoors. Well anyway finally January I talked to our aquatic people and they convinced me if there were any alligators out there the water’s too cold for them. So I sent a note to Konanburg and to Parker that we have done everything we could and we’re not going to find them. He agreed that we could cease our alligator hunts. We did expose some more to complete that study the following summer. Well actually we did that winter. But this time we housed them inside the greenhouse which is shown there on that the thing. Well the greenhouse was near the ponds and in there we could control the temperature. The water in the ponds at this time of the year was too cold for the alligators. So the next phase of the study we did with the alligators housed inside of the greenhouse. There was no way that they could get out of there and of course they didn’t. And actually we finished the study the following summer with another group of alligators. We didn’t loose any of those. But alligators was not a very popular subject among the management at that time. You know it was very serious then. I tell you it was serious because I’d only been there a short time and I was young in my career and it was not a nice thing to have happen. You know we look back now with a bit of amusement but it was not funny at the time. &#13;
&#13;
TODD: Well the public is so paranoid about some of these types of things that I can imagine that you could get some pretty good stories about irradiated alligators there. And they would grow very large. Quite the old Woody Allen movie. &#13;
&#13;
DR. BAIR: I’ve had 2 calls since then think back in about the 70s. A fisherman reported that  &#13;
 had gone in a bar and said he had seen an alligator in the river. I had enough evidence to show that they wouldn’t survive. Then I think about in the 80s maybe it was in the 90s I guess shortly before I retired I had a call from a fish and wildlife person. He said, “Do you know anything about alligators in the Columbia River?’ I said, “No sir.” That was the end of the alligators. I hope.&#13;
&#13;
TODD: Yeah well they would have gotten to be pretty good size if they had lasted long. Ok now what were going to do. &#13;
&#13;
DR. BAIR: (showing photograph) This shows the equipment we used for exposing the alligators to X-radiation. Alligators were placed in this circular plexi-glass box and the box was placed on a turntable. The box was rotated underneath the X-ray beam to insure that the alligators received uniform exposure to the radiation.        &#13;
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                    <text>Those interested in reproducing part or all of this collection should contact the Hanford History Project at ourhanfordhistory@tricity.wsu.edu, who can provide specific rights information for these items.</text>
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              <text>&lt;p&gt;On May 29, 1855, 5,000 Native American chiefs and tribal delegates to the Walla Walla Treaty Conference gathered on the grasslands near Walla Walla to meet with Washington Territory’s Governor Isaac Stevens and Oregon Territory’s Superintendent of Indian Affairs Joel Palmer to negotiate tribal boundaries in eastern Washington. An afternoon rainstorm foreboded turbulent times ahead. After convening for two weeks, tribal representatives agreed to cede 60,000 square miles to the United States government in exchange for the Yakama Reservation in Washington, the Umatilla Reservation in Oregon, and the Nez Perce Reservation in Idaho. These concessions opened land to Euro-American settlement in the Priest Rapids Valley and profoundly reshaped the political geography of Washington.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;During the nineteenth century, many Euro-Americans adhered to the ideology of Manifest Destiny calling for divinely sanctioned continental expansion. Governor Stevens was no different. In 1853 after President Franklin Pierce appointed him both Governor and Superintendent of Indian Affairs in the newly created Washington Territory, Stevens promptly used his authority and his military surveying experience to promote Euro-American settlement and railroad networks in the Pacific Northwest, aided by army surveyor Captain George McClellan who later rose in fame as Union Commander during the American Civil War.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Stevens believed that before his plans could come to fruition he needed to legally abolish Native claims to the land.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;Between 1854 and 1855 Stevens pressured Puget Sound tribes into signing treaties that confined them to reservations while ceding much of the west coast to the United States.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; He pushed tribes to exchange traditional migratory lifestyles for European-style farming, and like many Euro-Americans saw reservations as a temporary step to assimilate Native Americans into “civilized” society.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; In mid-1855 Stevens and Palmer approached tribes of the Columbia Basin hoping to achieve similar concessions.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Leaders from the Yakama, Umatilla, Cayuse, Walla Walla, Nez Perce, and associated tribes traveled to Walla Walla to listen to their proposals.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; &lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;Yakama Chief Kamiakin initially tried to unite other leaders in opposition to any exploitative treaties.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Stevens and Palmer undermined this unity by cajoling and threatening the delegates. Stevens emphasized the benefits of farming, claimed the United States would make generous payments in clothing and equipment, and warned that reservations provided protection against “bad white men.”&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Palmer declared that Native Americans and Euro-Americans could never live together in harmony, disingenuously warning that without reservations and special protections, tribes would suffer theft and abuse at the hands of settlers.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Interpreter Andrew Pambrun claimed Stevens also told Kamiakin “if you do not accept the terms offered… you will walk in blood knee deep.”&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Gold had also been recently discovered in northern Washington, and few Native leaders could safely ignore the genocidal fate suffered by thousands of Native Americans during the California gold rush of 1849.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;Faced with these dire choices, Native leaders felt they had little choice but to agree to Stevens’ terms.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Stevens did make limited concessions. Tribes retained the right to fish and hunt on ceded lands, practices vital for physical and spiritual sustenance.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; In addition, although Stevens only proposed the Yakama and Nez Perce reservations, tribal representatives successfully demanded a third reservation for the Umatilla, Walla Walla, and Cayuse tribes.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; On June 9 delegates signed the Yakama Nation Treaty of 1855 and the Walla Walla, Cayuse, and Umatilla Treaty of 1855. According to Pambrun, when Kamiakin signed “he was in such a rage that he bit his lips that they bled profusely.”&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; A treaty with the Nez Perce was signed two days later.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; &lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;Stevens achieved the land concessions he desired, but his domineering attitude laid the foundation for future conflict. He conveniently overlooked the fact decentralized tribal leadership precluded any single chief from speaking for the entire tribe. Many groups impacted by the treaties of 1855 were not even represented at the council.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Stevens added to Native grievances by allowing Euro-American settlement in ceded territory before the treaties were ratified by Congress, and resulting skirmishes with miners only escalated tensions. The death of Indian Agent A. J. Bolon in September 1855 at the hands of Yakama warriors angry over the murder of a Native family started the Yakama War, a period of hostility lasting until 1858. Skirmishes erupted across Washington as the United States Army and territorial volunteers clashed with Yakama warriors supported by tribes throughout the Columbia Basin.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; In 1856 a young Cornelius Hanford, founding father of the town of Hanford, took refuge in the Seattle blockhouse when Native tribes attacked the community.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; &lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;There were few hostilities in the vicinity of White Bluffs, but the Priest Rapids Valley provided a useful trade and travel route for soldiers and civilians throughout this period.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; The Army forbade Euro-American settlement in eastern Washington due to the potential danger, but lifted these restriction after 1858.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; In 1859, Congress finally ratified the Walla Walla Conference treaties, marking a traumatic period of displacement for many Native Americans.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; There were a few exceptions, however. Arguing they had never signed a treaty with the United States, the Wanapum Tribe quietly remained in the Priest Rapids Valley where they had resided for thousands of years.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; In the early 1940s the Army temporarily allowed Wanapum members to continue accessing traditional fishing grounds on the restricted Hanford Site.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;The rights and stipulations enumerated in the treaties of 1855 still impact Native life. Fishing and hunting on ceded land remain cherished rights.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; These treaties also codified arbitrary boundaries drawn by United States officials when delineating tribal identities. The Yakama Treaty confederated fourteen disparate tribal bands into the Yakama Nation while the Walla Walla, Cayuse, and Umatilla Treaty placed three separate tribes onto one reservation, laying the foundations for contemporary Native political identities in the Columbia Basin.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/span&gt;</text>
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                  <text>Those interested in reproducing part or all of this collection should contact the Hanford History Project at ourhanfordhistory@tricity.wsu.edu, who can provide specific rights information for these items.</text>
