1
50
4
-
https://s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/omeka-hhp%2Foriginal%2Fe14e4177541d86d726108ff0ae769395.jpg
09ca8e040f8702ef5a35ef159d767c68
https://s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/omeka-hhp%2Foriginal%2F9c057bb8e9f110352e26b93ab36a49ec.mp4
6baf716dfe1500e5c0f22fb821d2eb4a
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
A name given to the resource
Post-1943 Oral Histories
Subject
The topic of the resource
Oral histories with residents about the Hanford area during and following the Second World War
Description
An account of the resource
Oral histories with residents about the Hanford area during and following the Second World War
Rights
Information about rights held in and over the resource
Those interested in reproducing part or all of this collection should contact the Hanford History Project at ourhanfordhistory@tricity.wsu.edu, who can provide specific rights information for these items.
Oral History
A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge.
Interviewer
The person(s) performing the interview
Robert Bauman
Interviewee
The person(s) being interviewed
John Young
Transcription
Any written text transcribed from a sound
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><strong><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">Northwest Public Television | </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span class="SpellingError SCX210620110">Young_John</span></span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></strong></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">John Young</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">R</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> Young. J-O-H-N R Y-O-U-N-G.</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Robert Bauman</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">All right, thank you. And today's date is October 22</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">nd</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> of 2013.</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Young</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">I'll agree on that.</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: Okay. </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">Sounds good. And we're conducting this interview on the campus of Washington State University</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">,</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> Tri-Cities.</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Young</span>: Yeah.</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>:</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> So</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">let's start by having you tell me when you came to Hanford? What brought you here? How you got here?</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Young</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">What was that? </span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: When did you come to Hanford—</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">to work and Hanford, and what brought you here?</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Young</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">You want the whol</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">e story of how I got to Hanford?</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: Yeah.</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Young</span>:</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> It'll take me 15 minutes. I wrote a letter up to here after I saw an</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">article in the newspaper saying they were looking for employees. And after that, they accepted me from the</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">standpoint that they would find out whether or not I was qualified.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">And for the next two months, the FBI and other agencies went through my history and got information from my</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">doctor and so forth. And in early June</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">—</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">well actually, yeah</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">—</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">t</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">h</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">ey finally decided that they would offer me a job. Or</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">they offered me a job.</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">And so where had you been living before you came here? What year was this, also?</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Young</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">What was that?</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">Where were you living before you came here, and what year was this that you moved here?</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Young</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">Oh no, I didn't have any employee but here before.</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">But where did you live before you came here?</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Young</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">Where was I working?</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">Where did you live before?</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Young</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">Oh, I lived in Albany, Oregon. And I worked there as a carpenter because my dad made houses.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">So anyway, when I found out that I was supposed to arrive on July the 8th, I started from home on July the 7th. I</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">wanted to be sure that I got here.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">Now</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">,</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> something I should tell you now is that during that spring, the Columbia River was at its highest violation you</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">might say, or amount of water, in history. And it had wiped out parts of Portland. And there were only two bridges</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">on the Columbia River, in the United States. One was the Bridge of the Gods down by Portland, and the other one</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">was a bridge up by Canada.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">[LAUGHTER]</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">So I didn't have any choice of how to get here. So when I left home, I drove up to Portland on back country roads</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">because the main roads up to Portland were all wiped out by the water. Got to Portland. It was 17 miles east to</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">the Bridge of the Gods.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">And that was actually a very funny ride </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">because the road I was on the south side of the river and railroad track</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">were the only two things on that side of the river. And I could drive along there and look out over the top of the</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">rails on the railroad, and I could see that the flood two feet below the top of the railroad.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">Anyway, I got to the bridge safely. Went over the bridge, and I knew that the road on the other side going east</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">from the Bridge of the Gods grows gradually up the ridge on the north of the river and eventually goes over the</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">top of it and go down into the Yakima Valley.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">And I got about halfway up that r</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">idge when the engine on my car b</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">lew out.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">[LAUGHTER]</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">And fortunately it was right at a little town there that had some place where they could fix my car. So I spent the</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">rest of that day there while they were working on the car. And they got t</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">he car ready for me by 8:00</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> the next</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">morning, which was the 8th. So I drove on up over the top of the ridge down into the Yakima Valley, because I</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">knew that if I could get into Yakima, there's a main road coming from Yakima down here.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">I got down to the bottom of the hill there, started towards Yakima. And I got two miles, and they found out that</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">there's three feet of water over the river</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">—</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">over the road, pardon.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">So I turned around, went back. And there was an industrial area there. And I found a guard there and said is there</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">any way I can get down to here. He said oh yeah, go back up to the road to Yakima and then go east. And when</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">you get down, about 30 miles, there's a bridge over the river.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">So I took it and went in to Richland, getting there about noon on the 8th, which was fine for my getting there.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">So</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> I ate my lunch, went into the Federal B</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">uilding</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">--</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">which was only a one story building at that time</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">—</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">and I found out</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">where the manager of personnel</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">--</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">well, new in personnel were.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">Walked down to his office, w</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">alked in his office. And he had about five desks in there. He was on one of them right</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">by the door. And he was busy working on it. So I stood there, I'll </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">say, for over a minute w</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">hen </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">he finally looked up and saw me. S</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">o I reached out my hand to him and said who I was. He stood up. He</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">opened his mouth wide. And he stood there for over a minute, utterly amazed.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">When he finally got himself together, he said, how in the world did you get into Richland? What had happened was</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">the management of Hanford had concluded that nobody would get into Richland for the next month. And that's</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">why</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> he was so astounded that I got into town.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">There was a [INAUDIBLE] if you want to call him that and overlooked the fact that I was a westerner. And I can go</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">anywhere in this country that I want to, because I was raised on a cattle ranch down in Central Oregon. And I</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">knew where to go through the, I'll say, backwoods. And that's how I got there.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">So anyway, their question then became, what are they going to do with me? Because they'd shut down the</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">orient</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">ation class for new employees, s</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">o I couldn't go to work out in Areas. What were they going to do with me for</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">a month?</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">Now the first thing they did is they got me a room out in the barracks in North Richland. And then they told me to</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">report to the produ</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">ction scheduling office in the Federal B</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">uilding the next day, which is a top secret operation. And</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">the purpose of that office was to determine which tubes in the reactors should be discharged the next time they</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">had</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> an outage at the reactors.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">And consider that there's 6,000 tubes out there. They had a new calculation system because they had a calculator</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">which was designed to do that calculation to tell them what the amount of uranium was, or the amount of</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">plutonium was in those process tubes. And such a method of calculating did not exist anywhere else. It was a</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">special calculator designed by Marchand.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">Well anyway, I spent the next month in that office. I had a copy of the manual for Hanford</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">—it </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">was a top secret copy.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">And I could read that and find out everything that went on in Hanford in their manual.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">And then at the end of that month, when they finally opened up their orientation operation, I went through that</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">process. And then I went out to the 100 Areas to go to work. I wa</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">s assigned for six months at B R</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">eactor as an</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">assistant, </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">well, operator for the reactor.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">It was a training period. It's a General Electric process. Any time the Ge</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">neral Electric Company—</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">at that time</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> anyway—</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">hired a new employee that had an education, they would put them out into one of their operations or</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">many of them to give that person training on what to do in the </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">job that they're going to get. And when they got</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">throug</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">h with the six month part</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> that I was out there, t</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">hey then assigned me to day work</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">out in the 100 Areas.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">And I spent the next 17 years out in the 100 Areas as a senior engineer, one of the few that they had out there.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">Now I had to earn that title of senior engineer. But I was working on increasing the productivity of the reactors,</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">reducing the cost of operating reactors, reducing</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> the amount of radiation well, affecting workers out there—</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">things</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">of that type</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">,</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> for 17 years.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">At the end of the 17 years, they started shutting the reactors down. </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">So I resigned. Went to the 300 A</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">rea and</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">joined </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">several organizations down there.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">[LAUGHTER]</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">You know, there's so many of them floating around there, it's funny. And I spent 33 years mainly working in the</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">300 A</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">rea. But what I did was such things as licensing nuclear reactors, seven of them on the east coast of the</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">United States.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">Congress had decided that all of the nuclear power plants in the country </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">should be licensed. And the AEC,</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> when</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">they got that, they said well, you should work in the East because we don't want any bias. So those seven reactors</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">are spread all away from Florida clear up to Minnesota.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">And after that, that was just a typical action for, oh, about one year. I was still an employee here.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">And if you want to know what I've done for the rest of that 30 years I spent at Hanford, I've got it listed here if you</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">want it.</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: Sure.</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Young</span>: This is something that</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> I've had. I filled it out as appropriate just so I could answer questions of the type that</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">you've made. And if you want to make a copy of this--</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">Oh</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">,</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> sure. Yeah, we can do that afterwards, yeah.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> That’d be fine.</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Young</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">But </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">you see there's—oh, what is it--</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">about 15 boxes all in there.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">[LAUGHTER]</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">I want to go back to when you first arrived in the area in 1948. Is that right?</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Young</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">What did I do?</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">You first arrived in the area--</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Young</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">I just arrived in '40</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">--</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">well, you mean in the Northwest?</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: No, I mean in the Richland, </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">Hanford area.</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Young</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">In Richford, yeah.</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">What sort of housing did you have when you first arrived?</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Young</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">There were in Hanford at that time, large buildings</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">--</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">some of them still exist</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">--</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">which had multiple rooms for</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">people. And some of those buildings could hold as many as 25 people. And I was single. It was very handy from</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">midtown</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">. It's not out in the sandy places they talk about in this article.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> [LAUGHTER]</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> But that sand, he talks in</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">there so much—</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">a</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> couple of times anyway—actually</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> was not Richland. Except for little locations where one building might be built. Most of Richland was</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">grassy. And if you're in Richland, you're not getting any sand blowing around. And if you read their article there,</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">they talked about the sand when there were on construction locations.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">Well that's normal throughout the whole s</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">tate of Washington</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">[LAUGHTER]</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">So what your first impressions of Richland when you first got here?</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Young</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">When I first came in?</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">I got a story for you that you're going to wonder if you want to publish it. I, like I said, drove into Richland on the</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">8th of June and got my lunch. Ate my lunch, w</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">ent into the office </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">there. And I guess I told you that this fellow said</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">how in the </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">world did you get into Richland? </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">So from that time on, I was working. And I was working out in 100 Areas. The first six months, I was working at B</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> and D R</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">eactors. And my position was assistant shift superintendent.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> See, they had shut B R</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">eactor down for, must have been four years because they wanted to keep it available in</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">case they had to get some more plutonium for the military in a hurry. And that was the only time I was on shift.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">After that, my work was what you might call typical engineering. You can call it nuclear engineering if you want to,</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">but it's general types of engineering</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">—</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">reducing operating costs, increasing production, reducing the radiation</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">doses to employees, those types of things for 17 years. Ended up as a senior engineer.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">Of the different sorts of jobs, different parts of the Hanford site that you worked on, was there something that you</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">found most challenging, most difficult, and/or something that you found sort of most rewarding about what you</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">did?</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Young</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">I don't understand your question.</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">Well, you had at least a few different jobs. You worked in the 100 Areas, right? And then you worked the 300</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">Area. Where there certain things that you did that you found sort of more challenging, or more difficult than</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">others? And were there certain aspects or certain jobs that you had that you really found especially rewarding,</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">that you really enjoyed</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> a lot</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">?</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Young</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">The main difference was that when I was working in 300 Area, the reactors were reactors of the types that were</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">used everywhere else in the United States. The Hanford reactors were very specific reactors because their only</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">purpose was to produce plutonium. Whereas the other reactors in the United States were primarily built to</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">produce electricity. It's a different design. And it also had more, shall we say, more opposition by the public.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">[LAUGHTER]</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">Yeah. And that's a subject that you might want to address</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">,</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> because the people who are supposed to be the</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">experts on radiation generally refused to use the information which says that low level radiation is beneficial. That</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">makes a lot of difference. That low level radiation is so beneficial. In my case, I got 15,000 radiation dose. All of it</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">was low level radiation. There might have been some high level in there, but I can only tell you what the badge</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">has, you know?</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">[LAUGHTER]</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">And that's something that you might want to mention in your articles if you publish them. There are numerous</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">people here, particularly in Hanford, that refuse to recognize that fact that low level radiation is beneficial. And like</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">I say, there are scores of documents that say that low level radiation is beneficial.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">You talked about your badge. I wonder if could talk about safety at Hanford? Did you have to wear any special</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">clothing equipm</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">ent of any kind to do your work?</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> What sorts of ways was safety sort of part of what you did?</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Young</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">Well</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">,</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> I was cleared for every type of</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">limited information. I got that when I told you I went into that</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">one office on the first day. That was a top secret operation. And top secret gives you access to anything,</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">assuming you had a need for it.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">I spent</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">—</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">let's see, how long were we in Oak Ridge?</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Woman one</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">One year.</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Young</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">One year, yeah. I spent one year in Oak Ridge on a committee which had somebody for every one of the AEC</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">outliers, you might say. And the purpose was to determine where to protect their materials could be manufactured</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">if somebody needed them. In other words, if you want high level radiation dose or something.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">I was dealing with people from every one of the major AEC outsides. </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">But I would ha</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">ve ranged all</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> in</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> the</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> various types of work that involve radiation. For instance, I was</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">a manager at preparing environmental impact document for fusion reactors. And that document was presented in</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">a meeting to the international fusion organizations in Germany.</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">About what time period was that? Do you know?</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Young</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">Oh</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">,</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> my. Let's see. That must be about 1990.</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">During your years working at Hanford, were the any events, incidents, events, special occasions, things that sort</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">of stand out in your mind from your time working at Hanford?</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Young</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">You mean the reactors involved?</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">Oh, c</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">ould be, yeah.</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Young</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">Yeah, we head one out in the 100 Areas. For essentially all of the reactors, when t</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">hey milk the reactors, they—of course the </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">reactors are made out of graphite.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">They ran tests on graphite and so forth, and they learned that they could operate the reactors with a fairly low</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">temperature of the graphite. You get too high temperature and you know you might hurt the material.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">And as we started raising the power levels of the reactors out there, the graphite started expanding. And the result</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">was that in som</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">e of the older reactors like B R</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">eactor, the graphite expanded enough that it pushed the shields off</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">the outside of the reactor. Well</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">,</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> push them apart you might say.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">And</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> the result was that the radiation inside of the reactor was leaking out through the crack at the</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">top of the far side wall on the reactor</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">. And there was a line </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">of radiation going out that</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">crack out through the wall in the far side of the reactor and then up into the air. And the result was that there was</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">about a 20 </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span class="SpellingError SCX210620110">mR</span></span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> radiation dose on the ground outside of the reactor.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">And that's one thing I worked on. They went back into the files of the DuPont people. And by checking through</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">those files, they discovered that if we raised the temperature of the graphite, the expansion would stop. And if you</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">go too low, the graphite would reduce in volume. And so we had to go through a special study to try</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">to figure out what this would do to the reactor.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">And the result was</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">—you </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">see</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">,</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> the normal tube in the reactor was straight through the reactor. But when the graphite</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">started expanding, the tube went up in arc and came back down because the highest temperature graphite was in</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">the center of the reactor.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">So we figured out what was the proper temperature of the graphite</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">—of </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">actually of the gas in the reactor. And we</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">ended up with the top tubes in the reactor going in, going down, going up, going down, and coming back up and</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">going out the back.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">That's the type of things you ran into doing something like those reactors. And by doing that, it sort of drove the</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">people replacing process tube on the reactor having to figure out how to get the tubes in the [INAUDIBLE]--[LAUGHTER]--through the reactor. If we had not done that, eventually the reactor would have fallen apart. In other words, if we</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">hadn't figured ou</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">t what was causing the problem—</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">because this reactor would just keep expanding, and finally that</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">outside shield would fall over. Or we'd have to somehow rebuild the shield up there to keep it in place. That's just</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">a typical job that you'd have. You might spend six months on that.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">I had another one. I was working with a fellow who is an expert on water purification. And see, we were cooling the</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">reactors with Columbia River water. It had to go through the water plant to clarify the water to get the sand and</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">what have you out of it.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">And when they first designed the reactors, DuPont had discovered that if you did not have the right concentration</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">of materials in the water going through the</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> reactor, the tubes were bending</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> up</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> into two</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> inside the reactor.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">And in order to prevent that happening, they were use the sodium dichromate in the water on the reactors. One</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">part per million or something like that, but it's still, we're spending about</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">,</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> well</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">, over $1</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> million a year buying that</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">material. </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">And I was working there with a fellow who was an expert on operating water treatment plants. And we</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">got together and looked at this sodium dichromate that was used as we said</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">--</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">and we were buying that by the</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">railroad car load. And I think the total cost was a $1.4 million a year for that one material as I remember it.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">And we looked at the price of it. And we looked at the price of buying the two components for making that</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">material. And we had enough equipment in the water plants that we could make that material, the sodium</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">dichromate. So we bought the chromate and the sodium, and we cut the costs in half from about a $1.4 million</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">down to $700,000 a year. So we saved $700,000 a year. That's the type of things you work on.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">All types of things you get involved in. For instance, when they built the reactors back in World War II, there was a</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">shortage of steel. So many of the pipes, particularly the ones underground, were not made out of metal. And</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">when you heat and cool the other types of pipes, they start leaking because they crack open.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">So we had to figure out how to solve that problem or reduce the amount of sodium dichromate getting into the</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">Columbia River. We worked it out, reduced </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">it</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> considerable. Those things get a little complicated. I don't want to go</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">through all the detail.</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">[LAUGHTER]</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">So it's involved a lot of problem solving? Your [INAUDIBLE] anyways right, problems with the reactor or whatever</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">you would work on solving those issues.</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Young</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">What was that?</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">If there were problems with the reactors, then you would work on solving some of those issues, work on solving</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">the problem.</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Young</span>: Yeah. In other words, you have really two plants there. One was a water plant to provide the water to the reactor. </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">And then the reactor was the other plant. </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">Now what you do with the water, what you get out of that, is just how you get it back into the Columbia River with a </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">minimum</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> of radiation.</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">And you know, that raises an important thing that I haven't mentioned it to people here in the Tri-Cities. I kept </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">records</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> on what the radiation was in the Columbia River. And when we were running the reactors out there, we</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">were</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> running, you might say, tons of </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span class="SpellingError SCX210620110">radioaction</span></span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> into the river. Yet the amount of radioactivity in the Columbia </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">River here at Richland was essentially zero. It had disappeared you might say, or bee diluted if you want to put it</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">the</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> other way during the travel of the water from out there by the reactors into here. </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">And when I see these articles in the newspaper about they're worrying about the fact that there's radiation out </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">there</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> in the 200 Area and it will leak out into the ground seven miles or something like that from the river, I'd be</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">willing</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> to bet that there wouldn't be much radiation getting down to Richland. </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">And the other thing is that it would be low level radiation, which is beneficial if it does get down here. I don't know if</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">you</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> want to put anything like that in what you publish because the nuclear engineers don't want it to be published.</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: Overall, how was Hanford as a place to work?</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Young</span>: What was that?</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: Overall, how was Hanford as a place to Work what did you think of Hanford as a place to work?</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Young</span>: Well to me, that was a typical job, In other words, I had to travel 35 miles to get to my work. But people do that all</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">over</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> the country.</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">It was an interesting job because we were working on increasing our knowledge of the subject. It's different than</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">running</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> one of these dams out here where you're generating electricity you know. All you're doing there is pushing</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">a</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> button once in a while.</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">But by doing the right things out there, we saved millions of dollars. And we also reduced, you might say, the</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">effects</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> of radiation on anybody by making sure they didn't get any high radiation doses.</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">But the most important thing about it is that we were, you might say, at war with the rest of the world. As long as</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">we</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> had to make that plutonium and reap you might say, keep Russia at a distance.</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">[LAUGHTER]</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: Is there anything I haven't asked you about in terms of your work at Hanford that you'd like to talk about?</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Young</span>: Well no, other than the fact that once I went to work in the 300 Areas, I worked all over the United States. Because</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">I happened to be, you might say, an expert on nuclear reactors.</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">A good example is that the government decided they wanted to have every nuclear reactor, I'll say described, to</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">be</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> sure what it is and how much radiation so forth is involved. In other words, if they did that, they licensed them.</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">And that was quite an interesting job, because I worked on seven reactors back on the East Coast.</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">And of course, I worked for one year in Oak Ridge. And that involved all of the AEC facilities.</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> <br /></span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;"><br />Bauman</span> I want to thank you very much for coming in today and sharing your experience with us. I really appreciate it.</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Young</span>: Well, always glad to be helpful.</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: Thank you very much.</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Young</span>; I would like to see the facts published in your story that low level radiation is beneficial.</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX210620110">
<p class="Paragraph SCX210620110"><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: I'm making these, we're making these available for anyone to look at, the [INAUDIBLE] stuff. Thanks again, </span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110">appreciate</span><span class="TextRun SCX210620110"> it.</span><span class="EOP SCX210620110"> </span></p>
</div>
Location
The location of the interview
Washington State University - Tri-Cities
Duration
Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.)
00:39:31
Bit Rate/Frequency
Rate at which bits are transferred (i.e. 96 kbit/s would be FM quality audio)
193 kbps
Hanford Sites
Any sites on the Hanford site mentioned in the interview
100 Area
B Reactor
D Reactor
300 Area
200 Area
Years in Tri-Cities Area
Date range for the interview subject's experience in and around the Hanford site
1940-2013
Years on Hanford Site
Years on the Hanford Site, if any.
1940-1990
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
A name given to the resource
Interview with John Young
Description
An account of the resource
An interview with John Young conducted as part of the Hanford Oral History Project. The Hanford Oral History Project was sponsored by the Mission Support Alliance and the United States Department of Energy.
Creator
An entity primarily responsible for making the resource
Hanford Oral History Project at Washington State University Tri-Cities
Subject
The topic of the resource
Richland (Wash.)
Hanford Site (Wash.)
Hanford (Wash.)
Nuclear weapons plants--Environmental aspects--Washington (State)--Richland.
Date
A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource
10/22/2013
Rights
Information about rights held in and over the resource
Those interested in reproducing part or all of this oral history should contact the Hanford History Project at ourhanfordhistory@tricity.wsu.edu, who can provide specific rights information for this item.
Format
The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource
video/mp4
Date Modified
Date on which the resource was changed.
2016-07-15: Metadata v1 created – [J.G.]
Provenance
A statement of any changes in ownership and custody of the resource since its creation that are significant for its authenticity, integrity, and interpretation. The statement may include a description of any changes successive custodians made to the resource.
The Hanford Oral History Project operates under a sub-contract from Mission Support Alliance (MSA), who are the primary contractors for the US Department of Energy's curatorial services relating to the Hanford site. This oral history project became a part of the Hanford History Project in 2015, and continues to add to this US Department of Energy collection.
100 Area
200 Area
300 Area
B Reactor
D Reactor
Hanford (Wash.)
Hanford Site (Wash.)
Richland (Wash.)
-
https://s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/omeka-hhp%2Foriginal%2F503facfeffb1114bbcb124d98f0bd650.jpg
66083871458fac8b8095454b1f11ba2f
https://s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/omeka-hhp%2Foriginal%2F7ee348740ff5bd1e247f32a02bcc137a.mp4
47755ac0406ca2312d3b6d8e09e2ccb4
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
A name given to the resource
Post-1943 Oral Histories
Subject
The topic of the resource
Oral histories with residents about the Hanford area during and following the Second World War
Description
An account of the resource
Oral histories with residents about the Hanford area during and following the Second World War
Rights
Information about rights held in and over the resource
Those interested in reproducing part or all of this collection should contact the Hanford History Project at ourhanfordhistory@tricity.wsu.edu, who can provide specific rights information for these items.
Oral History
A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge.
Interviewer
The person(s) performing the interview
Robert Bauman
Interviewee
The person(s) being interviewed
William McCollough
Transcription
Any written text transcribed from a sound
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><strong><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">Northwest Public Television | </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span class="SpellingError SCX40238283">McCollough_William</span></span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></strong></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Robert Bauman</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">So let's start by just having you say your name, and spell it for us.</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">William McCullough</span>: Okay</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">, I'm William McCullough. W-</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span class="SpellingError SCX40238283">i</span></span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">-l-l-</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span class="SpellingError SCX40238283">i</span></span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">-a-m M-c-C-u-l-l-o-u-g-h.</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">Thank </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">you. Today's date is October 22</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span class="NormalTextRun SCX40238283">nd</span></span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> of</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> 2013 and we're conducting this interview on a campus of Washington</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">State University Tri-Cities. So let's start, if we could, by having you tell us how you came to Hanford, what brought</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">you here, how you heard about the place, that sort of thing.</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">McCullough</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">Wel</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">l, back in 1950, my brother Dee--</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">he was working here at H</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">anford—he came up here in 1944.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> And in fact he</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">was in a reactor at the time that they started B Reactor up.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">Anyway, he came down to Salt Lake, which is where I was living, just before Christmas time. I was working for</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> Utah Willow M</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">ills at the time, as a shipping clerk. My wife was pregnant, and it became pretty obvious that a</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">shipping clerk and a wife with a baby just is not going to make it. We don't have enough money. So I knew I had to</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">change jobs.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">He came up and said, well, if you'd like to, I could probably get you on at Hanford, if you want to come up there. I</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> said okay</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">, let's check into that. Well, I sent in an application, and all of a sudden, all the neighbors started getting</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">visits from the FBI, to check my backgrou</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">nd. And they finally decided, okay</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">, I guess</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> he’s</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> safe enough. And so, I</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">came up here in August 27, 1951 and started work here.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">Be</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">fore I came up here though, I--</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">Whoops, there it goes. Of course, I was born in Salt Lake. And we just had</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">wonderful parents. I hated to leave them, but I though</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">t</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">, oh, I</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">’ve</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> just got to </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">im</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">prove myself.</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: And so—</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Man one</span>: No worries.</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: Oh, okay. W</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">hat sort of work did you start with, when you ar</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">rived in 1951? What sort of job</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> did you have?</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">McCullough</span>: [LAUGHTER] </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">Well, we left Salt Lake. I was working</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">, like I said,</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> at Utah Willow Mills. And I </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">worked</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> half the day, went home, and my dad and</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">my wife's grandfather, they loaded up this big U-Haul trailer. In fact, I haven't seen one as big, it was a Croft</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">trailer. It was built out over the wheels, on the trailer. And they kept putting that stuff on, and putting stuff on, and</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">putting stuff on.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> And finally, I said D</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">ad, you know, it's not going to all go on there. And he said, there's no top on the trailer, why</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">can't you? And it w</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">as very top heavy. Find out I was</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> going to have trouble, because the first time I tried to stop at a</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">stoplight, I couldn't.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> [LAUGHTER] But a</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">nyway, drove up there, left</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> on</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> a Saturday night. We stopped at Jerome, Idaho, and then continued on driving, and</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">we got into town at about 2:30 in the morning. Really </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">worn out, crying baby. At the time we had</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> this little girl that was just five months</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> old. And</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> pulled in my brother's yar</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">d, he had lived in an R</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> house, which is a very nice house, with a full</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">basement.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">He told us, you could live here until you get housing. So he pulled me there, and we went out to the employment</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">office. It was 8 o'clock in the morning, and we checked in, and it took about an hour, and they said, well, we're</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">going to send you out </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">to the 300 Area to work. But we’re not going to do it </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">today</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">;</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> you can go home and take the rest of</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">the day off, report there tomorrow. Oh boy, just what I needed.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">And sure enough, we went and got introduced to the 300 Area, the next day, on Tuesday.</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">What were your first impressions of Richland, and the area, when you first arrived?</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">McCullough</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">Well,</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> that</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> first day?</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: Or, in those early days when you first came here.</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">McCullough</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">Well, I realized it's quite a small town, but I was quite impressed with it. In fact, we've always enjoyed it, living here.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">It</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> is, it</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">'s smaller, but enjoyable.</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">So you said you started work at the 300 Area, what sort of work were you doing?</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">McCullough</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">Well, the 300 Area</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">--</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">I don't know if you're familiar with this, but</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">their main job was to make the fuel elements.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">The</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> uranium came in billets, and they put them in an</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> extrusion press and put them</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> out into rods, 20 feet long.