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              <text>&lt;p&gt;One hot summer Sunday on July 28, 1996, college students William Thomas and David Deacy trekked along the Columbia River’s muddy shoreline hoping to witness the annual Columbia Cup hydroplane race, a Tri-Cities tradition since 1966. While walking through the muddy shallows at Columbia Park in Kennewick they were shocked to come upon a human skull partially buried in the shoreline. They notified the police of this unexpected find, who in turn sent the remains to Floyd Johnson of the Benton County coroner’s office for identification. Johnson was surprised by the age of the remains and promptly contacted consulting archeologist Dr. James Chatters for assistance. When the exact age of the find remained in doubt, Chatters sent a fragment of bone to be radiocarbon dated at the University of California, Riverside. The initial results indicated the individual soon to be dubbed by scientists and the press as “the Kennewick Man” and by Native American tribes as “the Ancient One,” was approximately 9,000 years old. This discovery initiated one of the most contentious debates over the handling of human remains in American history while casting light on the historical legacy of Native Americans in Washington State.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;This unique find reflects the fact that Native Americans resided in the Priest Rapids Valley for millennia. Indeed, the oldest discovered artifacts date back approximately 11,000 years.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Although the remains were discovered at the confluence of the Columbia, Snake, and Yakima rivers, an ancient hub of travel and trade, there is little certainty surrounding the Ancient One’s life and death.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Bone analyses determined he frequently maneuvered a spear and knapped stone into points. As a young man he even recovered from a spear injury to his hip, but the stone point remained lodged in his bone.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Isotopic analyses also concluded that salmon may well have been a primary ingredient in his diet; deer, salmon, and camas bulbs are ancient staple resources in the region.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Following the initial discovery the Umatilla, Yakama, Wanapum, Colville, and Nez Perce tribes of Washington and Idaho united to claim the Ancient One as their ancestor.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Tribal oral histories dating back thousands of years are consistent with the 2015 analysis of DNA remnants by a team of Danish scientists led by Dr. Eske Willerslev confirming the Ancient One was indeed related to contemporary Native Americans.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; &lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;The Ancient One’s heritage became a point of controversy once Dr. Chatters announced the age of the remains. This raised the possibility that the Army Corps of Engineers, who controlled the excavation site, was obligated to repatriate the body to Native tribes under the Native American Graves Protection and Repatriation Act (NAGPRA) of 1990. However, Chatters’ most controversial statement was his conclusion that the skeleton appeared to have “Caucasoid” features indicating the individual shared more traits in common with Europeans than Native Americans.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Although Chatters noted his findings did not mean Europeans had reached the continent before Native Americans, much nuance was lost in the subsequent publicity, and many articles questioned whether Native Americans were truly the original inhabitants of the Americas.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; The Umatilla and allied tribes argued that such statements were highly offensive, and petitioned for immediate repatriation of the remains and a halt to all further study.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Native remains have often been misappropriated and stolen by anthropologists and archeologists. Many tribes felt that the scientists and the press were using the find to dismiss and delegitimize Native oral histories and claims to the land, the latest steps in a long history of abuse.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;The Army Corps of Engineers supported the tribes in their quest for repatriation, prompting fears in the scientific community that a chance to examine an ancient human and answer questions about early American settlement would be lost forever.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; In October 1996, eight scientists sued to halt repatriation and allow the remains to be studied, initiating a twenty-year legal battle documented in numerous books and articles.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; At the heart of their case was the argument that NAGPRA only applied to modern tribes, and that remains so ancient could not be definitively attributed to any “existing tribes or cultures.”&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; After a lengthy process of adjudication the Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals handed down the final verdict in 2004, ruling in the scientists’ favor and authorizing analysis of the remains.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; The situation changed in 2015 when new DNA technology enabled researchers to safety conclude that the Ancient One was related to “modern Native Americans.”&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; As a result of these findings the federal government repatriated the Ancient One’s remains to the allied tribes for reburial at a secret location along the Columbia River.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; The discovery of the Ancient One demonstrates the need to establish and cultivate productive and respectful relationships between academic researchers and local tribes and communities, but also shines light onto the history of the Priest Rapids Valley and the people who resided in these lands over the last ten thousand years.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/span&gt;</text>
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              <text>&lt;p&gt;Approximately fifteen thousand years ago, roaring walls of water hundreds of feet high ripped through the Priest Rapids Valley at 80 miles an hour, scarring the hills and ridges, gouging out new ravines and coulees, and leaving sediment strewn across the landscape. All human and animal life in the path of the raging waters died instantly. Floods on this massive scale happened not once, but hundreds of times over the course of the last Ice Age, a period of glaciation lasting roughly 2.6 million years. During this time, glaciers across North America underwent cycles of expansion and contraction that lasted tens of thousands of years. The most recent cycle occurred between 80,000 and 15,000 years ago. The Cordilleran glacier spread south from Canada sending giant fingers of ice into Washington, Idaho, and Montana. One finger (the Purcell Trench ice lobe) traveled down the border of Idaho and Montana, creating an ice dam in the Rocky Mountains that prevented the flow of the Clark Fork River. Valleys behind the dam quickly filled with water to form 3,000 square mile Lake Missoula in Montana. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;Geologists estimate that between 15,000 and 13,000 years ago the ice containing Lake Missoula failed as many as 100 separate times, creating what are known as the Missoula Floods.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Rising water either caused the ice dam to float, or melted and widened cracks until the dam collapsed. Torrents of water then swept south and west across eastern Washington, traveling hundreds of miles before emptying through the Willamette Valley of Oregon into the Pacific Ocean. Water traveled so fast that each flood only lasted a week. Floodwater scraped away topsoil to form the Channeled Scablands and dramatically reshaped the topography of central and eastern Washington.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Other giant floods also occurred during this period. Seventeen thousand years ago, Lake Bonneville (the larger ancestor of the Great Salt Lake) in Utah smashed through its rocky bank, sending water as far north as Washington.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Glacial Lake Columbia in northern Washington also unleashed water when the glacier containing it retreated at the end of the ice age.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Together these floods significantly impacted the environment and landscape of the Priest Rapids Valley.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;The landmarks these floods left behind are readily distinguishable today. As floodwaters advanced south, they slammed into the Saddle Mountains along the northern border of the Priest Rapids Valley. Too high to breach, the mountains forced water west through Sentinel Gap just south of Beverly and east along what became the Ringold and Koontz Coulees, flowing down towards Hanford.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Missoula floodwaters slowed when they reached the narrow Wallula Gap southeast of Kennewick, a two mile opening in the Horse Heaven Hills through which the Columbia River flows to the sea. Excess floodwater quickly backed up into the Yakama and Priest Rapids Valleys, forming Lake Lewis.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; When the water slowed it deposited sediment, forming the Priest Rapids Bar near Priest Rapids Dam and Cold Creek Bar where much of the Hanford Site rests today. The Cold Creek Bar rerouted the Columbia River, blocking its original route south and forcing it east past the Hanford Site and White Bluffs. Flood deposits also rerouted the Yakama River, channeling it north through the Horn Rapids. On the Hanford Site, water completely covered Gable Mountain, eroding its slopes into the narrow, elongated shape seen today. Floodwaters also eroded the bluffs east of the Columbia, exposing distinctive white soil that gave name to the early town of White Bluffs.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; &lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;Could humans have witnessed these massive floods and lived to tell the tale? There is little evidence either way, although some Native American oral histories have reportedly been passed down for 14,000 years, and many stories from the region do refer to historic floods.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; In addition, Rattlesnake Mountain on the southern edge of the Priest Rapids Valley and one of the few landmarks higher than the floodwater is known to Native tribes as Laliik, or “‘stands above the water.’”&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Anyone lucky enough to survive the flooding would have had a difficult time remaining in the valley however. It takes time for plant and animal life to recover, and cyclical flooding ensured repeated destruction every several decades.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;As floodwaters emptied out of the Priest Rapids Valley, they left behind rocky debris from grounded icebergs and layers of sandy sediment.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Thousands of years later, this sediment defines agricultural life in the region. Many crops grow well here, and the region is particularly well suited to grapes that thrive in the dry, permeable soil.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Many American Viticultural Areas (AVAs) denoting quality wine regions are concentrated around the Priest Rapids Valley.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Conversely, this loose, water-permeable soil also ensures that all but the best insulated irrigation canals constantly leak.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Loose soil also contributes to frequent dust storms, a fact many new Hanford Site employees discovered when they arrived.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Perhaps the most pressing concern is the fact that the majority of the Hanford Site’s slowly leaking nuclear waste remains stored in this ice age sediment.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; The age of these mammoth floods has long past, but their presence remains etched in the valley and the lives of its inhabitants.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;</text>
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              <text>&lt;p&gt;In early March 1943, Priest Rapids Valley residents looked forward to a good harvest. Although valley farmers suffered during the Great Depression, rising crop prices caused by the ongoing war in Europe led many to finally see light at the end of the tunnel. These dreams shattered on March 6 when residents received official letters notifying them that the United States government had requisitioned their land for the war effort and that they were to vacate their homes within 30 days. Military officials with the Manhattan Project had selected the valley as the site for the world’s first plutonium production facility. Known as the Hanford Engineer Works (the Hanford Site), this installation eventually encompassed 670 square miles selected for its isolation, access to electric power from Bonneville and Grand Coulee Dams, and proximity to the Columbia River. The evictions displaced approximately 2,000 people and destroyed many of the small communities throughout the valley.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;American history is filled with similar tales. During the mid-nineteenth century the federal government pressured Native American tribes to cede vast portions of Washington State, enabling successive waves of Euro-American traders, gold miners, ranchers, and farmers to settle the Priest Rapids Valley.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; These settlements blossomed in the early twentieth century when irrigation projects watered the arid shrubsteppe.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Hanford and White Bluffs were two of the largest towns in the valley, and in 1940 had populations of 463 and 501 people respectively. Richland had a population of 247 but hundreds more resided on farms surrounding the town and homesteads and small communities dotted the valley.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; The Wanapum Tribe also lived here as they had done for thousands of years.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Few people realized how suddenly this would change.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;Residents later recalled seeing “surveyors, engineers, and appraisers” in early 1943. At the time few realized the significance of these sightings.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; At the start of the year the government had quietly prepared to requisition the region and on February 23 a federal court sanctioned these plans.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Authorities publicized this decision on March 6, notifying residents in Hanford, White Bluffs, the farms around Richland, and surrounding communities.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Emotions “ranged from resignation to shock and disbelief, [and] to anger and bitterness.”&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Residents had spent decades investing time, savings, and energy into their farms, and many cherished the bonds of friendship and community that held these towns together.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Hypotheses about the Hanford Site’s purpose ranged from a poison gas factory to toilet paper plant, but few explanations eased the emotional and financial burden carried by those facing eviction.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;Inconsistent eviction dates added to confusion. Although most notices gave residents 30 days to leave, Army officials postponed evictions for people with farms near the edge of the Hanford Site until after fall harvest. Food was a vital resource in wartime.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Indeed, after farmers were evicted the government used prisoners to pick remaining fruit, and some orchards remained in cultivation until the end of the war.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Although the government offered residents compensation for lost property, different eviction dates and fluctuating crop prices created discrepancies when government appraisers assessed property values.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Observers and residents also argued that appraisers were poorly trained, used sloppy measurement techniques, and grossly misjudged market values.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Many evictees successfully sued the government, and courts often doubled the compensation farmers received.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Some rulings increased the land valuation “as high as 600 per cent.”&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;None of these rulings could reverse the displacement of Priest Rapids Valley residents. Although traces of Hanford and White Bluffs remain, bulldozers destroyed most of these communities.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Workers even exhumed bodies buried at White Bluffs Cemetery, reinterning the remains at the nearby town of Prosser.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Many evicted residents eventually resettled in towns around Washington.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Forced to buy new land at a time when prices were high, they often could not replace what they had lost.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; A few chose to stay as Hanford Site employees.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Richland remained standing, converted by Manhattan Project contractor DuPont into a “company town” built around servicing the Hanford Site.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Many buildings were used as offices and houses for government workers and in 1944 the town’s population numbered 11,000 people.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; &lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;The establishment of the Hanford Site also severed the Wanapum tribe’s access to the valley. Although they received special permission to fish near White Bluffs in 1943, the military revoked this decision two years later.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Over the following decades, former White Bluffs and Hanford residents came together at annual reunions to reminisce about the communities they lost.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; The Priest Rapids Valley achieved renown, first as the region where America’s nuclear arsenal was created and later as the repository for catastrophic quantities of environmental pollutants, but the communities that once stood here and the dreams of the people who lived in the valley remain buried underneath the sand and in distant memories.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;</text>
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                <text>A virtual guide to the communities displaced when the federal government inaugurated the Manhattan Project on the Hanford Site in 1943. Funded by the Benton County, Washington Historical Preservation Grant.</text>
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                    <text>Elva McGhan Wallace Collection</text>
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                    <text>1944</text>
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                    <text>Those interested in reproducing part or all of this collection should contact the Hanford History Project at ourhanfordhistory@tricity.wsu.edu, who can provide specific rights information for these items.</text>
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                    <text>Horn Rapids Dam Fish Screens</text>
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                    <text>A virtual guide to the communities displaced when the federal government inaugurated the Manhattan Project on the Hanford Site in 1943. Funded by the Benton County, Washington Historical Preservation Grant.</text>
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                    <text>Those interested in reproducing part or all of this collection should contact the Hanford History Project at ourhanfordhistory@tricity.wsu.edu, who can provide specific rights information for these items.</text>
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                    <text>A virtual guide to the communities displaced when the federal government inaugurated the Manhattan Project on the Hanford Site in 1943. Funded by the Benton County, Washington Historical Preservation Grant.</text>
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                    <text>1945</text>
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                    <text>Those interested in reproducing part or all of this collection should contact the Hanford History Project at ourhanfordhistory@tricity.wsu.edu, who can provide specific rights information for these items.</text>
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                  <text>Guide to the Pre-Manhattan Project Towns of Hanford, White Bluffs, and Richland</text>
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                  <text>The towns of Hanford, White Bluffs and Richland Washington prior to 1943.</text>
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                  <text>Project funded by the Benton County, Washington Historical Preservation Grant. A virtual guide to the communities displaced when the federal government inaugurated the Manhattan Project on the Hanford Site in 1943. </text>
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                  <text>Those interested in reproducing part or all of this collection should contact the Hanford History Project at ourhanfordhistory@tricity.wsu.edu, who can provide specific rights information for these items.</text>
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              <text>&lt;p&gt;At the turn of the nineteenth century, farmers and entrepreneurs dreamed of large irrigation projects to transform the arid Priest Rapids Valley into a fertile breadbasket rivaling California. Soon irrigation ditches and canals both real and planned crisscrossed the region. Constructed in 1892, the Horn Rapids Dam (renamed Wanawish Dam in 1997) was the cornerstone to irrigation efforts along the lower Yakama River, controlling water levels and enabling the communities of Kennewick and Richland to thrive. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;Horn Rapids Dam derives its name from its location on the Horn Rapids, a short strip of the Yakama River that makes an abrupt north-south U-turn before emptying into the Columbia. The Rapids are a traditional salmon and whitefish fishing ground for the Yakama and Wanapum Indian tribes, and a 1994 federal report clarifies that Wanawish in fact means “rock dam fishing place.”&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Native tribes gathered food throughout the valley during seasonal migrations, and Wanapum Chief Johnny Buck’s brother Frank remembered that the Wanapum Tribe often stopped at Horn Rapids during the middle of the summer.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Native men fished off of wooden fishing platforms using spears and dip nets, while women on the shore sliced fish open to dry on poles.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Although Euro-Americans forced many Washington tribes onto reservations, rights guaranteed by the Yakama Treaty of 1855 allowed Native Americans to continue fishing the Horn Rapids.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; These rights remain in effect today, and Native fishing platforms can still be seen along the Yakama River.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Euro-American settlers fished as well, and even in 1914, lucky fishermen caught 30-pound salmon.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; &lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;Euro-Americans soon saw the Horn Rapids as an important location for agriculture as well. Although construction of Northern Pacific (NP) rail lines during the 1880s facilitated settlement, farmers needed irrigation.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; The Yakama Irrigation and Improvement Company (YI&amp;amp;I) first tried to address this need. New York entrepreneurs founded the YI&amp;amp;I in 1888 and purchased thousands of acres of NP holdings in the Yakama Valley.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Initial plans were to construct an irrigation canal near Kiona and two canals originating on either side of the Horn Rapids, one to irrigate Kennewick to the south and one to irrigate farmland in the north (this northern community became Richland in 1905).&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; The YI&amp;amp;I purchased water rights to the Horn Rapids in 1891, and in November 1892 superintendent I. W. Dudley announced the construction of a concrete dam to “extend the width of the river bed [for] 600 feet.”&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; This dam raised the height of the Yakama River to ensure canals received water throughout the year.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;Despite the YI&amp;amp;I’s optimism, construction on its canal network progressed slowly, and the company faced persistent financial problems.