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">And then </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">they'd send it over to the 313 B</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">uilding, where they'd machine it to the diameter, and then they would can</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">it. And the urani</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">um really oxidizes fast. So as soon as they machine it, they've got to use it. And o</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">f course, they gave it a</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">nitric acid bath, before they can it. And then they sent it over to the canning and dipping line, or what we liked to</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> call it, the </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span class="SpellingError SCX40238283">dip’n’</span></span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span class="SpellingError SCX40238283">dunking</span></span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> line, to can it.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">If you went over to</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">—well, </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">your canning line consisted </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">of four molded, molten metal pots. Each po</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">t had a different</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">metal in it, all molten, very hot. And we essentially canned metal. And to do this, we had to have full coveralls on,</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">we had gloves that went from here, all the way up to here. We had a hood to protect us. And spats on our feet, to</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">protect our shoes from the splattering metal.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">And the canning line was extremely uncomfortable,</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> [LAUGHTER]</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> and it was not unusual to get a splash, as I said, that metal is</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">running at 550 degrees, so it's pretty hot. And it was kind of an uncomfortable place to work, but the pay was</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">good. We worked two weeks of day shift, and one week of swing shift, which was a nice shift. But</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> we actually had this—</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">they would take</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">your me</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">tal, and put it in the first po</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">t, and agitate it</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">. And it would come out this po</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">t, and put into a centrifuge, and</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">throw off all the excess metal.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">And th</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">en they put it into a second pot</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">. I could tell you what it was, b</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">ut it might be classified, I don’t want to </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">get in trouble. They</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">put it</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> into this next molten metal po</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">t. And again, work it in there a bit, leave it for so many minutes, take that out</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">and put in a centrifuge.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">There was a clock on the wall, which was going very slowly, and it'd tell you exactly which cycle it was supposed to</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> go into. You'd say okay, po</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">t one, and then </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">you came over and </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">it'd say centrifuge, and you'd put in the centrifuge. And you go on to the</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">nex</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">t one, po</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">t two, centrifuge, and you go down to</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">—</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">well</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">, you wait for the po</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">t three. And there you washed them a</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">little bit, to make sure you get </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">all, </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">everything off it.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">And then they pick them up an</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">d take them over to the next po</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">t, which is molten metal also, and you'd actually slip</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">them into the cans, under the molten metal, to can them. And you put a little cap on it, and then take it out and</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">move it over to the quench tank, to cool it down. And after they got through there, you'd take it down to a</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">fluoroscope, take the newly canned metal, uranium.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">And they could see the end of y</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">our metal, and so they'd say, okay</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">, we need to cut this can back to here, so far. So</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">they</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">’d</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> cut it to size, to the length they wanted, and then they sent it to the next station, and welded the cap onto it.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">And then they had to take it out</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> to</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> the</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">next </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">station, another fluoride,</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> to make sure that it was cut right, they made sure it's to specs. And then they'd</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">take it to the next station and they had what they called a frost machine, and they'd run it through induction coil</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">and they'd spray this frost on it and it went through and tried to bake it on.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">And if it's a</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">ny air pockets or anything in the ca</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">n, it would show up and they'd have to discard it and start over again. If</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">it didn't show as it having any air pockets in it, they'd put it into a pallet. The pallet held 300 slugs, pieces of metal,</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> and ship it out to the 100 </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">A</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">reas.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">And so as a result, as </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">an operator you worked the canning l</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">ine and also each of the other stations. You rotated</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">so to kind of share the </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">canning line </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">with everybody.</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">You mentioned that the metal could sort of splash and get on the protective clothing?</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">McCullough</span>: Yes. As I say, w</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">e had these leather gloves and this asbestos covering all the way up to the shoulders to protect our arms.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">And we also had a full face shield over us and a hood. But you still got splatter occasionally and there's something</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">about that molten metal and all the clothes you have on that no matter how many times you take a shower you</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> had this odor about you. It </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">just kind of bakes in. And so my wife could always te</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">ll when I was working the canning line</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">And it was dangerous. We took our break one time</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">--</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">we got a 10-minute break in the morning and 10-minute</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">break in the afternoon and of course a lunch break</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">—</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">but while we was on a break they brought in what they called</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">a coverage crew. Because these furnaces, they're going to keep generating the same amount of heat.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">So they had to try and maintain</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> the</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> temperature of the pots so that</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> when we</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> as operators came back in, that the pots would be</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">ready to go again. So they'd stir them. They had a big paddle, they'd stir them. Well, this particular paddle had a</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">flaw in it, and this coverage guy, he would ta</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">ke these paddles and put them all in</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> the quench tank to cool it down</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">and then he'd go and stir it.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">Well, that paddle had a flaw in it and got just a dab of water in it, and when he put that down into it, it blew up. The</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">ceiling was about 20 feet high, and it splattered that ceiling. It just emptied that pot out. You wouldn't think a few</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">drops of water would do it.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">And then it came down on top of him. Very severe burns. We all worked out there for 150 years, and it's the only</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">time I've ever saw that somebody got hurt. Safety was always stressed so hard out there. They didn't want</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">accidents. But that's the only time that I ever saw it, and it's scary. And they made sure enough that you do not put</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">these paddles in water.</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">A</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">nd a</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">bout what time frame would it have been when that accident occurred?</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">McCullough</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">That would have been 1951, or '52, bec</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">ause I went out to 100 A</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">reas in 1954, so it would have been in the time</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> frame of '51—i</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">t would have been that three-year time frame.</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">You said that operator was severely burned. Did he recover?</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">McCullough</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">Oh yeah. I think he may have c</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">ome back on disability, though. B</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">ecause he was very severely burned.</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">So you worked as an operator there for about three years?</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">McCullough</span>: From 1951 to 1954. In 1954, I went out—u</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">p until 1954, your seniority was all one. To work in the reactors, </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">you had to start</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> 300 A</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">rea,</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> and it's all on seniority. And when you got enough seniority in 300 Area, usually you would go to the</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">100 A</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">reas.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">Well just in 1953 or what have you they said, we're going to one chance one chance only. If you want to go to the</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">100 A</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">reas you go right now. If you don't take it now, you'll be a whole new seniority group. You'll start at the</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">bottom again.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">So my wife and I</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">,</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> we got to thinking about it, didn't want round-the-clock work, but I knew I didn't want to work the</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">Canyon Line all my life either. So at that point I </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">went out there in January 1954, </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">I went out to the 100 A</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">reas to</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">work.</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">And so your job in the 100 A</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">reas was as an operator?</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">McCullough</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">As an operator. Your operators out there they had a pile operator that then they decided </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">pile operator does</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">n't</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">sound right, </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">we’ll call</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> them reactor operators. We had the reactor operator and then had the utility operator,</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">which is essentially an operator that doesn't have the seniority or the knowledge to advance to become a reactor</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">operator.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">So I went out there as a utility operator, and they have what they called a roving crew, which is they rotate from all</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">the different reactors. Any time the reactor is shut down, they would go ahead and assist them and give the</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">reactor crew some help. </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">Because there was also a lot of overtime because of it.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">So I was put on this supplemental crew as a utility operator, and I worked out there for about a year, and they shift</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">me into the C reactor. At that time the C reactor was the newest reactor, and they put me in there as the utility</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">operator to work. And so I worked there as a utility operator. What it meant </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">was </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">I couldn't sit at the control board, and I</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">worked outside the control room pretty well. Didn't work in the control room hardly at all</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">,</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> on</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">ly on</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> a</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">n</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> as-needed basis.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">Worked with a fellow by the name of Ted Lewis. Can I put names?</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">Sure.</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">McCullough</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">I worked for him. He was a supervisor and the control room specialist was Cliff Brenner. Both were very strict, and</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">if this is what the book says, this is what you are going to do.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> Well, I worked there at</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> C reactor for a bit, and </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">they were starting to get hurting</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> for pile operators or reactor</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">operators, and my boss Ted Lewis came out and said, Bill, you are not qualified, but I'm going to qualify you if</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">they promise that they will not shift you out and take you away from me until you get trained.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">And so on that stipulation, after a year out there as a utility operator</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">,</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> I was made a pile operator. And at that time I</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">could sit at the control room and take my turn at the control board with Cliff Brenn</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">er looking over my shoulder, and </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">Ted Lewis looking over his shoulder came out pretty good.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> [LAUGHTER]</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">Can you explain maybe a little more detail what the sort of task that sitting at the control board would mean? What</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">sorts of t</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">asks were you're doing?</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> You're sitting at the control board. What are you looking for? What sort of things</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">are you keeping your eye on?</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">McCullough</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">The old reactors they had nine control rods to control the reactor. C reactor</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">,</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> they put in 15 total, and when you sat</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">at the control board you had these </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">selsuns </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">which shows the position of the rods and you had the instrument</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">down here showing essentially where the temperatures of different tubes to give</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> you an overall picture of what </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">the temperature of the reactor is.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">And so you just sit there and then you had a galvanometer up here showing a change of power level. And then up</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">here you had a big dial which showed you the actual power level.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">The power level indicator up here is very slow. It's calculated by taking the inlet temperature water and the outlet</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">temperature water, and doing a </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">bunch of calculating through the</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> factors and it comes out as this is your power</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">level.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">But this is very slow. It takes about three minutes to catch the actual changes and catch up. So you watch this</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">galvanometer to get your fill in for if the power level changes at all</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">,</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> and </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">then </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">you go ahead and pull the rods in or out as</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">needed to hold the power level. And you have the temperatures monitoring showing</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> you</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> where the heat might be</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">shifting to. And so you try to maintain a good, even distribution of the power.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">Of course the chief operator or the specialist is telling you what you need to do, and sometimes you have to move</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">or swap rods because the temperature is changing quite rapidly. The thing about that called Xenon poisoning,</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">which it's—</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">pours out portions of the r</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">eactor, so we have to find out all the time</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">. So the heat is a continual</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">movement all the time, and so we had to know it. And so that's what we were doing at the control board.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">We had two operators inside the control room, and each operator would sit for two hours at the control board, and</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">the other operator would be walking around the control room, taking readings, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. And</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">then you'd swap.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">The interesting thing about it, I don't know</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">,</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> when you work graveyard</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">—I don’t know if you’ve—</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">you can get extremely sleepy along about 6</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">o'clock in the morning. The fact is you feel like you'd like to lay down and die. And so then you do things to</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">stimulate your mind and keep you alert.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">Well, o</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">ne morning I was sitting there at the control board and I thought, oh boy, I'm tired. And then they didn't allow</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">coffee pots in the control room, so if s</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">omebody was going to go out, they</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">'d get some coffee and they brought it</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">back in from the lunch room.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">And I got my mind going. I thought, gee, y</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">ou have a coffee pot and it perc</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">s. How long would that tube have to be</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> before it wouldn't perc</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> anymore? And we had a good time talking about it, laughing about it, and it kept me awake.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">And so then about 7:30</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">,</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> here comes in your day shift. And of course they had an engineer assigned to the area.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">He came in to check how everything was going. I said, "Hey, I've got a question for you. How long could that tube</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">be and still p</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">erc</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">?"</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">And we kind of laughed and talked a bit. Well then I didn't see him again. We changed shift and went on change</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">and it</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> probably</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> wasn't until I came back in a month, and by that time he was gone.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">Well, here he comes back with a three-page document based on you've got to know the quality of the coffee.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> What brand is the</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> coffee? What is the pH of the water? And like an engineer. But we all looked at him. And we still</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">got a big laugh. I still have that write-up at home that he gave me. But anyway </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">it's</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> things like that we went through.</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">And how long did you work as an operator?</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">McCullough</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">I worked at C reactor for</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">--</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">can I look at notes?</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">Oh</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">,</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> sure</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">, yeah</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">.</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">McCullough</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">So I was at C reactor from January 1955 to December 1960, so about five years. Then I went on a supplemental</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">crew, and then I went back to C reactor for a while.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">But then in 1960</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">,</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> they offered me a promotion to be a r</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">eactor specialist at the 100 B reactor—</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">that was the initial one. So I</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> we</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">nt to B reactor and worked as a reactor specialist. That means I had the full responsibility of the control room.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">Your operating crew consists of a supervisor</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">--</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">by that time what they used to call the chief operator they were now</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">chief reactor specialist.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">They have your supervisor and reactor specialist, which are both monthly paid supervisory jobs. And then they</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">had five operators, which consists of the operating crew. I forget where I was going now.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> [LAUGHTER]</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: Yeah, well, you’re t</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">alking about being a reactor specialist at B reactor</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">, and your responsibility there</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">.</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">McCullough</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">So I just stayed in that position at B reactor from 1960 to 1964. And in 1964 they started shutting reactors down,</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">or before the time. And I watched them go down and go down and I thought, you know, I better get out of here,</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">because I'm going to lose my job.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">By that time I had six children. I</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> thought, no, </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">I can't afford to be laid off. So I know well I'm going to drop back into the</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">bargaining unit and pick up my seniority so they have a lot more people to lay off before you get to me.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">And so I stayed back there as an operator for a year or so. And everything quieted down, I thought maybe I'll</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">just go ahead and they offered </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">me, they said, h</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">ey Bill, would you like to come back to the reactor specialist</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> again? I said, oh, I'd love to. </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">About a month after that, they announced they were going to shut down the D reactor, and I thought, well, I guess</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">I'll get laid off here. So I started looking for another job. There was something else I was going to say and </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">I </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">got</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">sidetracked.