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Although they successfully extended the southern canal to Kennewick in 1893 it was expensive to operate and maintain. Seepage caused by loose soil was a constant problem. Even a decade later some canals in the region still lost over 25% of their precious water to leaks.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; These plans came to naught when financial instability, exacerbated by the national economic crisis of 1893 and damage from severe flooding in 1894, collapsed the YI&amp;amp;I.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;Large scale irrigation projects were thus put on hold until NP employee Thomas Cooper arrived in the region in 1901. Cooper and other NP officials were optimistic about irrigation’s potential. The NP could make money selling water and the increased agricultural production would simultaneously increase rail traffic.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; That year the Northwestern Improvement Company (NWI), an NP subsidiary, purchased what was left of the Kennewick Canal and the Horn Rapids Dam.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; NP officials worried about putting all their eggs in the NWI basket however, and so in 1902 the NWI transferred its Kennewick assets to the Northern Pacific Irrigation Company (NPI), a separate subsidiary.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; In addition to repairing the Kennewick Canal the NPI extensively renovated the Horn Rapids Dam, constructing a more “permanent dam” in 1903 to provide water for its irrigation holdings.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; The new Horn Rapids Dam was constructed out of wood and rock using a timber crib design that remained unchanged for a century. Only after 1996 flooding severely damaged the structure did engineers install a concrete dam.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; &lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;The Horn Rapids Dam is an example a successful early irrigation projects in the Arid West, providing vital water to farming communities on both sides of the Yakama River. Kennewick grew quickly over the next three decades as a result of the dam.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Administration changed in 1918 when the newly formed Columbia Irrigation District (CID) assumed control of NPI’s holdings, including the Kennewick Canal and Horn Rapids Dam.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; On the north side of the Yakama River developments followed a similar trajectory under the direction of local entrepreneurs. The Lower Yakama Improvement Company and the Benton Water Company both tried to irrigate farms along the lower Yakama and in 1908 used their joint resources to construct the 15-mile Richland Irrigation Canal. This canal serviced farms around Richland until the town was annexed by the United States government in 1943.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Land near Horn Rapids Dam was put to additional use when, in 1944, the American military constructed a facility called Colombia Camp to house the Hanford Site’s prison labor force.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Even today Horn Rapids Dam remains vital to Yakama River irrigation and serves as a valued fishing ground for Native tribes.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;</text>
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                <text>A virtual guide to the communities displaced when the federal government inaugurated the Manhattan Project on the Hanford Site in 1943. Funded by the Benton County, Washington Historical Preservation Grant.</text>
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                <text>The Hanford History Project at Washington State University Tri-Cities</text>
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                <text>Those interested in reproducing part or all of this collection should contact the Hanford History Project at ourhanfordhistory@tricity.wsu.edu, who can provide specific rights information for these items.</text>
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                    <text>Vernita school house</text>
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                    <text>A group young people standing on the porch of a school house. Between Priest Rapids &amp; Allard. &#13;
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                    <text>Harry and Juanita Anderson Collection</text>
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                    <text>1924</text>
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                    <text>Those interested in reproducing part or all of this collection should contact the Hanford History Project at ourhanfordhistory@tricity.wsu.edu, who can provide specific rights information for these items.&#13;
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                  <text>Guide to the Pre-Manhattan Project Towns of Hanford, White Bluffs, and Richland</text>
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                  <text>The towns of Hanford, White Bluffs and Richland Washington prior to 1943.</text>
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                  <text>Project funded by the Benton County, Washington Historical Preservation Grant. A virtual guide to the communities displaced when the federal government inaugurated the Manhattan Project on the Hanford Site in 1943. </text>
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                  <text>Those interested in reproducing part or all of this collection should contact the Hanford History Project at ourhanfordhistory@tricity.wsu.edu, who can provide specific rights information for these items.</text>
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              <text>&lt;p&gt;Located in northern Benton County with the Priest Rapids Dam to the west and the abandoned town of White Bluffs to the east, Vernita marks a historic embarkation point for travelers crossing the Columbia River. Local Native American tribes traversed this region thousands of years before European settlement, and the Wanapum Indians in particular valued the Priest Rapids Valley as a bountiful Sockeye Salmon fishery during the fall and a seasonal camp during the winter. The mid-nineteenth century saw an influx of Euro-Americans to the region as prospectors searched for gold and farmers traveled en-route to the Willamette Valley of Oregon. Although the region’s dry terrain attracted few farmers, ranchers valued the vast, unfenced open spaces and the plentiful bunchgrass that could be used as fodder for cattle and horses. After harsh winters in the 1880s destroyed cattle herds throughout the Washington territory, settlers near Priest Rapids Valley, inspired by a growing faith that modern science and engineering could reshape desert environments into lush farmland, turned increasingly towards agriculture as a source of subsistence and profit. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;Vernita was one of the many small communities that developed during this period of settlement at the turn of the twentieth century. Before the construction of railroads, river steamers and ferries were lifelines for these secluded communities, providing critical transportation and shipping services.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Although residents had long preferred to cross the Columbia several miles east at the White Bluffs ford where the soil was firmer than the sandy banks further towards Priest Rapids, this did not stop German homesteader Otto Jaeger from opening a ferry business at Vernita in 1901.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; A fixture in the Vernita farming community, Jaeger maintained a home described by historian Martha Berry Parker as “a mecca for travelers and wayfarers.”&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; In the late 1900s entrepreneur Jackson T. Richmond assumed control over the Vernita ferry, and in 1908 he replaced Jaeger’s older oar and current-powered vessel with a newer cable ferry.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; The eponymous “Richmond ferry” operated until 1943, providing vital transportation to local passengers and livestock alike.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; A public ferry service was revived in 1957 as part of a Washington State highway initiative, and remained in service until the construction of Vernita Bridge in 1965.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;Irrigation was as vital to the early survival of the Vernita farming community as river transportation, and Vernita farmers were often forced to rely on private businesses such as the Priest Rapids Irrigation and Power Company (PRIPC) and its successor, the Hanford Irrigation and Power Company (HIPC). In 1908 the HIPC’s construction of the Priest Rapids Powerplant and the Coyote Rapids Pumping Plant (Allard Pump House) helped provide irrigation to the Priest Rapids Valley, but technical and financial difficulties hindering waterflow and corporate solvency ensured that access to water remained a perpetual concern for farmers.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Vernita farmers found that most crops could grow with proper irrigation. Although apples, peaches, cherries, and apricots were staple crops, the region’s climate is hospitable to a wide variety of produce ranging from strawberries and melons to tobacco and peanuts.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; One particularly notable example occurred in 1940 when the Kennewick &lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt;Courier-Reporter&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; announced that farmers at Vernita had discovered a new variety of fast ripening apricot in Paul Bruggerman’s orchard that they had christened “Riverland Moorpark.”&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Indeed, farmers and journalists often declared that crops grown at Vernita ripened earlier than produce grown in other areas of the state, a fact advertised by valley boosters seeking to encourage new settlement.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Although the first farmers at Vernita shipped fresh produce to market via riverboat, shipping schedules became more consistent and dependable in 1913 when the Chicago, Milwaukee and St. Paul Railroad extended a branch through Vernita on its route from Beverly, Washington to Hanford.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;Despite these changes, Vernita remained a small town throughout its existence, dwarfed by the neighboring town of White Bluffs which had a population of 500 by 1940.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Residents maintained an adequate education system with some difficulty. Although children attended elementary school within Vernita, high school students were forced to travel to White Bluffs.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; This shortage of educational facilities was exacerbated in 1929 when the Vernita school building was destroyed by fire, an omnipresent threat on the dry and windy shrub steppe.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; The Great Depression brought economic hardship to Vernita as produce markets collapsed, although farmers had the advantage of being able to grow their own food.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; The economic crisis spurred a wave of federal spending that directly impacted the lives of Vernita residents. A country extension school was established in Vernita in 1933 to provide farmers with access to the latest agricultural research and techniques.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Vernita’s industry also evolved during the early 1940s when the Bonneville Power Administration constructed a new substation next to the town.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Named “Midway Substation” for its location between the newly completed Grand Coulee Dam and the Bonneville Dam, this facility was a valuable source of employment in the region.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; &lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;Locals had little time to benefit from these developments. In March 1943, shocked and angry residents throughout the Priest Rapids Valley received government notifications stating that their properties had been acquisitioned for the war effort.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Vernita’s proximity to the Priest Rapids Power Plant and the Midway Substation was a blessing for some of Vernita’s residents. Although towns like Hanford and White Bluffs were bulldozed during the construction of the Hanford Site, Murrel Dawson recalls that the government allowed her father to remain in the Priest Rapids Valley until 1948 to operate the power plant.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Vernita itself survived into the 1970s as a company town housing the families of several Midway Substation employees.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; The stretch of river next to Vernita Bridge and townsite remains a popular destination for salmon fishing, but little remains of the once vibrant agricultural community.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/span&gt;</text>