</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: Let me ask you about w</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">hen you moved to B reactor from C r</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">eactor, you became a reactor specialist </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">which meant</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">, as you said,</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> more supervision and</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">responsibility, was there a significant difference between the two reactors</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> themselves</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">?</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">McCullough</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">A big difference. </span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: Could you explain?</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">McCullough</span>: B reactor had nine control rods;</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> C reactor had 15, which meant that we had that much better</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">control. The old reactors</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">,</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> there's a big gap between the top bank of rods and the top of the reactor, the active</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">zone, and also the bottom row. As a result, by that time, they had developed these spines and we could put in</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">temporary poison spines and pull them back out again to supplement the control rods.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">B reactor you had to do a lot more front face work</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">,</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> because that Xenon poisoning built up here and this area will</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">die off and you shift down here and</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> know</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> this rate cycle</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">,</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> and a lot of times you had a lot of front face work to be doing.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">C reactor you had this other bank of rods, which made a big difference. So the C reactor's a lot easier reactor to</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">operate.</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">Were there ever any, during your years working at either of those reactors, any things happen, any emergencies</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">or critical issues in the reactor?</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">McCullough</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">W</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">as there w</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">hat now?</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">Were there ever any emergencies or critical issues at any time at either reactor?</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">McCullough</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">Not really. We had lots of problems in that during the charge/discharge quite often the hot fuel elements were</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> dropped </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">down amongst</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">--</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">instead of dropping in the basin they'd fall in the back pig tails and get so you couldn't go in the</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">rear f</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">ace at all.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">Then you had to figure out how to get them out amongst the tubes. You had to bring in fire hoses and everything</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">else, and yet you couldn't stick your head around. You had to do it all by mirrors to get them out.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">But in general, not major problems. I might point out</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">,</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> I guess it's when I was at C reactor</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">,</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">they</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> decided they was</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">going to bu</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">ild a nuclear ship, NS Savannah. A</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">nd so they brought the captain, or there was two of them came in</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">,</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> to</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">the C reactor.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">Now not too many people know thi</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">s, because it's dropped off in history</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">, but they came in and trained and</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">learned how to use nuclear material at the C reactor and after they left, they sent a ship.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">They presented a nice big model of the NS Savannah</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">,</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> which C reactor kept in a control room as a memorial to the</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">fact that we did do this work towards turning atoms into plowshares. That was something we were always real</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">proud of.</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">So you talked about shifts starting to take place, the beginning of the shutting down of reactors and less</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">production at some point. How did that impact your work? Did you shift to other kinds of jobs there?</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">McCullough</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">Do you mean out there?</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: Yeah</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">.</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">McCullough</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">Not in the reactor, of course. If the reactor goes down, that takes everything down. So if you wanted to</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">--</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">Yeah, so</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">if the reactor goes down, it's just your jobs are lost. Let me see if there's anything else.</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">Did you work at N reactor for a little while?</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">McCullough</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">Actually what happened is that</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">,</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> following my progression, I finally decided I had to leave. I started looking for jobs,</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">and I heard that they were going to build a brand-new</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> reactor, the FFTF, the Fast Flu</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">x Test Facility. So I thought</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">maybe I can get on that. So I put an application down there and I got in contact that said they wanted an interview.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">So I went</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> on and interviewed with Pat Cavil. </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">He says, we are going to monitor the engineering and help them</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">to you build this new reactor. And so I took that job. I didn't k</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">now anything about engineering—</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">about planning and</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">scheduling, but they said, we'll train </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">you.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">So I went down there with three other men</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">,</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> and he gave us </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">an extensive</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> c</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">lass on planning and scheduling. A</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">nd we'd go on and </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">contact the engineer and say, okay</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">, what job is it that you need to do? And what needs to be</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">done before you can do that? Which actually made a critical path. And then we'd monitor their progress to see</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">how—if it’s going to show up</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> in time</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">,</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> to help them out.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">So we did all the planning and scheduling for the engi</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">neers and the planners. And it’s</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> enjoyable work. Didn't</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">have much in the way of computers them days. If we had to get information, we'd use a mainframe.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">They</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> had a great</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> big, big, big computer in the Federal B</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">uilding, and we'd use that and take it down there and they'd</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">put all the information into the computer and it draws a great big chart and we looked at it and showed people</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">where they're at and what's going to have to be done in what order. It's fun. I did that for several years down</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">there.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> There again, like ever</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">ything else, things didn't look too good.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> [LAUGHTER]</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> It's funny on the FFTF they said we ought to make</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">that into a power producer. That way you can go ahead and do your experimental stuff and get some electricity</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">out o</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">f it. And the engineers and no. N</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">o, no. This is our toy. You're not going to dictate to us when we shut down</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">and when you're going to operate it. We want to do it without any outside influence.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">And</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> here when they shut the thing down--</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">the FFTF down finally, if they would have just listened and hooked that up to produce</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">electricity, it would still be going. That was a 400-megawatt plant. And it would still be going now if they didn't have</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">the idea that we're not going to be dictated by a bunch of power producers. We're going to run it the way we want</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">to. Well, they did. They shut it down.</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">I wond</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">er, taking you back to the 300 Area, B Reactor and C R</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">eactor, what was the most challenging part of your</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">work at Hanford? And maybe what was the most rewarding part of the work</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> you did at Hanford</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">?</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">McCullough</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">The most rewarding and challenging is when I was made a reactor specialist. It was real rewarding to go in there</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">and find out you have a bunch of heat up here and cold down here and figure just do this, this and this and maybe</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">I can get it all on your control recorders that are right next to your operator.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">We would select tubes representative of the area. So we would select a tube up here, a tube over here, a tube</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">here, a tube here and on down to monitor. And then we'd try and bring the temperatures closer together so that</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">the reactor is more balanced.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">Of course the more balanced you get then you're further away from the limit, so then you raise your power level.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">So that was a real challenge to go in there and see what a mess the previous shift had left you and then go in</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">there because the heat is always</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">--</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">the heat, which is also in reactivity, is always shifting in the reactor. So it was</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">fun to go in and see just how flat you can get it.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">I thoroughly enjoyed the job. It was is nice. It was a good job, a very rewarding job. That's probably the most</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">rewarding job I had.</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">You mentioned earlier that the incident happened when you were working at</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> 300 A</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">rea of the worker who was—</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">the</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">pile exploded. Were there ever any other incidents</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">--</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">and it doesn't have to be a safety incident</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">--</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">but things that</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">sort of stand out your mind that in your memory is really unique things that happened during your time working at</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">Hanford? Any special events or happenings that really stand out in your mind from your time working there?</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">McCullough</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">No, off hand I can't think of anything. Could I have a drink of water?</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: Oh, yeah. </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">There's water right there.</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">McCullough</span>: Let me look at my notes here and see if I’m missing.</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: Oh, okay.</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">McCullough</span>: Okay</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">, one thing about the reactor specialist is that I had</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> essentially</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> control of the reactor</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">,</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> but I didn't have any manpower</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">problems. The supervisor, he had personnel problems and everything else, but as a reactor specialist, if the</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">peo</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">ple were bellyaching, I'd say, go see the boss. [LAUGHTER]</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> It was very good.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">Also, backtracking, the bus system out there was phenomenal. If you lived in Rich</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">land, the bus system, the buses—</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">you wouldn't never walk more than a block and you'd be picked up to go to work. And you'd get on the bus and do</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> your thing</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">. What was interesting, some people</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">, they</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> w</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">ould play cards. They would get</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> the four seats and put their leg</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">through the seat so they're all facing, and they'd play b</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">ridge</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> or play pinochle.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">For many years before I got there they were playing poker. In fact, reading I find out that a lot of people they did</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">such a good job on poker</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">,</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> they'd just ride the buses back and forth. </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">[LAUGHTER] </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">But the buses were just absolutely fantastic,</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">and people were reading, sleeping, what have you, but good bus system.</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">And t</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">hat's how everyone got to work, pretty much,</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> is that correct? The</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> buses?</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">McCullough</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">Yes.</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">How would you describe the community of Richland, during the 1950s especially?</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">McCullough</span>: Oh, b</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">y the way, just one back to the reactors. To give you a feel for the advancements we made in the reactors in</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">op</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">erating. I can't talk pell-mell with a guess</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">, but the design rating of B R</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">eactor</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">--</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">by the time I got out of there, it</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">hasn't quite doubled the design of it.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> Well, b</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">y the time I go out there until I left</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">,</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> they</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">, by a factor of eight to ten</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> power level. They just cranked that pile up just</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">because of a better knowledge, better fuel. And it's amazing that you do take a Model T and you go ahead and</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">you</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> can</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> drive down the highway at 10 or 15 miles an hour and say, boy, look how fast I'm going.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">And all of a sudden you're, going 150 miles an hour, that's about what they out there with the reactors is take</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">these old Model T's and kept improving </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">them, </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">and improving them, getting the water to flow into them. And it </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">just </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">is amazing</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">how much power we got out of there. In fact, we got it at such </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">a high power level they said, okay</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">, let's cut back to</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">try and preserve the reactors so they</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> could</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> operate longer. So we actually took a mandatory cutback.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">We really did a good, good</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">, good job or reducing plutonium. Of course, b</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">y the time I was out of there, I got thinking sooner or later</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">they're going to say, hey, we have enough plutonium</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">—we have enough plutonium</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> to destroy the entire world. Someday they're going to start</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">shutting the reactors down, an</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">d sure enough they did. That's kind of it</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">.</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">Overall, how would you assess your years working at Hanford? How was it as place to work?</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">McCullough</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">I found it a fantastic place. In fact, working at Hanford, working in that community</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">,</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> you </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">figure that—</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">W</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">e</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> ended up</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">having six children. My wife never had to work out of the home. I made enough money out there</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">--</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">there</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> was a lot</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">of overtime</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">--</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">but we had both agreed that we would not use overtime to live off of.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">It would be stuff that we wouldn't normally buy like a boat,</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> or a</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> trailer,</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> a</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> camper, a new truck. Hanford itself has been</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> good to me</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">. And the area is fantastic. You couldn't ask for anything better than that.</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">Well, I thank you very much for coming today and sharing your experiences working at Hanford. I appreciate it.</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">McCullough</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">Well, I sure appreciate being able t</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">o get in here and talk with you. B</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">ecause it's exciting, too. I'd like people to know</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">what went on out there and how safety was a primary concern out there. Everything we did it had to take your</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">safety always, always came first. It has been good place.</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">As I said, I raised six children, and they love this place so good that they all live locally</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">,</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> except one. Her husband</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">thought maybe he had job advancement, so he moved to Tennessee about three or</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> four years ago. Up until</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> that</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"> </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">time we have the whole family living here. Pretty nice.</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">Bauman</span>: Yeah. All right, well, t</span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">hank you again, appreciate it.</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
<div class="OutlineElement Ltr SCX40238283">
<p class="Paragraph SCX40238283"><span class="TextRun SCX40238283"><span style="text-decoration:underline;">McCullough</span>: </span><span class="TextRun SCX40238283">Thank you.</span><span class="EOP SCX40238283"> </span></p>
</div>
Location
The location of the interview
Washington State University - Tri-Cities
Duration
Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.)
00:48:18
Bit Rate/Frequency
Rate at which bits are transferred (i.e. 96 kbit/s would be FM quality audio)
254kbps
Hanford Sites
Any sites on the Hanford site mentioned in the interview
300 Area
313 Buidling
100 Area
B Reactor
C Reactor
D Reactor
N Reactor
Fast Flux Test Facility
Years in Tri-Cities Area
Date range for the interview subject's experience in and around the Hanford site
1951-2013
Years on Hanford Site
Years on the Hanford Site, if any.
1951-1960
Names Mentioned
Any named mentioned (with any significance) from the local community.
Lewis, Ted
Brenner, Cliff
Cavil, Pat
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
A name given to the resource
Interview with William McCullough
Description
An account of the resource
An interview with William McCullough conducted as part of the Hanford Oral History Project. The Hanford Oral History Project was sponsored by the Mission Support Alliance and the United States Department of Energy.
Creator
An entity primarily responsible for making the resource
Hanford Oral History Project at Washington State University Tri-Cities
Date
A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource
10/22/2013
Rights
Information about rights held in and over the resource
Those interested in reproducing part or all of this oral history should contact the Hanford History Project at ourhanfordhistory@tricity.wsu.edu, who can provide specific rights information for this item.
Format
The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource
video/mp4
Date Modified
Date on which the resource was changed.
2016-06-14: Metadata v1 created – [J.G.]
Provenance
A statement of any changes in ownership and custody of the resource since its creation that are significant for its authenticity, integrity, and interpretation. The statement may include a description of any changes successive custodians made to the resource.
The Hanford Oral History Project operates under a sub-contract from Mission Support Alliance (MSA), who are the primary contractors for the US Department of Energy's curatorial services relating to the Hanford site. This oral history project became a part of the Hanford History Project in 2015, and continues to add to this US Department of Energy collection.
Subject
The topic of the resource
Richland (Wash.)
Hanford (Wash.)
Hanford Site (Wash.)
Nuclear weapons plants--Environmental aspects--Washington (State)--Richland.
100 Area
300 Area
313 Building
B Reactor
C Reactor
D Reactor
Fast Flux Test Facility (Wash.)
N Reactor
Richland (Wash.)
-
https://s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/omeka-hhp%2Foriginal%2Fe96772868bcbb27fc792d8ce071d7ad8.jpg
1edcf090a52c05e2abb84031af5e6bdb
https://s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/omeka-hhp%2Foriginal%2F7e4463a8a3acaf49a721532d344d9f3f.mp4
6f741c1244f024accff8b1403feeae12
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
A name given to the resource
Post-1943 Oral Histories
Subject
The topic of the resource
Oral histories with residents about the Hanford area during and following the Second World War
Description
An account of the resource
Oral histories with residents about the Hanford area during and following the Second World War
Rights
Information about rights held in and over the resource
Those interested in reproducing part or all of this collection should contact the Hanford History Project at ourhanfordhistory@tricity.wsu.edu, who can provide specific rights information for these items.
Oral History
A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge.