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                  <text>Those interested in reproducing part or all of this collection should contact the Hanford History Project at ourhanfordhistory@tricity.wsu.edu, who can provide specific rights information for these items.</text>
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              <text>&lt;p&gt;The name Hanford is forever tied to the Manhattan Project and construction of the first atomic weaponry, but few traces remain of the town upon whose ruins the nuclear age was born. Although the town of Hanford was less than 40 years old when government bulldozers leveled its buildings to construct plutonium production facilities in the early 1940s, its residents had already built a resilient community and agricultural economy. Irrigation water was the lifeblood for many farming communities and Hanford owed its existence to large-scale irrigation projects. Entrepreneur Manley Bostwick Haynes and his father-in-law Judge Cornelius Hanford led these efforts, founding the Priest Rapids Irrigation &amp;amp; Power Company (PRIPC) in 1905 to irrigate 32,000 acres in the Priest Rapids Valley. These development efforts depended upon the successful establishment of a company town in the region, a seed Hanford and Haynes hoped would blossom into an economic powerhouse. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;Early disagreements over the best location for a town contributed to the dissolution of the PRIPC. Some investors, including Hanford and Haynes, established the Hanford Irrigation &amp;amp; Power Company (HIPC) while others formed the White Bluffs Irrigation Company (WBIC).&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Although the old town of White Bluffs had been located along the eastern bank of the Columbia River, the WBIC established a new townsite on the western side where there was more space for growth.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; In 1907 the HIPC established its own town roughly seven miles downriver from White Bluffs, naming the community Hanford after the company’s president.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; That same year the HIPC completed the Hanford Ditch, an irrigation canal channeling water at Coyote Rapids to farmland near Hanford.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; In 1908 while engineers completed a power plant at Priest Rapids and a pumping station (Allard’s Pump House) to supply water to the Hanford Ditch, Daniel Pratt of &lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt;The Ranch&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; lauded the project as “A Great Irrigated Empire in the Making.”&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;The HIPC shared this enthusiasm. Before the town had even been established, they advertised the fantastic profits to be made by those purchasing land at Hanford.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; As a result, Hanford quickly boomed. In 1908 &lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt;The Spokesman-Review&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; estimated a population “of between 200 and 300 people.”&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; By 1910 the population numbered 369, and several businesses dotted the town. The Jahnke and Parker Bank opened its doors, and newcomers rested at the newly constructed Planters and Columbia Hotels.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Initially, a single building served as both a school and a church.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Eventually Hanford grew to contain several churches and denominations and in 1917 the town constructed a new high school for local children.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; &lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;The HIPC helped establish a town ferry service to compensate for the poor roads and dearth of bridges that hindered travel in the region.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Their crowning achievement came in 1913 when the Chicago, Milwaukee and St. Paul Railroad built a branch from Beverly to Hanford, allowing farmers to consistently ship produce to market.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; The fertile soil of the Priest Rapids Valley proved excellent for growing high quality soft fruits, berries, and grapes as well as alfalfa and asparagus.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; However, farmers also needed a reliable irrigation system, something the HIPC struggled to provide. The Hanford Ditch was prone to washouts and seepage; expensive problems frequently encountered due to the loose, porous soil of the Priest Rapids Valley.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; For two decades the HIPC sputtered in the face of financial crises and litigation until disbanding in 1930 to be replaced by the Priest Rapids Irrigation District.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; &lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;Hanford continued to grow despite these problems, albeit at a slower pace. By 1940 roughly 463 people lived in Hanford, a long way from the optimistic 40,000 predicted by &lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt;The Wenatchee Daily World&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; in 1907.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Fires periodically damaged the town, most notably in 1910 when much of Hanford’s business district burned and during the winter of 1936 when fire destroyed the Hanford High School.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Daily life was difficult, and families worked together to plant, cultivate, and harvest crops. Many farmers struggled to survive and often worked odd jobs to supplement meager farming incomes. The Great Depression exacerbated this poverty.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Nevertheless, resident Robert Brinson remembered Hanford was a safe community where “people… helped each other,” and many Priest Rapids Valley inhabitants later recalled feeling a strong community spirit.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Social activities defined life in Hanford. Local organizations included The Grange, local churches, and the town band, while events ranged from community fairs and July 4&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt;&lt;span&gt;th&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; celebrations to school sporting events.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; &lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;On a national level, Hanford citizens thought of themselves as patriotic Americans, and during World War I and World War II raised money for the Red Cross, rationed food, sent care packages to soldiers overseas, and performed military service.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; Washington State allocated land near Hanford for the Land Settlement Act of 1919, a program designed to provide subsidized land to veterans.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; The impacts of World War II hit closer to home. Hanford residents were anguished when they received letters in March 1943 notifying them that their property had been acquired by the United States government and that they had a month to vacate the premises.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; After the Manhattan Project destroyed the town of Hanford, many displaced residents felt grief for the community they lost and for decades held reunions to keep old friendships alive. Today little remains of the once bustling town except for faint irrigation ditches and the ruins of the abandoned Hanford High School silhouetted against the sky.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt; &lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;</text>
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                    <text>Six images. "Vern Chase planted about 440 young trees on Allard Ranch, WA. 1941. IT shows how good the soil was first along the river (The Columbia) two years later, the government of the US moved in for the Atomic Bomb Project. (Broke my father's heart)."  #1: March 1, 1941. Bare ground before plowed." #2: " 1st young trees. April 1, 1941." #3: "Same tree, May 1, 1941." #4: "Same tree, 1941 in June 1." #5: "July 1, 1941 one of aprioct trees." #6: "July 1, 1941 Same Peach tree." </text>
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                    <text>1941</text>
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                    <text>Those interested in reproducing part or all of this collection should contact the Hanford History Project at ourhanfordhistory@tricity.wsu.edu, who can provide specific rights information for these items.</text>
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                    <text>Six images. "Vernon Chase loved to farm-almost a one man deal.  After Sam Allard left the ranch. #1 East end of Allard Ranch, 1941. #2 Vern Chase planted a corn field-young stalks. #3 West end of Allard Ranch, 1941.  #4 Vernon Chase's Corn fields at Allard, WA., 1941. (Later picture).  #5 Vern Chase planted corn between his young orchard, 1941.  Her wrote to Verna, 130 peach trees, 125 prune trees, 150 apricot trees, 35 apple trees.  A new orchard on lower 5 acres of Allard Ranch.  #6 Columbia River frozen over, 1941.  Dogs on the ice! </text>
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                    <text>1941</text>
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                    <text>Those interested in reproducing part or all of this collection should contact the Hanford History Project at ourhanfordhistory@tricity.wsu.edu, who can provide specific rights information for these items.</text>
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                    <text>Five images. #1 "Grandma Allard (Delia) 1941." #2: "Columbia River Ranch at Allard 1941." #3: "Vern Chase's corn and grandaughters Marea and Sharon Thompson. 1941 East end of Ranch." #4: "Vernon Chase on Allard Ranch, WA 1941." #5: Vern Chase taken by his daughter about 1941 (Vern's) Looking for arrowheads at Allard." </text>
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                  <text>Guide to the Pre-Manhattan Project Towns of Hanford, White Bluffs, and Richland</text>
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                  <text>The towns of Hanford, White Bluffs and Richland Washington prior to 1943.</text>
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                  <text>Project funded by the Benton County, Washington Historical Preservation Grant. A virtual guide to the communities displaced when the federal government inaugurated the Manhattan Project on the Hanford Site in 1943. </text>
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                  <text>Those interested in reproducing part or all of this collection should contact the Hanford History Project at ourhanfordhistory@tricity.wsu.edu, who can provide specific rights information for these items.</text>
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              <text>&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;Advances in irrigation were a main factor in the rise of migration to the Columbia Basin at the turn of the century. The Priest Rapids Irrigation &amp;amp; Power Company, later the Hanford Irrigation &amp;amp; Power Company, constructed irrigation canals and pumping stations to supply water to the growing agricultural area. The Hanford Irrigation &amp;amp; Power Company pump house was operated by Samuel Allard for three decades.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;Samuel Moses Allard was born to Moses and Modess Allard in Churubusco, New York on March 3, 1859. The Allard Family moved to Red Lake Falls, Minnesota in 1881 where Samuel married Emma Malvina Marie Crompe on November 30 of that year. Allard was the first town clerk and assessor of Gervais Township in Red Lake County, Minnesota beginning in 1885 where he was in charge of recording all births and deaths. Samuel and Emma Allard had four children together prior to her death in 1888. Samuel remarried Delia (Mayhew) Allard in 1890 with whom he had an additional child.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;Samuel, Delia and their daughter Anna moved to Washington State in 1908 when Samuel was hired by the Hanford Irrigation &amp;amp; Power Company (HIPC) to help construct an irrigation pumping station near the Coyote Rapids community. Coyote Rapids, located west of White Bluffs, was originally the village of P’na, which European settlers took from the people of the Wanapum tribe. The Coyote Rapids community was located in what is now the 100 K Area of the Hanford Nuclear Reservation. &lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;Samuel was the primary operator for the HIPC hydroelectric pumping station, which supplied water to the nearby town sites of Hanford and White Bluffs through the Hanford Irrigation Canal. The Allard family owned around 200 acres of land in the Coyote Rapids community where they grew peaches, apricots, corn and alfalfa as well as raising cattle. In 1912 the Chicago, Milwaukee and St. Paul Railway added a stop in the Coyote Rapids area after which Samuel built a store and post office for the community, which then went by Allard. &lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;Allard was very active in the community and local politics at times serving as president of the White Bluffs Commercial Club, postmaster for the local grange and County Commissioner of Benton County. Allard operated the Hanford Irrigation &amp;amp; Power Company pump house for thirty years, which led many to refer to it as “Allard Pump house” to this day. Samuel and Delia Allard divorced in 1926 and he married his third wife, Hortense, a few years later. Samuel and Hortense remained in the Allard community until the United States Government seized the land in 1943 for the creation of the Hanford Nuclear Reservation. The Allards moved to Prosser, Washington where Samuel Allard died in 1945.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;</text>
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                <text>Samuel Moses Allard</text>
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                <text>A virtual guide to the communities displaced when the federal government inaugurated the Manhattan Project on the Hanford Site in 1943. Funded by the Benton County, Washington Historical Preservation Grant.</text>
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                <text>The Hanford History Project at Washington State University Tri-Cities</text>
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                <text>Those interested in reproducing part or all of this collection should contact the Hanford History Project at ourhanfordhistory@tricity.wsu.edu, who can provide specific rights information for these items.</text>
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                  <text>Guide to the Pre-Manhattan Project Towns of Hanford, White Bluffs, and Richland</text>
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                  <text>The towns of Hanford, White Bluffs and Richland Washington prior to 1943.</text>
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                <elementText elementTextId="40799">
                  <text>Those interested in reproducing part or all of this collection should contact the Hanford History Project at ourhanfordhistory@tricity.wsu.edu, who can provide specific rights information for these items.</text>
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              <text>&lt;p&gt;Manley Bostwick Haynes and Judge Cornelius Holgate Hanford&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;James Schroeder&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;August 16, 2020&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt; &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;In 1900 the Priest Rapids Valley was sparsely populated save for scattered settlements near the small community of White Bluffs. This changed over the following decade when Manley Bostwick Haynes and his father-in-law Judge Cornelius Holgate Hanford established the town of Hanford several miles south of White Bluffs.&lt;a title=""&gt;&lt;sup&gt;&lt;sup&gt;[1]&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/a&gt; An ambitious Seattle banker, real estate investor, and socialite, Haynes often graced the society page of &lt;em&gt;The&lt;/em&gt; &lt;em&gt;Seattle Daily Times&lt;/em&gt;, first as an eligible bachelor and later as husband to Judge Hanford’s daughter Elaine.&lt;a title=""&gt;&lt;sup&gt;&lt;sup&gt;[2]&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/a&gt; Haynes always kept his eyes open for investment opportunities, and while sailing down the Columbia River during the 1890s found himself drawn to the open landscape of the Priest Rapids Valley. Convinced an adequate irrigation network could transform the dry shrub-steppe into farmland, Haynes purchased 32,000 acres between Richland and White Bluffs, an endeavor &lt;em&gt;The Ranch&lt;/em&gt; claimed “promises to be one of the largest public utilities in the state.”&lt;a title=""&gt;&lt;sup&gt;&lt;sup&gt;[3]&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/a&gt; Haynes asked his father-in-law for support, and Judge Hanford became an enthusiastic investor.&lt;a title=""&gt;&lt;sup&gt;&lt;sup&gt;[4]&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/a&gt; By 1905 Haynes, Hanford, and several prominent Seattle businessmen established the Priest Rapids Irrigation &amp;amp; Power Company (PRIPC) to turn vision into reality.&lt;a title=""&gt;&lt;sup&gt;&lt;sup&gt;[5]&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Hanford was no stranger to ambition and had already achieved significant success as a lawyer and judge, becoming Washington Territory’s chief justice in 1889 and the first federal district court judge for Washington State in 1890.&lt;a title=""&gt;&lt;sup&gt;&lt;sup&gt;[6]&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/a&gt; Hanford supported agricultural development efforts, saying in 1905 in a speech steeped in racial bias that Native Americans, “as occupiers of the land, failed to use it as God intended that it should be used, so as to yield its fruits in abundance for the comfort of millions of inhabitants.”&lt;a title=""&gt;&lt;sup&gt;&lt;sup&gt;[7]&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/a&gt; When internal disputes led to the disintegration of the PRIPC Hanford and Haynes persevered, establishing the Hanford Irrigation &amp;amp; Power Company (HIPC) in 1906.&lt;a title=""&gt;&lt;sup&gt;&lt;sup&gt;[8]&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/a&gt; Hanford served for a time as HIPC president while Haynes acted as the company secretary.&lt;a title=""&gt;&lt;sup&gt;&lt;sup&gt;[9]&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Over the next two years as the HIPC constructed irrigation and pumping facilities, employees delineated and developed a company town.&lt;a title=""&gt;&lt;sup&gt;&lt;sup&gt;[10]&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/a&gt; Platted in 1907, this new town was named Hanford after the HIPC’s prestigious founder.&lt;a title=""&gt;&lt;sup&gt;&lt;sup&gt;[11]&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/a&gt; The HIPC advertised to attract new residents and Haynes even purchased a homestead for himself, moving there with his family in 1913. Known as “‘Arrowhead on the Columbia,’” &lt;em&gt;The Seattle Daily Times&lt;/em&gt; described Haynes’ residence as “one of the show spots of the Hanford district.”&lt;a title=""&gt;&lt;sup&gt;&lt;sup&gt;[12]&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/a&gt; A prominent member of the community, Haynes was secretary of the White Bluffs Golf Club and even ran for State Representative in 1914.&lt;a title=""&gt;&lt;sup&gt;&lt;sup&gt;[13]&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/a&gt; Hanford’s brother Clarence also made a home here, establishing what historian Martha Berry Parker describes as “one of the valley’s most magnificent fruit farms.”&lt;a title=""&gt;&lt;sup&gt;&lt;sup&gt;[14]&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/a&gt; It is small wonder that Clarence Hanford was the one who gave grape mogul P. R. Welch a tour of the valley in 1911, petitioning him to open a juice factory near Hanford.&lt;a title=""&gt;&lt;sup&gt;&lt;sup&gt;[15]&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/a&gt; As a result of these efforts, Hanford’s population grew so that by 1910 the town numbered 369 people.&lt;a title=""&gt;&lt;sup&gt;&lt;sup&gt;[16]&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/a&gt; HIPC irrigation efforts were less successful. Persistent financial and maintenance problems dogged the company even after the Pacific Power and Light Company purchased it in 1910. Years of litigation ensued as Hanford, Haynes, and local farmers attempted to reduce exorbitant water rates. They received a favorable ruling in 1922 but legal costs left Haynes bankrupt.&lt;a title=""&gt;&lt;sup&gt;&lt;sup&gt;[17]&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Hanford’s downfall came primarily at his own hand. In May 1912 he revoked the citizenship of naturalized citizen Leonard Olsson on the grounds that he was a socialist, a decision that made national news and prompted an investigation by the US House of Representative’s Judiciary Committee.&lt;a title=""&gt;&lt;sup&gt;&lt;sup&gt;[18]&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/a&gt; Numerous witnesses subsequently testified that Hanford was a habitual drunk who caroused with women late into the night.&lt;a title=""&gt;&lt;sup&gt;&lt;sup&gt;[19]&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/a&gt; Even worse was the accusation that Hanford helped the HIPC purchase land from the Northern Pacific Railroad (NP) at a discount in exchange for a favorable tax ruling in 1907 that saved the NP $60,000. His credibility fatally undermined, Hanford tendered his resignation on July 22, 1912. The Congressional inquiry concluded after his resignation, conveniently halting further investigation into the actions of Hanford’s powerful business associates.&lt;a title=""&gt;&lt;sup&gt;&lt;sup&gt;[20]&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Despite the financial setbacks and scandals, Haynes and Hanford remained active in the Hanford community. In 1916, Haynes served as director of the Hanford school district and during WWI both men supported Red Cross donation drives and returning veterans.&lt;a title=""&gt;&lt;sup&gt;&lt;sup&gt;[21]&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/a&gt; Hanford became an author, and wrote about the history of Seattle until his death in 1926.&lt;a title=""&gt;&lt;sup&gt;&lt;sup&gt;[22]&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/a&gt; Haynes went on to serve as acting secretary of the Pacific Northwest Fruit Exposition in 1921.&lt;a title=""&gt;&lt;sup&gt;&lt;sup&gt;[23]&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/a&gt; That year he also served as president of Commonwealth Petroleum, a drilling interest in Benton County, and in 1922 he incorporated the Hanford-Priest Rapids Land Company.