Interviewer
The person(s) performing the interview
Bauman, Robert
Interviewee
The person(s) being interviewed
Lewis, Doris
Transcription
Any written text transcribed from a sound
<p>Northwest Public Television | Lewis_Doris</p>
<p> </p>
<p>Robert Bauman: [LAUGHTER] And, yeah, I'm sure it will be.</p>
<p>Man One: Yeah, I am too.</p>
<p>Doris Lewis: Because I think I've forgotten more than I remember.</p>
<p>Man One: Me too.</p>
<p>Lewis: [LAUGHTER]</p>
<p>Miriam: So mom, I won't chime in unless you ask me to.</p>
<p>Lewis: Yeah.</p>
<p>Miriam: Okay?</p>
<p>Lewis: Okay.</p>
<p>Man One: Going here.</p>
<p>Bauman: Okay, we’re good to go?</p>
<p>Man One: Yeah.</p>
<p>Lewis: Well--</p>
<p>Bauman: All right.</p>
<p>Lewis: --see, you were born in--</p>
<p>Miriam: 1958.</p>
<p>Lewis: Yeah, October.</p>
<p>Miriam: Why don't we let them ask the questions?</p>
<p>Bauman: We'll go ahead and get started, yeah.</p>
<p>Lewis: Okay.</p>
<p>Bauman: So let's go ahead and get started. And first I'm going to just have say your name for us. </p>
<p>Lewis: Now?</p>
<p>Bauman: Yeah, go ahead.</p>
<p>Lewis: My name is Doris Lewis.</p>
<p>Bauman: And my name is Robert Bauman. And today is August 14, 2013. And we are conducting this interview on the campus of Washington State University, Tri-Cities. So let's start by having you tell us about how and why you came to this area.</p>
<p>Lewis: Okay. I came to this--I got married in Seattle. I got engaged back in Minnesota and I came out west. And we were married in Seattle in--what was it?</p>
<p>Miriam: 1944.</p>
<p>Lewis: Yeah, 1944--December 5, 1944.</p>
<p>Miriam: So can I--Mom, but you came out here--you guys were waiting to get married for Dad to get kind of a good job.</p>
<p>Lewis: [LAUGHTER] Yeah.</p>
<p>Miriam: And so he got a job out here, right?</p>
<p>Lewis: Yes.</p>
<p>Miriam: When did he get the job out here?</p>
<p>Lewis: Well he got the job--let's see. We were married in--he got the job in '43.</p>
<p>Miriam: So you didn't even have your house when you moved out here. You came to Seattle, got married, and then moved into your house here?</p>
<p>Lewis: Yeah, we moved into a one-bedroom prefab, of which I have a picture.</p>
<p>Miriam: So you came out here because Dad got a job here. And that was what allowed you guys to get married. And that's when you moved here.</p>
<p>Lewis: Yeah. That's why I moved here, yes.</p>
<p>Bauman: And so what sort of job did your husband have?</p>
<p>Lewis: He was a photographer, a patrol photographer.</p>
<p>Bauman: And his name was?</p>
<p>Lewis: Walt--S. Walt--It's Sam Walter Lewis, but everybody knew him as Walt.</p>
<p>Bauman: And so he got a job working as a photographer at the Hanford site?</p>
<p>Lewis: Mm-hm. He was on patrol here, working on patrol. But he was a photographer.</p>
<p>Bauman: Oh okay, so working for the Hanford patrol? I see. Okay. What was Richland like when you came here in 1944? </p>
<p>Lewis: Well, Richland was still being built when I came here in 1944. And they put up prefabs to get housing up quickly. And since we were a couple, we got a one-bedroom prefab. It was on Sanford and Symons--a lot different today. And the sidewalks were that macadam. And asparagus was growing up on the sidewalks, as I remember, right across from our prefab. I have a picture here of myself sweeping off the porch-- </p>
<p>Bauman: That's great.</p>
<p>Lewis: --of the prefab. You may have it.</p>
<p>Bauman: We'll film that later. Yeah, that's great. </p>
<p>Lewis: Mm-hm. So anyway, that was my first home here. And it was really darling. I bought yellow chintz with blue figures on it. And one of the women here helped me make drapes. People were very friendly. And she not only helped me, she just made the drapes. [LAUGHTER] And we used to get together and have parties. And we formed a community. It was a lot of fun. </p>
<p>Bauman: Mm-hm. And I'm guessing there must have been people coming here from all over the United States? </p>
<p>Lewis: All over, from every--the people I saw a lot of happened to be Southerners. And they were really warm and friendly. </p>
<p>Bauman: And you said your first house was-- </p>
<p>Lewis: A one-bedroom prefab. And it was darling. It had a living room. And then it had a curtained off area for the kitchen and bathroom and bedroom. And it was adequate for a couple. </p>
<p>Bauman: And how long did you live there?</p>
<p>Lewis: You know, I don't remember. Not too long. So we moved into a two bedroom for a while. I've lived in every house in Richland. [LAUGHTER] </p>
<p>Bauman: So when you first came here, you talked about it being a very friendly place, very friendly community. Were there things to do, entertainment, places to shop, those sorts of things?</p>
<p>Lewis: Oh. They still had--big bands came here. And Hanford was still running. I went to their house, open house, where they served meals and stuff. They were still serving meals. And they served family style. The waiters came in with huge plates of food and put them on the tables, a lot of food. And they still hand entertainers come in. There were some big time bands. I don't remember now who they were, but they were notables. They were a lot of fun, too, because everybody was friendly. You danced with whoever asked you. And my husband was taking pictures. So I didn't get to--he didn't help me. [LAUGHTER] </p>
<p>Bauman: So it must have been quite a bit different than Minnesota, or Seattle.</p>
<p>Lewis: Oh, yeah, quite a difference, yeah.</p>
<p>Bauman: I've heard people talk about the heat and the dust and the winds, you know, the termination winds. </p>
<p>Lewis: And the place was dug up. So we'd have terrible sandstorms. And I would come home at night to my house and the couch--you know, these were prefabs. So they're not too well built. I come home to my house and my couch was covered with sand. You couldn't see the pattern on it. And then we had to sweep out. [LAUGHTER] We were young. And it didn't matter. We took everything in stride. </p>
<p>Bauman: Do you remember any community events or anything like that would go on in Richland at the time?</p>
<p>Lewis: I'm sure there were. I don't remember. I'm sure there were. </p>
<p>Bauman: Yeah. I understand that there was not a synagogue at the time that moved here and that you and your husband were involved in-- </p>
<p>Lewis: Yeah, there were about 12 of us, eventually. And we got a group together. We held services every Friday night in our homes. And we formed a Jewish community. Yes. As I say, there were only 12 of us. I don't know when we built the--we built the synagogue when Jerry was-- </p>
<p>Miriam: There was the 60th anniversary recently.</p>
<p>Lewis: Huh?</p>
<p>Miriam: Recently, there was the 60th anniversary. </p>
<p>Lewis: Yeah.</p>
<p>Bauman: So sometime in the 19--early '50s.</p>
<p>Miriam: Yeah. </p>
<p>Lewis: But we opened the synagogue when Jerry was about two or three, I think. A Seattle architect, a Jewish architect, drew up the plans--didn't charge us. And we had Meyer Elkins, who was--he supervised the building. He worked for AEC. And he was in charge of our synagogue building. We hired an architect from Seattle, and I cannot remember his name. But he was a very good architect. And our original synagogue has been enlarged to twice its size. There was an addition put on that was as big as the original building. Now I don't know when that was, either--I mean the date.</p>
<p>Bauman: Right. </p>
<p>Miriam: All right, can I ask a question? Mom, how did you guys raise the money to build it?</p>
<p>Lewis: How did we raise the money? </p>
<p>Miriam: And how many more--you were 12 originally, but how did the congregation grow? </p>
<p>Lewis: Well, it grew. There were 12 of us that built it, the synagogue. We pledged to pay over a period of years. And the bank loaned us the money. And now what did you just ask me? </p>
<p>Miriam: Just--there were 12 of you to start with, but when the synagogue was built, did people start hearing of it and start coming? Sorry, I'm-- </p>
<p>Lewis: Yeah, well I don't know. I don't know when--it took a while to build it. And once they built it, then we had regular services every Friday evening and Saturday morning. And we celebrated holidays there. The synagogue was a central point for us. That's where we held all our activities. That's where we met. And that's how we really functioned. </p>
<p>Bauman: And you said there were 12 initially. Do you remember any of the other individuals who were involved early on?</p>
<p>Lewis: Any what?</p>
<p>Bauman: Any of the other people who were involved early on?</p>
<p>Lewis: Oh yeah, well most of them are dead now.</p>
<p>Bauman: Sure.</p>
<p>Lewis: There was Meyer and Tilly Elkins. And Meyer was a--he was a builder. He was an engineer. But he did building. And he supervised the building. And I'll tell you, it was perfect. [LAUGHTER] He was very, very concerned about every detail. We have a good, solid building. And if it weren't for these dedicated people, we wouldn't have had anything. Because we pledged the money for it, which at that time seemed like a lot of money. You couldn't do it today. And I don't remember the amount, but I think it was only about $16,000. I'm not sure of that. </p>
<p>Miriam: So mom, who were the rest of the 12 people?</p>
<p>Lewis: Now that's a good question.</p>
<p>Miriam: The Francos.</p>
<p>Lewis: The Francos.</p>
<p>Miriam: So that's Bob and Eileen Franco. The Kahns? Were the Kahns? </p>
<p>Lewis: Well yeah, Herb--</p>
<p>Miriam: Herb and Albert--</p>
<p>Lewis: --took charge of the financing, took charge of the banking. </p>
<p>Miriam: So that's six out of the 12. Who were the--oh, the Goldsmiths. Were the Goldsmiths? </p>
<p>Lewis: Yeah, I don't think they were early, no. I'm trying to remember. You know, I don't remember.</p>
<p>Miriam: That's something my brother could probably actually give you the information on.</p>
<p>Lewis: Well it might be in the book.</p>
<p>Miriam: No, this is Kennedy. </p>
<p>Lewis: Oh, yeah. Yeah, I don't know what Jerry remembers. But he was, I think, about two years old when they built it. </p>
<p>Miriam: But we can ask Jerry. Jerry can give them the information about the rest of the 12 people. Because I'm sure he will know. </p>
<p>Bauman: That's fine, yeah, sure.</p>
<p>Lewis: Okay.</p>
<p>Bauman: I was going to ask you then, obviously, your children were born here?</p>
<p>Lewis: Who?</p>
<p>Bauman: Your children were born here. Is that correct?</p>
<p>Miriam: Yeah.</p>
<p>Lewis: Oh, you--Miriam was born here and Jerry was born here. </p>
<p>Bauman: And how was Richland as a place to raise a family? How did you experience that?</p>
<p>Lewis: It was a wonderful place to raise a family. Because families were very important. And we got everything for free. They needed people here. And they did everything to keep us. Because it was a population that moved in and moved out. Many of them came, looked around, and left. They wouldn't stay. [LAUGHTER] But I think it was a very nice little community. We loved it here. We made friends, and we had activities. And we were busy. And then, of course, I had a job. I was a secretary. I worked first it was still under DuPont until I think '45 when GE came in. </p>
<p>Bauman: And what part of the Hanford site did you work at? </p>
<p>Lewis: Well I worked down--I was downtown then in the Ad Building. And I worked for--I can't remember what--Overbeck was one of the fellows. I was one of the top secretaries here at that time.</p>
<p>Bauman: And how long did you work? </p>
<p>Lewis: I worked a long time. [LAUGHTER] I quit working when my son was born. And that was in '55. And I quit for six or seven years. And then I came back to work again. And I worked part time for a while. But secretaries always had jobs. They needed secretaries. And I was an experienced one. They used to say if you knew a typewriter from a washing machine, they'd hire you. [LAUGHTER] </p>
<p>Bauman: [LAUGHTER] And what did you think of working at Hanford? How was your experience or your experiences working there?</p>
<p>Lewis: What did I think of working there?</p>
<p>Bauman: Yeah, how was it?</p>
<p>Lewis: I liked it. It was interesting work. I didn’t know--I wasn't engineering knowledgeable. I didn't really know what they were doing. But it was a big secret. And in August 1945--I think that was when the first bomb was dropped. I remember working in the Ad Building there. And all the managers, everybody was on edge, waiting to hear the outcome of the dropped first bomb. Yes.</p>
<p>Bauman: Is that when you first knew what was going on, what had been happening at Hanford? </p>
<p>Lewis: Yeah, it was all very secret. And it didn't get out. Very few people knew what they were doing. Because very few people--it was a new art, or whatever you call it--a new technical thing. And they never knew, until it went off, if it was going to work. I worked for W. P. Overbeck. I worked for Vic Hansen from DuPont. He was one of the managers, a very good man. But he was only there for about six months after I hired in. </p>
<p>Bauman: So when you first came for your jobs at Hanford, what did you know about the place? Were you just told it had something to do with the war effort? </p>
<p>Lewis: We weren't told anything. I don't remember them--we knew we were working for the government and that it was very secretive. And that's all we knew. And I wasn't educated enough to know what we were doing. Now, some people may have surely knew. But as I say, engineering was something I didn't know anything about. But I learned some things. And I helped the wheels go around. </p>
<p>Bauman: Yeah, did you have to get a special clearance to be able to work at Hanford?</p>
<p>Lewis: Yeah, I had--we wore security badges. And before I quit, I got a top security clearance, because I'd been here a long time. And I worked for some of the top fellows. G. G. Lale--I can't remember what he was, but he was assistant to the man that was in charge. I think W. E. Johnson was in charge then. I'm not sure. Things are jumbled together for me. Because I'm so old I can't remember too accurately either. </p>
<p>Bauman: You're doing great. [LAUGHTER] You're remembering a lot.</p>
<p>Lewis: [LAUGHTER] I don't know.</p>
<p>Bauman: So your husband working for the Hanford patrol as a photographer. How long did he work at Hanford? </p>
<p>Lewis: He worked here a long time. And then he finally quit and went to Oregon--Gresham, right outside of Portland, and established his own business. That was a dream of his all his life. He wanted to have a studio, photographic studio, so he bought one. But however, he didn't look closely enough at it. And he spent a year trying to build a business. But he never could accomplish one that would keep us. And I was supposed to join him in about three months, quit my job and join him. But in three months’ time we knew that he needed my financial help. So I stayed on. And we visited back and forth. And he finally quit and came down here. And he got a job here as a photographer. </p>
<p>Bauman: I wanted to ask you about President Kennedy's visit in 1963. </p>
<p>Lewis: Yeah, that was--we went out. It was a hot, hot day. It was when the Dual Purpose Reactor--it was a D Reactor--was being dedicated. And Kennedy--it was a very hot day out in the desert. And there was a big crowd--I don't know, 40,000 50,000--a lot of people. And a friend of mine and I--Bonnie Goldsmith. They were here early. And we took our kids, Philip and Jerry, but--</p>
<p>Miriam: Not me.</p>
<p>Lewis: Not you, no. And they were what, about five or six?</p>
<p>Miriam: No, it was 1963. They were seven or eight.</p>
<p>Lewis: Yeah, and they immediately ran around, got lost. We had to find them. But Kennedy spoke. He was the most impressive, the most glamorous man I think I've ever in my life seen. And he was a marvelous speaker. It was just a pleasure to sit down and look at him and listen to him. He was fantastic. And he had this magic wand that started the reactors at D Area. But this desert—I think there were 40,000, 50,000 people there. And it was a hot, hot day. And the cars were--length of cars there. I remember--when was D activated? I can't remember the date. But everybody spoke. It was a wonderful, wonderful affair. And it was so impressive that waving the wand started the reactor. So it made both electricity and the others. </p>
<p>Bauman: And your husband took some photos that day? </p>
<p>Lewis: Mm-hm. He took photos. And we have some of the photos in this book there. The information is there. My son gathered it all together. He published not very many of these. He just did--something that he wanted to do. So you may look at it, because the pictures and the information on there are much more accurate than what I'm giving you. [LAUGHTER] I don't remember a lot. Miriam might remember stuff when she started school here, too, that might be of interest. Okay? </p>
<p>Miriam: Well he can ask the questions, and if he wants to ask me I'm sure he will. </p>
<p>Bauman: [LAUGHTER] Well I was going to ask are there any other major events that happened while you were working at Hanford that you recall or-- </p>
<p>Lewis: Oh, well no doubt there were a lot of major events. But I don’t—I mean, if you ask me the question, I could answer specifically. But as a whole, the work went on daily. The scientists were working on it all the time. And when they dropped the bomb in, what was it, August? Was it August?</p>
<p>Bauman: August, uh-huh. </p>
<p>Lewis: Everybody was waiting. We didn't know what they were waiting for. But they were waiting. The top fellows knew that the bomb was going to be dropped. And we did get the information, finally. It was terrible, really. It was a terrible thing to do. But they felt that they really saved lives by dropping that bomb. Because they stopped—I mean, they weren't winning, they weren't losing. It was a very iffy situation. And that, of course, stopped everything. It was terrible.</p>