&lt;a title=""&gt;&lt;sup&gt;&lt;sup&gt;[24]&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/a&gt; Although Haynes moved to Seattle during the 1920s he did not lose his enthusiasm for rural development projects, and in 1935 he served as vice-president of the Columbia River Development League.&lt;a title=""&gt;&lt;sup&gt;&lt;sup&gt;[25]&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/a&gt; Haynes passed away in 1942 one year before the United States government destroyed the town he had worked so hard to create.&lt;a title=""&gt;&lt;sup&gt;&lt;sup&gt;[26]&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/sup&gt;&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt; &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt; &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;div&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;div&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a title=""&gt;[1]&lt;/a&gt; Mary Powell Harris, &lt;em&gt;Goodbye, White Bluffs&lt;/em&gt; (Yakima, WA: Franklin Press, 1972), 99-103; Martha Berry Parker, &lt;em&gt;Tales of Richland, White Bluffs &amp;amp; Hanford, 1805-1943, Before the Atomic Reserve&lt;/em&gt; (Fairfield, WA: Ye Galleon Press, 1986), 20; Robert Bauman and Robert Franklin, &lt;em&gt;Nowhere to Remember: Hanford, White Bluffs, and Richland to 1943&lt;/em&gt; (Pullman, WA: Washington State University Press, 2018), 41.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;div&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a title=""&gt;[2]&lt;/a&gt; “Fruit Exposition Nov. 21-26,” &lt;em&gt;The Leavenworth Echo&lt;/em&gt; (Leavenworth, WA), September 23, 1921, 7; “Manley B. Haynes,” &lt;em&gt;The Seattle Daily Times&lt;/em&gt; (Seattle, WA), March 3, 1942, 13; “Society,”&lt;em&gt; The Seattle Daily Times&lt;/em&gt; (Seattle, WA), April 29, 1899, 16; “Brevities,” &lt;em&gt;The Seattle Post-Intelligencer&lt;/em&gt; (Seattle, WA), December 10, 1891, 8; “Society in Brief,” &lt;em&gt;The Seattle Daily Times&lt;/em&gt; (Seattle, WA), May 22, 1897, 13.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;div&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a title=""&gt;[3]&lt;/a&gt; Peter Bacon Hales, &lt;em&gt;Atomic Spaces: Living on the Manhattan Project&lt;/em&gt; (Chicago: University of Illinois Press, 1997), 19; Nancy M. Mendenhall, &lt;em&gt;Orchards of Eden: White Bluffs on the Columbia, 1907-1943&lt;/em&gt; (Seattle: Far Eastern Press, 2006), 86-87; “Another Big Irrigation Scheme,” &lt;em&gt;The Ranch &lt;/em&gt;(Seattle, WA), October 1, 1906, 6; Bauman and Franklin, &lt;em&gt;Nowhere to Remember&lt;/em&gt;, 41&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;div&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a title=""&gt;[4]&lt;/a&gt; Bauman and Franklin, &lt;em&gt;Nowhere to Remember&lt;/em&gt;, 41; Mendenhall, &lt;em&gt;Orchards of Eden&lt;/em&gt;, 86-87&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;div&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a title=""&gt;[5]&lt;/a&gt; “Will Reclaim 32,000 Acres,” &lt;em&gt;East Oregonian&lt;/em&gt; (Pendleton, OR), November 23, 1905, 7; “Another Big Irrigation Scheme.”&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;div&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a title=""&gt;[6]&lt;/a&gt; John Caldbick, “Federal District Judge Cornelius H. Hanford Resigns During Impeachment Investigation on July 22, 1912,” HistoryLink.org, September 6, 2010, https://www.historylink.org/File/9547.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;div&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a title=""&gt;[7]&lt;/a&gt; Judge Cornelius Hanford, quoted in Coll Thrush, &lt;em&gt;Native Seattle: Histories from the Crossing-Over Place&lt;/em&gt; (Seattle: University of Washington Press, 2017), 145, and in Alan J. Stein, “Seattle celebrates its 54th birthday and dedicates the Alki Point monument on November 13, 1905,” HistoryLink.org, August 7, 2002, https://www.historylink.org/File/3917.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;div&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a title=""&gt;[8]&lt;/a&gt; “Two Towns Instead of One,” &lt;em&gt;The Yakama Herald&lt;/em&gt; (North Yakama, WA), May 22, 1907, 8; “New Power Company Born,” &lt;em&gt;The Evening Statesman &lt;/em&gt;(Walla Walla, WA), August 22, 1906, 1; Bauman and Franklin, &lt;em&gt;Nowhere to Remember&lt;/em&gt;, 41-42; “Formerly of Minneapolis,” &lt;em&gt;Minneapolis Messenger&lt;/em&gt; (Minneapolis, KS), February 13, 1908, 6.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;div&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a title=""&gt;[9]&lt;/a&gt; “Irrigation at the Rapids,” &lt;em&gt;Spokane Daily Chronicle&lt;/em&gt; (Spokane, WA), April 18, 1907, 12; “Another Big Irrigation Scheme.”&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;div&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a title=""&gt;[10]&lt;/a&gt; United States Department of Energy, &lt;em&gt;Hanford Cultural Resources Management Plan&lt;/em&gt; (Richland, WA: Pacific Northwest Laboratory, 1989), D.68; Parker, &lt;em&gt;Tales of Richland, White Bluffs &amp;amp; Hanford, 1805-1943&lt;/em&gt;, 51, 57, 59; Mendenhall, &lt;em&gt;Orchards of Eden&lt;/em&gt;, 58.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;div&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a title=""&gt;[11]&lt;/a&gt; Parker, &lt;em&gt;Tales of Richland, White Bluffs &amp;amp; Hanford, 1805-1943&lt;/em&gt;, 43, 51.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;div&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a title=""&gt;[12]&lt;/a&gt; United States Department of Energy, &lt;em&gt;Hanford Cultural Resources Management Plan&lt;/em&gt;, D.69; “32,000 Acres Best Fruit Land in the Columbia River Early Fruit Belt,” &lt;em&gt;The Ranch&lt;/em&gt; (Seattle, WA), December 1, 1907, 24; “Free,” &lt;em&gt;The Ranch&lt;/em&gt;, January 1, 1908, 16; “Two Towns Instead of One;” “Society,” &lt;em&gt;The Seattle Daily Times&lt;/em&gt; (Seattle, WA), May 16, 1913, 18; “Pretty Cottage Near Hanford,” &lt;em&gt;The Seattle Daily Times&lt;/em&gt; (Seattle, WA), November 24, 1912; “Two homes and sage brush,” &lt;em&gt;Hanford History Project&lt;/em&gt;, accessed July 22, 2020, http://hanfordhistory.com/items/show/1106.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;div&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a title=""&gt;[13]&lt;/a&gt; “Blakely president of White Bluffs Club,” &lt;em&gt;The Seattle Daily Times&lt;/em&gt; (Seattle, WA), May 17, 1914, 27; “Notice by County Auditor: Primary Election for State and County Except Supreme Court Judges) Offices),” &lt;em&gt;The Kennewick Courier-Reporter&lt;/em&gt; (Kennewick, WA), September 3, 1914, 10.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;div&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a title=""&gt;[14]&lt;/a&gt; Parker, &lt;em&gt;Tales of Richland, White Bluffs &amp;amp; Hanford, 1805-1943&lt;/em&gt;, 157.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;div&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a title=""&gt;[15]&lt;/a&gt; Parker, &lt;em&gt;Tales of Richland, White Bluffs &amp;amp; Hanford, 1805-1943&lt;/em&gt;, 157; “Welch, Grape Juice King, Visits White Bluffs,” &lt;em&gt;The Kennewick Courier-Reporter&lt;/em&gt; (Kennewick, WA), December 1, 1911, 9.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;div&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a title=""&gt;[16]&lt;/a&gt; Parker, &lt;em&gt;Tales of Richland, White Bluffs &amp;amp; Hanford, 1805-1943&lt;/em&gt;, 149.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;div&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a title=""&gt;[17]&lt;/a&gt; Parker, &lt;em&gt;Tales of Richland, White Bluffs &amp;amp; Hanford, 1805-1943&lt;/em&gt;, 139, 141; Bauman and Franklin, &lt;em&gt;Nowhere to Remember&lt;/em&gt;, 24, 43; United States Department of Energy, &lt;em&gt;Hanford Cultural Resources Management Plan&lt;/em&gt;, D.68, D.76; Culture, 197, 205; Mendenhall, &lt;em&gt;Orchards of Eden&lt;/em&gt;, 138-139.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;div&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a title=""&gt;[18]&lt;/a&gt; Caldbick, “Federal District Judge Cornelius H. Hanford Resigns.”&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;div&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a title=""&gt;[19]&lt;/a&gt; Caldbick, “Federal District Judge Cornelius H. Hanford Resigns;” United Press Leased Wire, “Hanford Paid Visits to Woman,” The Tacoma Times (Tacoma, WA), July 2, 1912, 1.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;div&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a title=""&gt;[20]&lt;/a&gt; Caldbick, “Federal District Judge Cornelius H. Hanford Resigns.”&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;div&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a title=""&gt;[21]&lt;/a&gt; “School Directors Hold Convention,” &lt;em&gt;The Kennewick Courier-Reporter&lt;/em&gt; (Kennewick, WA), April 13, 1916, 1; “City Lagging in Big Drive for Red Cross,” &lt;em&gt;The Kennewick Courier-Reporter&lt;/em&gt; (Kennewick, WA), June 21, 1917, 1; “Committee Named to Greet Artillerymen,” &lt;em&gt;The Seattle Daily Times&lt;/em&gt; (Seattle, WA), December 10, 1918, 4.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;div&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a title=""&gt;[22]&lt;/a&gt; “Death of Judge Hanford,” &lt;em&gt;Washington Historical Quarterly&lt;/em&gt; 17, no. 2 (April 1926): 157-158; Caldbick, “Federal District Judge Cornelius H. Hanford Resigns.”&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;div&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a title=""&gt;[23]&lt;/a&gt; ‘Fruit Growers to Show Products at Exposition in Seattle,” &lt;em&gt;The Seattle Daily Times&lt;/em&gt; (Seattle, WA), September 13, 1921, 8.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;div&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a title=""&gt;[24]&lt;/a&gt; “Articles Filed with Secretary of State at Olympia,” &lt;em&gt;The Seattle Daily Times&lt;/em&gt; (Seattle, WA), September 22, 1922, 19; “9 Oil Wells Sunk in Benton County,” &lt;em&gt;The Oregon Daily Journal&lt;/em&gt; (Portland, OR), April 21, 1921, 2.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;div&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a title=""&gt;[25]&lt;/a&gt; “Councilmen O.K. Power Survey,” &lt;em&gt;The Seattle Daily Times&lt;/em&gt; (Seattle, WA), September 26, 1935, 14; “Seattle Man Takes Bride In Oregon,” &lt;em&gt;The Seattle Daily Times&lt;/em&gt; (Seattle, WA), September 22, 1924, 10.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;div&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a title=""&gt;[26]&lt;/a&gt; “Manley B. Haynes.”&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;/div&gt;
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                  <text>The towns of Hanford, White Bluffs and Richland Washington prior to 1943.</text>