<p>Bauman: I was going to ask you—Richland initially was a government town, federal government. At some point it became an independent-- </p>
<p>Lewis: They sold the houses to the inhabitants.</p>
<p>Bauman: So were you able to buy your house at that point, then, buy a house?</p>
<p>Lewis: Yeah, we bought--what was the first house we bought? I think it was a B house.</p>
<p>Miriam: Was that the house where I was born? </p>
<p>Lewis: Yeah, it was a B house.</p>
<p>Miriam: Yeah.</p>
<p>Lewis: Two-bedroom house, a duplex. </p>
<p>Bauman: And do you remember, were people in Richland excited about the possibility to do that sort of thing, to have independent-- </p>
<p>Lewis: Do they have what?</p>
<p>Bauman: Were people in Richland excited about being able to buy their own homes, be sort of independent? </p>
<p>Lewis: Oh, yeah. By that time they will permanently implanted here. And the job was going to go on. [COUGH] Excuse me. And they sold the houses for pittances. Especially the expensive houses were real bargains--the prefabs not so much, because they didn't cost much in the first place. But I think I was living in a B house then, a two-bedroom duplex. And I bought the whole house. And we rented out the duplex. And I lived there for a while. And then we sold it and bought a ranch house. [LAUGHTER] I've lived in, I think, every house here. I lived in a B house, in a ranch house, and in a--what else? In our house. </p>
<p>Miriam: I don't have the letters memorized. [LAUGHTER]</p>
<p>Lewis: Yeah, right. </p>
<p>Bauman: Is there anything that we haven't talked about yet, anything that--</p>
<p>Lewis: I kept upgrading myself. </p>
<p>Miriam: In terms of history, probably not, although you did ask about--Mom, I was just curious, because this is of course what I like to know, where did you grocery shop and stuff when you first came here?</p>
<p>Lewis: Well we had a Keiser's store, a grocery. </p>
<p>Miriam: When you first came here in '44? </p>
<p>Lewis: Well you know, I don't know what we had then. We had a Keiser--we had grocery stores. I think Safeway was here then.</p>
<p>Miriam: Oh, really?</p>
<p>Lewis: Yeah, right. </p>
<p>Miriam: Yeah, I was just curious. </p>
<p>Lewis: Mm-hm. I don't remember a lot. But I think there was plenty of shopping. </p>
<p>Miriam: Mm-hm. Were you happy with the schools you sent us to?</p>
<p>Lewis: Yes, I was active in the schools. And my relationships were very good. Our teachers were excellent. They were dedicated, because they came out here in the middle of nowhere. [LAUGHTER] What did you think about your teachers? </p>
<p>Miriam: Well I just thought--this is my impression, is that because there were so many scientists here that education was a value and that I remember that school levies, when I was growing up, because I born in 1958, the school levies always passed. Nobody considered that they shouldn't be spending public money to support education. And I always thought that was because of the heavy concentration of really highly educated people that came here. </p>
<p>Bauman: So what schools did you go to then? </p>
<p>Miriam: I went to Jefferson Elementary, Chief Joseph Junior High, and Richland High School. And my brother--Jerry went to Jason Lee to begin with. Mom, do you remember? Jerry didn't start at Jefferson.</p>
<p>Lewis: No, he didn't.</p>
<p>Miriam: Jason Lee?</p>
<p>Lewis: I don't remember.</p>
<p>Miriam: I think so. Anyhow, he started a different school and then went to Jefferson when we moved to the neighborhood where we--</p>
<p>Lewis: Lived.</p>
<p>Miriam: --Grew up. And where Mom still lives.</p>
<p>Bauman: And so, those elementary schools must have been pretty much new when your kids started there, or close to.</p>
<p>Lewis: Yeah. Jefferson was just built, I think. It wasn't very old.</p>
<p>Miriam: Yeah, I don't know. </p>
<p>Bauman: And just given the influx of population suddenly, all these young families, there had to have been a new school being opened that served the population there. Anything else you can think of that either one of you--we haven't talked about, or--? </p>
<p>Miriam: Well just that I think, Mom, you never thought that you would come out here and spend the rest your life here. [LAUGHTER]</p>
<p>Lewis: No, never. I never thought that. And it was away from my family, and from friends. However, we managed. We went back to Minnesota every summer. [LAUGHTER] Our families were there. </p>
<p>Miriam: But I want to come back a little bit to the synagogue. Because as a very, very tiny minority here, we families banded together to build the synagogue, it was a very, very strong community. And still, it's not as strong now in that same way, but these people were all like additional parents, or like aunts and uncles to all of us. And my mom was called Aunt Doris. My dad was called Uncle Walt. That was how we addressed the parents in those families, us as children. And that it's interesting to have this group of Jews wandering in this particular desert. [LAUGHTER] Because it really has a very, very--it's a microcosm of the whole Richland thing, where you have people coming from all over and creating a very strong, very close community, because they are away from all of the places they came from. And our Jewish community reflected that same phenomenon. </p>
<p>Bauman: Absolutely, yeah, right, thrown together from all these disparate areas. </p>
<p>Lewis: As time went on, we never intended--at first, we intended to move back to Minnesota when this job was finished. It was never finished. </p>
<p>Bauman: [LAUGHTER] It just kept going. </p>
<p>Lewis: Yeah, so we stayed on. And it was our home. We loved it here. I love it here. </p>
<p>Bauman: That's a similar theme I get. A lot of people who I've talked to come here thinking they'll stay here for a little while and then end up staying for 40 years or 60 years or however long. [LAUGHTER]</p>
<p>Lewis: Yeah, right. A little while became forever.</p>
<p>Bauman: [LAUGHTER] Right, right. Well I want to thank you very much for coming in today.</p>
<p>Lewis: Yeah, I'm afraid I wasn't much help, because my memory's so bad. [LAUGHTER]</p>
<p>Bauman: This was terrific.</p>
<p>Lewis: But it was fun. It was a wonderful experience. We loved it here. I still do.</p>
<p>Bauman: Well thank you again. Appreciate it. </p>
Location
The location of the interview
Washington State University - Tri Cities
Duration
Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.)
00:32:53
Bit Rate/Frequency
Rate at which bits are transferred (i.e. 96 kbit/s would be FM quality audio)
239 kbps
Hanford Sites
Any sites on the Hanford site mentioned in the interview
Ad Building
D Reactor
Years in Tri-Cities Area
Date range for the interview subject's experience in and around the Hanford site
1944-2013
Names Mentioned
Any named mentioned (with any significance) from the local community.
Lewis, Sam Walter
Elkins, Meyer & Tilly
Overbeck, W.P.
Lale, G.G
Johnson, W.E.
Kennedy, John F.
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
A name given to the resource
Interview with Doris Lewis
Description
An account of the resource
An interview with Doris Lewis conducted as part of the Hanford Oral History Project. The Hanford Oral History Project was sponsored by the Mission Support Alliance and the United States Department of Energy.
Creator
An entity primarily responsible for making the resource
Hanford Oral History Project at Washington State University Tri-Cities
Subject
The topic of the resource
Hanford (Wash.)
Hanford Site (Wash.)
Richland (Wash.)
Richland (Wash.). Public Schools
Date
A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource
2013-8-14
Rights
Information about rights held in and over the resource
Those interested in reproducing part or all of this oral history should contact the Hanford History Project at ourhanfordhistory@tricity.wsu.edu, who can provide specific rights information for this item.
Date Modified
Date on which the resource was changed.
2016-06-22: Metadata v1 created – [RG]
Ad Building
D Reactor
DuPont
General Electric
Kennedy, John Fitzgerald, 1917-1963
Richland (Wash.)
Secrecy
-
https://s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/omeka-hhp%2Foriginal%2F2503d544b8a14f97e9770f99ea4ae31e.jpg
690baf02cd982d16be454fa61515735b
https://s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/omeka-hhp%2Foriginal%2Fada0dbf6496cc12da553f06e46e92b9e.mp4
59164a7708c88cbb1d22ef43bc311024
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
A name given to the resource
Post-1943 Oral Histories
Subject
The topic of the resource
Oral histories with residents about the Hanford area during and following the Second World War
Description
An account of the resource
Oral histories with residents about the Hanford area during and following the Second World War
Rights
Information about rights held in and over the resource
Those interested in reproducing part or all of this collection should contact the Hanford History Project at ourhanfordhistory@tricity.wsu.edu, who can provide specific rights information for these items.
Oral History
A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge.
Interviewer
The person(s) performing the interview
Laura Arata
Interviewee
The person(s) being interviewed
Edwin Cheyney
Transcription
Any written text transcribed from a sound
<p><strong>Northwest Public Television | Cheyney_Ed</strong></p>
<p>Laura Arata: Plus, if you make him mad, he's got a cane now he can smack you with.</p>
<p>Ed Cheyney: Well I got one I’m not doing with.</p>
<p>Arata: Nice.</p>
<p>Man: I guess it just--</p>
<p>Arata: That would be our first on camera cane dueling.</p>
<p>Cheyney: Right. [LAUGHTER]</p>
<p>Man: Okay, whenever you're ready.</p>
<p>Arata: Okay, we’re ready to go. All right. So if we could start out by having you say your name, and then spell it for us?</p>
<p>Cheyney: Sure. My name is Edwin Cheyney. C-H-E-Y-N-E-Y. It's also been pronounced chee-nee, with the extra Y in it. I was corrected many years ago that you're pronouncing it wrong. [LAUGHTER]</p>
<p>Arata: Really? So you learned about it, too?</p>
<p>Cheyney: I said, I didn't care, as long as it didn't get any worse.</p>
<p>Arata: Fair enough. My name's Laura Arata. Today is November 12, 2013, and we're conducting this interview on the campus of Washington State University, Tri-Cities. So I wonder if we could start off by just having you tell me a little bit about when you came to Hanford, and what that first experience of coming to Hanford was like, and why you initially came here.</p>
<p>Cheyney: Okay, well, first of all, at that time, I was going to Spokane Technical and Vocational School, which is now Spokane Community College. And basically, the only way you could get out of class time is to go interview. Well, I was on—it’s three and a half years, and so, I was on the, actually, the last few months of my course. And this guy says, hey, let's get a carpool going, and go down to Hanford. Well, where's that? And he says, well, they're looking for employees. I think it was 13 at that time, for a special program with General Electric. So we get down there, and the first thing, and we got here early, at seven o'clock promptly. We were all escorted back into a room that had separate booths, and we were given time tests from seven o'clock till 12 noon. We were tested on about every kind of conceivable test that I could imagine, but it all related to my field of electronics and instrumentation. So anyway, it was about two weeks later. The ones that were in the carpool with me said they already got their rejection notice. And my teacher--I wasn't one of his favorite ones--and he just says, came to me, and says, well, you'll get yours. And I said, well, I'm sure I will. A month later, I get a call from my grandmother. I was living in Spokane and taking care of two of her apartment houses. And she says, you've got a registered letter. So I went to my teacher, and I said, I need to take my grandmother to the bank. He said, I've never heard of that one before. [LAUGHTER] So he let me go, and I got there, and I had a registered letter from General Electric. I really got excited. And it says, offered me a job. And I went back to the school. I plopped it down to the teacher, and says, well, there, I got my letter. He says, so what? And just turned his head. So, well, that's fine. At least I got proof. And I went to my two other instructors from previous years. They stopped everything. He said, look it. He's the only one out of the whole school's that's been offered a job down in Hanford. I still didn't know what I was getting into. [LAUGHTER] But I figured it was worth it. And we had to agree to the fact to go to three and half years more to CBC to special programs that GE selected. And that was no problem either. And then we worked only an eight hour shift, except on weekends, we could work overtime if that case came up. So basically, that's how I got in the front door. And it's sort of interesting that when I first came down here, my mother wanted to make sure that I got in a decent environment because I'd never cooked or anything. And so, GE, they'd recommended the best place where most go is the Statler Hotel. Well, I thought, well, let's go there. Well, we went in there, and my mother, of course, with me. When she saw the three gals there wearing mini-skirts and the whole thing, she almost ripped my arm off, says this isn't the place for you. I didn't see any problem with it, but she immediately took me up to the parish house, and says, is there somewhere decent that I could live? And she introduced us to this woman that was very motherly, very heavy set, very good cook. And said she'd board and room me. Well, of course, I got out on the project. There was lots and lots of indoctrinations that this is classified work, and you're not to discuss anything whatsoever. And the home then I was staying in, her husband was one of the managers out at D Reactor. And so first thing, he asked me, he says, what do you do out there? I says, I just work out there. He says, I know you can't describe anything, but he says, you can at least say your title. You're not getting yourself in trouble with that. I says, well, are you sure? He says, I wouldn't put you on the spot. And I says, I'm an instrument and control technician. And so, he didn't push me any further. And the one thing, before I left the neighborhood of Spokane, the FBI was checking up on me. And I had neighbors say, what kind of trouble are you in anyway? And I says, what do you mean trouble? And they says, the FBI was out checking on you. And I go, that's great. He says, what's great about it? I says, I think they're interested in me. [LAUGHTER] So that's basically how I got in the front door. And I started in the 300 Area, basically the canning lines. And with GE, you were only in a spot roughly three months to six months, and they rotated you because they wanted you to get the full feel of the different expectations that they had of you, and the way you could handle your so-called position, as far as instrument control calibration of all kinds of instrumentation, which, to me, I found really exciting because it was a new challenge. There was never, seemed like there was never a day that it wasn't something different. And I like that. And the challenges were quite different. And riding that bus for a nickel a day. You couldn't afford to drive anywhere. The only thing is, those buses didn't have air conditioning or anything. And when it started, when they moved me to the K Reactor--first it was B, C Reactors. When you had 100 degree weather, it was no fun after a shift, getting on the bus about 4 o'clock. It's good and hot and everything. About all you could do is just sit there and bear it. I usually just closed my eyes, and just figured, well, I'll get home pretty quick. And I just figured, well, it's good for a common cause. Also at that time, the salary was real good for someone that was just out of a tech school. My dad had a master's degree, was teaching five solid subjects, and the superintendent of schools at Hogan, Montana. And the first year, because I was living with the landlady's, their home, she also made use of me, and took me to grocery stores to help her carry stuff. And she took me to Zale’s and talked me into buying a men's diamond ring, which that's the last thing in the world I was really interested in, but I got talked into it. Well, I go up to see my dad, and he sees that. And he says, is that real? And I says, of course, it's real. But I says, it was stupid that I bought it. And I took it off, and said, you can have it. And he said, well, what kind of money are you making? At that point in time, I had made a little over $2,500 more than he'd made. And that really changed his whole attitude about tech school because when I graduated from school, I had to be in his classes, and I took lots of insults. And when he asked me when I graduated, what are you going to do? I says, I'm not sure yet. And then, when I told him I was going to tech school, he says, you just will be a grease monkey. Well, that changed his whole attitude, that maybe--He says, I just can't see why and how they can pay you that kind of money. I says, Dad, they pay you for what you can do with your hands, too. And from then on, he had a whole different feel about it. So that's getting off of what I was doing in Hanford. But going to the different sites, like I said, the challenges were always different. And I think the thing that really impressed me the most is the feeling of the power and energy that was going on. And especially when I was given the tour to go, first, up to the water treatment plant. That was massive enough. I was told could easily take care of the whole city of Los Angeles. And they showed me a wet well, and in it was all these lights with no insulation or anything. And they're on. I says, how come they don't short out? He says, in pure water, there's no conduction. And the mass of water that was going down through the pumps, and through the reactor core itself, the ground just vibrated. I'd say it was at least a good two city blocks, if not longer. You just feel the rumbling. And it's just a massive power. And you go in the reactor area, you just hear all this rushed water. Another thing that was impressive, you look outdoors at this big million gallon tanks of boiling water coming right off the reactor. It could be 100 degrees outdoors, and it had a 200 foot plume at least. And it really made me think, especially in later years when you start realizing what all is going on. It was a graphite core reactor, the same kind of reactor that Chernobyl had. They were foolish in what they were doing. They weren't using nuclear engineers or physicists, and doing all kinds of dangerous experiments. But they reminded me that when I went in to watch, and a lot of times we referred to it, we're controlling a nuclear bomb. And when the operations, especially at operations, they start pulling rods, waiting for things to go critical, it got real exciting, real quiet. And they had two to three guys watching everything, all the instrumentation to see when things were starting to go critical. And it just really amazed me how smart they were, and how careful they were in their operations. And at the same token, it made you well aware that we're really controlling something really massive. And later, roughly, I'd say about every six months or so, they rotated you. They moved me to the K Reactors. Now those were the two world's largest producing plutonium reactors. And that was even more exciting. And of course, a whole lot bigger, and a whole lot more things going on. And eventually, I don't know if it was because of my interest, or my attitude or what, they gave me the opportunity to go into the irradiation testing group, which was a whole lot more involvement. And that was going into, I won't go into a whole lot of detail. They were putting, I'll say samples, into the core of the reactor during operation for different tests for Atomic International, NASA, and there was a few others. But they had a lot of instrumentation, monitoring, and analyzing what's going on. Of course, because being rotated around, actually, what happened then was I just became journeyman, and General Electric announced that they're phasing out. That was a real scary thing for the simple fact they were laying off thousands of people, not hundreds. And being that I was on their special training program, they had an agreement with the union, only take a certain percentage of us to lay off. And go off, like, they lay off 2,000 workers, they might take three or four of us. But when it got down to the last two weeks at General Electric, I was down into the last group. Now when they put me on that status, then they immediately transferred me out of the K Reactors down to the canning lines. And that's where they actually had, oh, what do I want to say, molten metal for sealing the canisters for the fuel for the reactor. And so, when you knew when you were down there that you were on your way out--Well, on Friday, the last Friday of the second week of GE, I got my lay-off notice. Well, this probably about does it, but I put in my name. I thought, well, I want to stay nuclear. I put in my name for the nuclear bomb testing down in Nevada. I immediately got results back. We'd like to hire you, and the only thing is, they're offering me basically the same salary, but I had to move myself. And I thought, well, to heck with that. The following Monday, so I got a notice on Friday, the following Monday, my supervisor comes to me, and he says, how would you like to work for Douglas United Nuclear? I says, I'd love to work for Douglas United Nuclear. He says, well, you'd be doing the same thing you're doing. And so, tear up your lay-off notice. So I stayed with Douglas United Nuclear. And not to go into a whole lot of details of the same thing, it wasn't long they announced shutting down more reactors. The handwriting was on the wall. You aren't going to be here very long. And so, I put my name in with Battelle Northwest, and I put my name with KEPR TV station, because at school I had earned a commercial FCC license, so I could go that way. I thought, all right. I'll get out of government. I'll go into this. Well, it was on a Thursday night. I got called by both Battelle and by KEPR. And I said, well, I wanted to—to Battelle, I told them I wanted to just check into this one job first. Well, it turned out real quick that that didn't have anywhere near what to offer that Battelle. So I went to Battelle. It was through Battelle, then, I got into a whole lot more avenues of the nuclear field. And they moved me everywhere where they felt that they wanted me or needed me. I worked--first, they were going to move me out in the areas, or that's what they promised me, and the first day on the job, they put me in the 300 Area again in the fabrications department. Well, Battelle's in everything. And the next thing, I was assigned on an engineer. He basically gave you a schematic, or a drawing, of what he wanted, and you had to from there, get everything you need, put it together, wire it up, test it, and turn it over to the engineer. Well, that was really exciting because it was a whole different challenge, including making your own printed circuit boards, which I'd never done. Basically, it's a photographic process, and I've always been interested in that. And so, it wasn't long—they wanted, the engineering department then wanted me, and moved me down to the sand castle. And of course though, when they have a contract that ends, so does the job. But in the meantime, they had the computer lab at the sand castle for the FFTF mock up. And I guess, my understanding was the first time they ever had analog digital computers working together to simulate FFTF. That went great until Governor Dixy Lee Ray came down and removed that job, that responsibility from Battelle. Well, I got moved out into the 300 Area again, and different labs, and HTLTR, PRTR, and all the different ones. But again, every one of them was exciting. Every one was a different challenge. Well, in the meantime, there's a gentleman that got hurt at home. And he worked out at the 200 Areas, and that was top secret work. And so that required having more checks on me. And then when you were approved, you had a blue tag on your badge. The only thing that I really feel comfortable disclosing was the fact that, again, it was really exciting. The big thing was that they assigned you to specific cells only. And no one had the same cells, and no one was-- basically, I was told because this way, you'll never try to put things together. You just do your job, and mind your own business. And that's fine with me. And then, as soon as this gentleman was able to come back to work, then I was put on with, they asked me if I'd like to work at the weather station. That's out at the 200 Areas also. That, I was to work on the telemetry stations. I thought that's really neat because it had weather stations at a 65 mile radius that I traveled every day, checking stations, and setting them up for monitoring radiation, temperature, wind speed, and et cetera. And the only thing is, it was a great adventure, watching, or being at the different areas. And that's when it came to my light, I didn't realize that during the time I was out in the 100 Areas, I don't know when because I never saw it, that they had Nike missile sites. And where that refreshed my memory is when I was out a K Areas one night, on graveyard shift, and I was with a gentleman. And we were outside, and we had just got through with, they had stack flow monitors to see what kind of effluents are going through, to make sure we're staying within limits. And he says, you know, it was really sort of funny. One night, he wouldn't say who, and I can see why, inflated a big air balloon, a weather balloon, and tied a flashlight to it, and set it up. Well, after it went up so far, next thing, a big—I think two military jets came flying over to see what the heck that was flying in the air. So some people had ways of—no one wanted to be identified on that one because they did have missile sites. I found that one out on my weather stations out at the Wahluke Slopes, but they pretty well destroyed everything. And I thought this was really, really, was pretty well covered and protected. Which thank God it was, but we weren't aware of that stuff. So it was full of excitement. And I never knew what I was going to be stuck with the next day. The only thing is, like with Battelle, and that's while I was doing the weather stations, I was watching--one of the sites I had was right out on the Hanford site, and it was right out there where they were starting up Whoops, and they were digging this massive, massive hole in the ground. And we had to set up a weather station there. And so I got really interested in that, and basically, I thought, you know, I've always wanted to see something like this being built from the ground up. So I put my name in there, and three months later I was hired in, and spent the last 27 and a half years there. But that's basically in a nutshell what I was involved with. [LAUGHTER]</p>
<p>Arata: Sounds like you were involved in a lot of different jobs, and I wonder--you mentioned that you worked at B, C, and K Reactors. So I wonder if you could talk just a little bit about what maybe some of your different jobs there were. Whatever you're comfortable with.</p>
<p>Cheyney: Oh, sure. Well, especially in the B, C Reactor Areas, like I say, while I was going to school, you weren't allowed any overtime. But on weekends, you were. Another interesting thing when you're back home, if they wanted you, like, for a reactor goes down, they call you up, you say yes, they send a person out in a car. They pick you up, and take you out there, and they also bring you back home. Some of those jobs, I actually was out at the plant for two days at a time. But one of them, like in the B, C Reactor, especially now that we can go visit and everything, it brought back the recollection of the reactor had gone down, and they were doing repair of thermocouples. That's temperature measurement. And you had to go to the rear face of that reactor in a wetsuit, and, of course, PCs under that, and go in there, and go behind where those tubes are, pull out this little two conductor wire, and take and cut it, splice it, and basically bond it together, and then solder it there. And here you've got water's dripping from 100 feet up. You're trying to heat this thing up enough to make it bond. And then call the control. Now are they getting an indication? And then, of course, you'd have to re-insert it back down into the well it was in. That was one of the things I'll never forget because it was so dark back there and everything. You did not want to be claustrophobic. You could easily touch the back of the wall with your back, and you'd have the tubes in front of you. Of course, the interesting thing there is before anyone ever goes in there after a shutdown, they discharge all those tubes down into 15 feet of water, and you see all this blue going down there below you. That never bothered me either, other than thank God, it's down 15 feet under water. Well, in the K Reactors--the B Reactor, I just had a lot of general routines of, like in the powerhouse, there's all kinds of instrumentation for controlling those big boilers. Of course, that was coal fired. And the water treatment facilities, measuring the pH of the water, and the chemistry that goes into it. And then K Reactors, I got to go in. Now they were putting in the high speed scanning system for measuring temperature. And instead of using thermocouples, they used RTDs. And they were going into, I think it was about the second year I was at K Reactors, that again, they shut down to replace all those. Well, again, I get called, I come out there. It's at midnight. I'm well over 100 feet up in the air running these thermal bulbs down through in between the tubes while there's another guy riding the elevator down to the point of what tube it was to be installed into. And it was sort of relaxing up there. It was interesting, but it just seemed like forever. Another incident—of course, as soon as you finish your college requirements that they put on, I was immediately put on D shift. And it just--I didn't like shift because it was one day a week, swings, days, and graveyards on a continuous cycle. I was with the technician this one day. We were up in full operation at this point in time, but they were wanting to check—they were having problems. And so, he and I were assigned to go into the control room. They had—I won't give the exact number; I'll say there was well over 3,000 pressure gauges called panel gauges. They're monitoring the pressure of the water of the tube itself, and that's 3,000 plus. And this panel, you're in the control room, you hear all this click, click, click, click. And they're all moving. If anything, if any one of them goes over pressure or under pressure, immediately, it dumps that whole complete plant. Everything comes through a massive—you hear lots of equipment slamming shut, and the control rods drop. Well, anyway, I guess I was still considered a trainee at that time. We had to change out one of those little pressure gauges. Behind the panel, it's all full of tubing and wiring. They're all in series with each other, so that means if any one's interrupted, it dumps everything. So to get around that, to replace a gauge, you had to take, you had jumpers. So you put a jumper, and you jumper off that gauge. And then when you're all ready to try to dismantle, and pull it out and put another one, you pull the jumpers out of it. Well, the gentleman that was taking me through this, showing me and telling me how careful, as soon as he pulled the one jumper, boom. The plant went down. [LAUGHTER] Oh no. I don't know what color I turned, but I know that he says, oh no. He went out, he says, we did it, we did it. They says, hold on. They had to check it. And it turned out it was something else, but it happened at the same time that we pulled that jumper. So there was times that it made you plenty nervous because you don't make anyone happy if you dump the plant. You don't get fired, but the embarrassment of it—you try to take a lot more pride in it than that. And so, that's basically, sort of in a nutshell the B, C Reactors. It's really interesting to go out there and look at it now. I certainly encourage anyone that has the opportunity. It brings back a lot of memories. The biggest thing I remember is you go in the control room there, the first one that they let off. You go in the control room there, it looks like a little dinky space. It didn't seem that dinky to me then. But if you go into the K Reactors, it looks like a gymnasium compared to that, as far as the size of the control room and the equipment that was there. So a lot to compare it with, but the things that just always impressed me was you could feel from the tremor of the grounds and everything, that there was massive power. And it had to be to generate that much heat, and have that much steam coming out of those millions of gallons—I don't know exactly what. The only thing that disturbed me, and I questioned it at the time, riding the bus, going past the 200 East Area, a lot of times, the winds would bring down that brownish plume. And it'd come right in the bus, and your nose would burn. And I'd say, isn't that bad for you? Why is it on a big stack, and it's coming down here? Oh, nothing to worry about. Well, thank God, I don't think I ever got anything from it. There was a lot of things that went on that you could question, but you probably wouldn't get much for an answer. In fact, when I—I get bounced around on things—when I was doing the weather system for them, in the winter time, we were given snowmobiles because we did Rattlesnake Mountain, and the whole bit. And so they had their own trailer with the snowmobiles. Well, I had to go into the Two West Area, and immediately, this one guard, he must have been new. He says, pull over there, and don't go anywhere. Well, this is new. And he comes up, he says, sir, I hate to tell you this, but you can't be bringing your recreational vehicles in here. I said, sir, would you mind reading what's on those snowmobiles, and read what's on the trailer? It says property of the Atomic Energy Commission. He looks at it. He thought it was crazy. He says, well, I'm sorry. [LAUGHTER] So you're all the time being tested. But in general, I always considered it probably one of the greatest experiences. I'm really thankful to the good Lord that I worked 44 and a half years. I'm not trying to brag, but I was never unemployed. They kept me plenty busy.</p>
<p>Arata: It sounds like it. It sounds like you had many different jobs.</p>
<p>Cheyney: Well, with instrumentation and monitoring everything under the sun, temperature, pressure, level, et cetera. Even one, that reminded me—not to go on and on and on—but in the 300 Area, while I was down there, they sent me to the so-called bursting facilities. And I thought, now what the heck's that? Well, we'll find out. And I go there, and they had these different cells, and they had high pressure systems. And they take different materials of piping, and they hook up all these apparatuses on both ends. And they put it in a cell, and put on all kinds of monitoring equipment to test pressure, temperature, et cetera. And what they do, when they get ready to test, you get out of there, you go back in the control room, and they run up until that pipe virtually breaks open. And again, for studies. But they had a lot of studies going on before they ever used a lot of material. So it was, like I say, always exciting. I enjoyed it, but you never knew what you were going to be assigned with. And it seemed like they didn't mind sending me around.</p>