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              <text>&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;W. R. Amon and his son, Howard S. Amon, first settled in the lower Yakima Valley in 1904 when the pair purchased the large expansive Rosencrance Ranch, located on what is now Lee Boulevard and Goethals Drive in Richland near the Columbia River, from Ben Rosencrance. The following year in 1905, they purchased the Rich Ranch from Nelson Rich, a prominent local landowner, and a member of the Washington State Legislature from 1901-1902 and 1911-1913. The Amons quickly became prominent figures in the area as a result of their extensive philanthropy. The Amons were instrumental in Richland receiving its first telephone connections. Columbia Telephone System, a phone company based in the neighboring town of Kennewick, was able to provide phone service to Richland by extending Amon’s private line to the rest of town. This would have been a significant technological advancement for the small farming community. Not only would this have made communication between residents possible for social and emergency reasons, but it also would have connected Richland to the outside world. The Amons also invested in and worked to improve the small town’s irrigation systems. In the arid desert climate of eastern Washington, irrigation was crucial for survival. Settlers used various methods to bring water to their homesteads from digging wells and small canals and flumes. Some of the larger farms in the area were dependent on the enormous Rosencrance water wheel on the Yakima River for water. The Amons replaced this water wheel with a more effective gasoline powered water pump. In the spring of 1905, the Amons were among the founders of the Benton Water Company and quickly made a claim for 400 cubic feet of water per second from the Yakima River. This water was used for irrigation throughout the small town as well as for generating electricity for lighting and manufacturing. In the fall of 1908, the Benton Water Company and the Lower Yakima Irrigation Company merged, which ultimately led to the construction of a 15-mile long canal known as the Richland Irrigation Canal, which expanded the area that the irrigation system could reach, especially in north Richland.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;The Amons were also instrumental in the mapping out and establishment of Richland as a town. By 1905 the father-son duo had acquired 2,300 acres and proposed a townsite. To decide on a name for the new town a contest was held. The town name suggestions were drawn from a hat, the last name drawn was the winner – Benton briefly became the name of the small town in honor of the newly established Benton County. The name, however, did not last for long, as the United States Postal Service rejected the name for being too similar to the name of another small Washington town in Pierce County: Benston. As a result, the town was named Richland after Nelson Rich, and officially incorporated in 1910. &lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;In 1911, Howard Amon presented to the town of Richland (represented by C. F. Breithaupt) the deed to Amon Park as a gift to the community. In 1912 a decorative stone archway was constructed to mark the entrance to the park. The original archway was destroyed shortly after the federal government began acquiring land in Hanford, White Bluffs, and Richland in 1943 as part of the top-secret wartime project that would ultimately come to be known as the Manhattan Project. It was also at this point that Amon Park was renamed Riverside Park.                &lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;In 1918 a well was dug for the convenience of picnickers, a bandstand was constructed in 1920, and in 1934 volunteers began construction of a community swimming pool and bathhouse at the north end of the park which officially opened on July 4&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt;&lt;span&gt;th&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt;, 1936. Amon Park’s annual Independence Day celebrations have been a favorite of the community for generations. In a letter written by Estella Murray West, who grew up in Richland, she recalls that “Fourth of July at Amon Park was always something. One year we even had a May Pole dance. We always had fried chicken, home-made freezer ice cream, sponge cake and potato salad. And fireworks a-plenty.”&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;Over the last century the park has been transformed into picturesque grounds, perfect for a wide range of recreational activities for the community. Today an extensive path runs the length of the park the shore of the Columbia River that is ideal for strolls or biking. The park boasts an impressive children’s playground, tennis courts, and community center. Sprawling lawns under the canopy of hundred-plus year-old trees make for the perfect picnic spot and location for such family friendly events from car shows, art walks, concerts, cultural festivals and much more. A replica of the original park archway was constructed and dedicated by the Richland Centennial Committee on July 4&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt;&lt;span&gt;th&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt;, 2010 approximately 25 feet northeast of where the original would have stood. &lt;br /&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;For more than a century &lt;/span&gt;&lt;span&gt;Howard Amon Park has remained a popular community locale not only for Richland – the town that the Amons worked so hard to help establish – but for the Tri-Cities as a whole.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;</text>
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                    <text>This house was built in 1921 by the Von Herberg family on their ranch. Better known later as the Bruggemann homestead after a sale between the two parties. </text>
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                  <text>Those interested in reproducing part or all of this collection should contact the Hanford History Project at ourhanfordhistory@tricity.wsu.edu, who can provide specific rights information for these items.</text>
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              <text>&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;Prior to World War II, approximately 2,000 people resided in the eastern Washington towns of Hanford, White Bluffs, Richland, and the surrounding area. Most were agricultural families who operated farms, ranches, orchards, and vineyards and produced such commodities as wheat, milk, apricots, peaches, and grapes. In 1943, as a result of the ongoing battles of both the European and Pacific Theaters of World War II, the United States government had set its sights on the Columbia Basin area as the site for a top-secret wartime enterprise known as the Manhattan Project. Beginning in January 1943 the unsuspecting residents of Hanford, White Bluffs, and Richland began receiving federal notice to vacate and acquiesce to the federal government purchasing their land for “fair market value.” Today, only three structures from this all-but-forgotten pre-WWII era remain, one of which stands isolated in the far northwest corner of what is now the Hanford Nuclear Reservation. The Bruggemann Warehouse is the only intact building on the bygone 406-acre Bruggemann homestead. The structure is now part of the Manhattan Project National Historical Park at Hanford.    &lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;Paul Bruggemann was born in Schwetzingen, Germany in 1898, and according to his son Ludwig Bruggemann, after serving in the Great War, “my father wanted to become a farmer.” In 1926 Paul purchased the 406-acre Von Herberg cattle ranch in eastern Washington along the Columbia River to do just that. In October of 1937 he married his second wife Marry E. Hoard. The couple lived on the ranch for 6 years, welcoming two children during that time, Ludwig Bruggemann in in 1938 and Paula Bruggemann (Holm) in 1940. &lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;The ranch that Bruggemann purchased came equipped with an impressive irrigation system, including a private pumphouse, used to distribute water directly from the Columbia River. Farmers who did not have direct access to the Columbia River resorted to drilling wells hundreds of feet deep in order to reach the area’s water table. Conversely, many of Bruggemann’s neighbors along the Columbia River would have been using wooden flumes or pipes (both above and below ground) to move and distribute water on their land. Bruggemann’s irrigation pipes, however, were made of vitrified clay tile. In the arid environment of eastern Washington this advanced and extensive irrigation system proved to be a significant advantage for Bruggemann and his endeavor of transforming the large cattle ranch into a primarily fruit producing farm. Ludwig explains that the pump house was used to divert river water up the sloped land to a ditch system on the opposite side of the farm, which was then left to flow back down the slope, over the farmland, and back to the Columbia River. Ludwig also recalls that the pump house for the farm’s irrigation system was often not working properly, “I think every week he had a problem with that pump house.” Bruggemann began the process of cultivating the land, dedicating 60 acres to soft fruits such as grape vineyards and orchards that produced apricots, peaches, and plums. Bruggemann also planted 11 acres of alfalfa, likely used as feed for the goats, rabbits, and sheep that were also raised on the farm.&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt; Paula recalls that there was no need for her father to construct anything on the farm as there were several existing buildings ready for use including a farmhouse, silo, horse barn, cookhouse, garage, and storehouse. Uniquely, the house and the cookhouse were both constructed using glacial erratics from the Columbia River set into concrete. Over the years, the cookhouse eventually came to be mistakenly referred to as a warehouse due to the assumption that it was meant to store the soft fruit after harvest. This assumption, however, was incorrect. Paula corrects the historical record by explaining, “no, that was a cook house, and my grandma was the chief cook along with my mom and my mom’s sister.” Ludwig explains the challenge their mother faced while on the farm: “my mother was always very much loaded with work and cooking… It was a real burden for her.” The women were responsible for feeding not only the family, but a number of farm hands employed on the ranch as well. This meant that during the harvest season, arguably the busiest time of year for any farmer, they were cooking for upwards of 100 people, certainly a harrowing task for anyone. This would have been made all the more challenging by the relatively primitive cooking tools Mary would have used as well as the lack of a nearby grocery store – the closest one being in Sunnyside over an hour away.   &lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;Ludwig, who would have been around 5 in the summer of 1943, remembers when two military jeeps arriving at the Bruggemann homestead. The occupants of the vehicles presented Paul Bruggemann with a notice from the United States Engineering Office of the War Department stating that as of July 14, 1943 the family had until September 30, 1943 to vacate the premises. The federal government hired several appraisers to evaluate the land and determine its value. It was eventually decided that the “fair market value” for the Bruggemann farm, including for all the buildings, structures, and crops, was $67,000.00 - $1,018,772.66 in today’s value. Paul Bruggemann, however, was dissatisfied with this estimation, and ultimately took his case to court where he demanded what he felt he owed. When asked by the courts what his profits were and what he thought the fair value of the land should be, Ludwig explains how his father was unable to provide an accurate estimate, saying, “I don’t have any profits yet. I built up that farm and I had my first crop on the trees when your two jeeps drove in.” Bruggemann was uncertain what the full profit he stood to make from the sale of his fruit because his first full fruit crop was waiting to be harvested when he received the notice to vacate his property. Unfortunately, there are no records of the outcome of this court case. &lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span&gt;While extended family members who had lived on the farm – Mary’s mother, sister, and brothers – relocated throughout the Pacific Northwest, the nuclear Bruggemann family moved to Yakima, Washington where Paul eventually purchased another farm. Being only 12 acres, his new farm was significantly smaller than the first, meaning that Bruggemann was able to work the land himself, becoming even more self-sufficient. Ludwig and Paula spent the rest of their childhood in Yakima. While Paula remained in the area, Ludwig eventually immigrated to his father’s native country of Germany. Paul Bruggemann passed away in Yakima in June of 1988 at the age of 89. Seventeen years his junior, Mary Bruggemann lived in Yakima for another 18 years until she passed away in March of 2006. &lt;/span&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;div&gt;&lt;span&gt; &lt;/span&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</text>
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