<p>Arata: Sounds like it. I wonder if I could have you talk just a little bit about starting in the '60s, and then having this great 44-year career unhampered. Certainly, the technology changed a great deal in that time. Could you talk a little bit about what sorts of technology changes you encountered working there?</p>
<p>Cheyney: Well, sure. It's sort of interesting. When they first put me out in the 300 Area, of course, I was assigned with different technicians almost every day. And anyway, this one technician—and you've could sense when right off the bat, well, you're a fresh one from out of school, so you probably don't know much or anything. And I was given this elderly gentleman, and he takes me to his own little shop area he had. As a matter of fact, it happened to be where the bursting facilities was, and he says, what do you know about recorders? I says, well, I was thinking of electronic recorders, a magnetic tape type recorder. I says, well, if you're talking about magnetic tape recorders, I says, I think I know quite a bit about them. What do you got? He says, well, what do you know about recorders? What do you know about L&N recorder? And I says, not a thing! Can you show me what you're talking about? He brings out this great, big, heavy, old chunk of iron. It's an L&N recorder. It has a galvanometer movement in it. I knew what that was. But I thought, what do you with that piece of junk? I'd use it for a boat anchor. [LAUGHTER] But I didn't say that because I knew it would disrupt him a lot. He says, do you know how to calibrate—or wind your own resistors for the bridge that it requires for it? I says, no. You give me a formula, and I'll work it out. He said, great. So he gives me what values he wanted. Okay. So then he hands me this spool and this wire. He says, all right, make your own resistor. I said, what is this? [LAUGHTER] He says, you've got to make your own resistor. So I kept going down on wire until I got exactly the resistance, cut it off, then I had to treat it and the whole thing. I just followed along with him. And I make these several spools of resistors, and put it in. And then he had me taking, apply a signal to see where the galvanometer would move, and the whole thing. I thought, now just how antiquated can this get? [LAUGHTER] He didn't like it too well or anything, but I thought, I could learn something from everybody. And it was really interesting because as I got out into the K Reactors, well, now they had all, at this time--that time--they had vacuum tube amplifiers. And yes, they had their own bridge circuits and stuff, but you didn't go winding your own resistors or anything. In fact, it all came from the factory pre-certified and et cetera. And so, I saw a big change there in the counting type equipment, and the measuring of temperature. Things changed tremendously. Now in the pneumatic end, that's air-driven instruments, which I never really was fond of. I liked electronics. It was a lot faster. Air-driven, even though that is very accurate for monitoring pressure, and the whole thing, is very slow. You make a move. You wait. Electronics, it's right there. And that was a big change I've seen. And of course, as they got—especially like that K Reactor—so much more massive and everything, they had to be a lot more sophisticated. And so, I could see one heck of a change. And poor old B Reactor was about as old-fashioned as you could get. But it amazes me how they handled the whole thing from the ground up, and we didn't have any major catastrophe. They did have at K Reactors—and I didn't realize the possible danger I was in—they did have where the core did catch on fire. And at least with the monitoring equipment they had, it was where they could respond fast enough to start changing control rods. But it took them a while to get that out. But at least it wasn't like Chernobyl. Chernobyl, they had no chance. In fact, we had videos of--and I'm jumping clear into--where we were shown videos. The fact that when they cut off all the safety systems, they apparently had no knowledge of how fast, when a chain reaction starts, how fast could it be when it goes critical. Because it totally blew everything up, and that's with a graphite core. And unfortunately, people think that, like Energy Northwest out there, that has water as a moderator. There's no graphite whatsoever, a whole different thing. And graphite does burn. And the sad thing is, understand, I've heard that there wasn't a single person that was around Chernobyl that was trying to save the area that is alive today. At least, thank God, we do have a lot more safety concerns. But I don't know if I've totally answered what you're looking for, between the difference, but it was a massive difference. Of course, then when I went over to Energy Northwest, the equipment, as far as recorders, they didn't even have vacuum tubes. Everything's solid state. Pretty much, the current state of the art, or even making changes to be more current, to the more current methods. So it always gave you a different challenge. But I like the changes. And I learned real quick. No matter who, you learn from everyone. And I know my first supervisor, he was sort of like a dad, and he'd, after about two weeks there, he called me in. And he says, I see that you were really raised strict. I says, why do you say that? He says, you don't let anyone disturb you, but you don't come back with any smart aleck remarks. I says, everyone's got something to offer, good or bad. I says, I'm not here for that. I'm here to learn, and I'm here to carry out what you want me to carry out. It was always exciting. And I have no regrets. In fact, most thought that I would never even quit. I quit when I was 66. I figured, well, maybe I should take time out to enjoy life. And I'm glad that I did. I don't miss it. I never tried to think about retirement, or play it into my mind until, I think it was about--well, the last day, I even went out, worked regular assignments until the last four hours. And then, finally, my boss says, well, come on in. There's no use to go any further. And I thought, well, now I can lay everything down, and walk out that gate, and I won't feel like I'm in a pen. [LAUGHTER] It was a great experience.</p>
<p>Arata: It sounds like it. I wonder if you could tell me a little bit about the K Reactor shut down. And I understand there was some talk of maybe starting it back up, and that ultimately didn't happen. Since you worked there--</p>
<p>Cheyney: Right. Well, I heard mostly about that, of course, when I was away from there. And I thought, it was really, really a disappointment. It was really sad. In fact, I think it was pretty much getting into that process when I was down at Battelle. And they were doing some tests out there, and I got to go with an engineer. He wanted me to go out there and help with some equipment. And going in there, everything's stone cold. Everything's stone quiet. Such a massive structure doing absolutely nothing. I thought, what a waste. And what are they going to do? Like I said, I didn't hear a whole lot about it, but it came and really hit home when I went in there, and they're worried about rodents and everything else. That isn't the reactor that I saw. And the excitement that was behind it has just, all is dead. And going back through some of the corridors, and into one of the areas they were experimenting with, just hardly could see around. They had some test equipment. I didn't question exactly what are they monitoring. I'm sure a lot they're looking for, is there any possible contamination concerns or anything? But speaking of contamination concerns, it's just like when any of those reactors had what they call a rupture. That's where a fuel element breaks open, and the material’s going out into that water stream. And what they do is they immediately divert it to, they had a big open area, a pit area where all that high contaminated water went into. And guess what's out there in the winter time? Ducks are swimming in that hot water. And I thought, I wouldn't eat anything around here. [LAUGHTER] But I think there's quite a bit that substantiates all that. In fact, Battelle's doing a lot of research in animals and stuff, and even the materials that they've, the feces material and everything is, like, up in the 5R range, which you wouldn't even want to be near that. And I thought, they've got a lot to learn out there of studying the habitat around there, but I wouldn't want to eat anything. [LAUGHTER] Again, I'm off on another subject. [LAUGHTER]</p>
<p>Arata: That's okay. So overall, I wonder if you could just talk a little bit about any aspects of your work that you found the most challenging, and sort of the most rewarding. Or just overall, how Hanford was as a place to work during the time you were there.</p>
<p>Cheyney: Well, during the time I was there, as far as—I was really impressed with General Electric. They always gave me a feeling of a positive attitude. Also, a very strong feeling that you don't talk about your exact work because it's for the security of the country. And at the same token, I think where it became more rewarding and more relaxing to me is actually when I went to work out at, at that time, Whoops. And at that time, seeing all of the things that go into making a plant, you learn to respect things different. When I went to terminate from Battelle, they says, why in the heck do you want to go there? They're never going to ever operate. I says, well, I'm young enough yet. I want to see what I can learn out of it, and if it don't work--They says, if it don't work, come back here, we'll give you a job. I thought, I bet you will. [LAUGHTER] But I think maybe they were sincere, but I found it really rewarding there. I got involved with--and I never dreamt that I would—is working with robots, going into highly radioactive zones to do monitoring, and to observe what's going on, like steam leaks or anything. So you're not putting anyone in any danger. Out of that, I was surprised, I got an award from, I can't think of the name right now, from the company that was behind it. It was back east, and they sent a plaque awarding me that I contributed to something that basically made things safer, that didn't expose man to. And yet, I found it really exciting because I've always been excited about cameras, and this was working with cameras and with remote control of a little robot. And I made quite a few improvements, and so, I considered maybe that was one of the highlights. It was rewarding. I wasn't expecting anything. I just enjoyed that they let me go on it. And I also worked—I wore two hats in the last years at Energy Northwest, in that I volunteered because they couldn't get anyone else that would go there to write procedures. There was five originally that volunteered, and we all five took on the challenge. And inside of a couple months, it was down to two of us. It ended up, it was down—it was basically myself. And the main reason is, is because you're writing the instructions for that technician to go out and perform a function. If that causes anything like dump the plant, or any kind of danger, you go before the Nuclear Regulatory Commission, and you may be serving time. Well, to protect myself, I always went before engineering, and discussed, and made them put their name on the dotted line with me that, yes, this is right. This is the only way to go about it, or the best way to go about it. And it was rewarding to me from the standpoint that if they needed an extra hand, they'd pull me right off of that, and I was back out on the plant. So I got away from it, just continuing. Like I say, the challenges seemed to never end. And I really, for a while, thought, I don't know, maybe I won't quit. They always teased me that I would be there when they shut the lights out. Well, I'm glad I didn't because getting away from it, as I get older, different medical issues. But I'm still blessed with the fact that I can get around. [LAUGHTER]</p>
<p>Arata: Mm-hm. Is there anything that I haven't asked you about, that we haven't had a chance to hear you talk about that you'd like to share? Any other humorous incidents? Or just anything that stands out in your mind from that time?</p>
<p>Cheyney: Well, it wasn't a humorous incident, but one thing that GE pointed out, well, I guess it was an incident as far as, and of course, it was to teach everybody a lesson, is this one gentleman saw this real neat tool in his eyes. So he decided he'd take it home with him. It turns out it was a contaminated piece of equipment. And so, when they detected that it was missing, all they had to do was they got out their radiation monitors. They had an approximate idea. They could go right to his doorstep. And they went in, and they cut out chunks out of his carpet. Everywhere he'd been in his house, they were cutting out samples. And so I think it was a lesson well learnt. Keep your hands off of it. [LAUGHTER] In a way, I thought it was sort of funny. It's not really funny, though. But taking that kind of, obviously, carelessness, at least it really hit home. It isn't worth it.</p>
<p>Arata: All right. So I wanted to ask you, for general purposes, most of my students were born after the Cold War. They don't remember this time. So what would you like, sort of, that generation or future generations to know about working in Hanford, as this very important aspect of America's place in the Cold War, and winning the Cold War?</p>
<p>Cheyney: Well, I think the main thing is, the big thing is, I'm just trying to figure out how to put it. You shouldn't be afraid of nuclear. If you really know all the facts behind it, and all of the precautions behind it, it is one heck of a rewarding career. And it is something that I think I'm probably a whole lot healthier, and a whole lot that I know that have never had anything to do with nuclear, and yet, my whole life, basically, has been out there. And it definitely is rewarding in regards to the financial side. Well, I can relate it to my older son, when he was graduating, I says, well, what are you going to do? Because I'd never heard him discuss anything. He says, I'm going to be an instrument tech. I said, where'd you get that idea? [LAUGHTER] And he says, well, I want to do what you did, and I want to make the money you've made. And he went to Perry Tech, and he did real well. And I even, through my supervision, of course, was instrumental, and got him on a few outages out here. But he went on down to the only place where you got a permanent job. But again, instrumentation, the same, similar type of equipment for different purposes down at SCH, where it was making silicon wafers for all these integrated circuits. All the latest technology, it's a Japanese firm. They're very stern, very strict. Well, he had the most seniority and everything there, I think it was 12 and a half years. When it came to lay off and cutbacks, because they're very competitive, he was one of the first ones to let go. Now to try to find work, well, he's been able to get on to outages all throughout the country. So, even though he's had nothing there, right now he's in Raleigh, North Carolina. A month ago, he was down in Florida. And he's getting to see country that I haven't seen, and there's a lot of adventures yet, but he's still dealing with nuclear. It’s definitely, it's nothing to be afraid of; it's something to respect. And I'd say it definitely has a lot of opportunity if a person really wants to make the good money. I know, like I say, it's what you can do with your hands. Of course, you have to use your head too, but there's opportunity that you can really do well.</p>
<p>Arata: I want to thank you very much for coming in, and sharing your memories with us. We really appreciate it.</p>
<p>Cheyney: Well, I hope I've contributed something that's--I enjoy talking about what I can talk about it. It's left me with memories I'll never forget. And I thank you for the opportunity.</p>
<p>Arata: Well, we are very happy to have you. I love your description of standing behind B Reactor, and looking down in those kind of cool, glowing--</p>
Location
The location of the interview
Washington State University - Tri Cities
Duration
Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.)
00:50:00
Bit Rate/Frequency
Rate at which bits are transferred (i.e. 96 kbit/s would be FM quality audio)
203 kbps
Hanford Sites
Any sites on the Hanford site mentioned in the interview
D Reactor
K Reactor
300 Area
B Reactor
C Reactor
200 Area
100 Area
Names Mentioned
Any named mentioned (with any significance) from the local community.
Ray, Dixie Lee
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
A name given to the resource
Interview with Edwin Cheyney
Description
An account of the resource
An interview with Edwin Cheyney conducted as part of the Hanford Oral History Project. The Hanford Oral History Project was sponsored by the Mission Support Alliance and the United States Department of Energy.
Creator
An entity primarily responsible for making the resource
Hanford Oral History Project at Washington State University Tri-Cities
Date
A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource
2013-11-12
Rights
Information about rights held in and over the resource
Those interested in reproducing part or all of this oral history should contact the Hanford History Project at ourhanfordhistory@tricity.wsu.edu, who can provide specific rights information for this item.
Date Modified
Date on which the resource was changed.
2016-05-30: Metadata v1 created – [RG]
Subject
The topic of the resource
Hanford (Wash.)
Hanford Site (Wash.)
Hanford Nuclear Site (Wash.)
100 Area
200 Area
300 Area
B Reactor
C Reactor
D Reactor
FBI
General Electric
K Reactor
Secrecy
WOOPS (Washington Public Power Supply System)